EverQuest Lost Dungeons of Norrath Beta NDA Lifted
eqlive.station.sony.com/c...p?id=58326 (http://eqlive.station.sony.com/community/dev_view.jsp?id=58326)
As of September 4th, the Non-Disclosure Agreement for the Lost Dungeons of Norrath Beta is no longer in effect, except that a beta participant's confidentiality obligation shall continue with respect to information concerning the beta program and all feedback and comments (whether from the participant, any other participant or from SOE employees).

Those of you in beta can feel free to discuss the expansion but not the beta program. Thanks for helping out testing the expansion.

Pre-order sales must be pretty weak!

Five whole days before launch too!

Well, still a couple more days notice than SWG had hehe... 8P

Tia

commentary from the monk board
pub147.ezboard.com/fmonkl...1285.topic (http://pub147.ezboard.com/fmonklybusiness43508frm1.showMessage?topicID=41285 .topic)
With the NDA lifted, we can talk about the expantion, but we can't talk about the Beta Process, so I'll do the best I can.

Yes, they were difficult to complete in the 90 minutes. But I do need to point out that you still get points (best loot most likely comes from the points, they didn't really itemize the dungeons) and you still get loot form within the dungeon, even if you cont complete the quest.

They really are quests, you are given a specific goal to complete, if you finish it, you get more points, and more loot, if not, no big deal.

Yes, it really does limit the AFKs. But since the dugeon is only 60-90 minutes long, it shouldn't be that big of a problem. If you have to afk, your group of 5 can still continue while you sit safely elsewhere in the dungeon.

Back to the point. Yes, its difficult, but I wouldn't want it to be easy. The main reason some people couldnt come close to the finish of some dungeons was this. In beta you can play any class you want, not just the class you play on your home server. So, you get people playing a 65 SK in LDoN, when they've only played up to a 50 enchanter, or maybe even a level 20 SK. They did not know how to play their class to its fullest.

I honestly beleive that the dungeon is also tailored to your groups composition, not just level. It'll be more subtle differences than the differences based on level, but they are there. Also, some dungeons do favor certain classes.

Equipment is just as important as it ever was. It does help to have better equiptment, but if you have the best, and the dungeons are too easy for you, go to the harder setting and get better loot.

Skill is also important. Not just your ability to do what you've always done in the past, but your ability to improvise, and be ready to do things you normally wouldn't. You can hack and slash through a dungeon, but it might not always be the best approach.

Also, just a tip, dont bother ressing in the dungeons. If you die, just loot up, buff up and keep going, ressing wastes time and can be done after the dungeon is over. I mean, a corpse can be ressed for 3 hours, and if you die at the very beginning, you'll still have an hour and a half before you can no longer res.

Hope I answered your questions

-Zkhar Runeclaw

Normal is easy. Really easy. Easy like I prefered to tank the mobs rather then let the betabuffed warrior waste my time.

Hard, well, the one time level raid I got to go one was rough. Party due to the fact that we didn't know each other and had to many chiefs, but even then we were losing 2-3 people on each pull of the trash. This was from single mob pulls too~

Where does your corpse go when you die?

Does it stay inside the instanced dungeon, or does it pop outside it?

Just thinking of the times you die due to a LD, and then cant log back in for an hour or two due to internet connection, or whatever, wanting to know where to look for corpse in those circumstances.

Allakhazam interview with Ryan Baker
everquest.allakhazam.com/...story=2196 (http://everquest.allakhazam.com/news/sdetail2196.html?story=2196)

Q: What happens if a player goes link dead while in the dungeon? How will he be able to retrieve his corpse once the dungeon expires?

RB: Once the dungeon expires, your corpse is kicked out to the zone-in point. If a player goes linkdead while in a dungeon and the dungeon expires, he’ll be kicked out to that same point.

(goto link for full interview)

"Also, just a tip, dont bother ressing in the dungeons. If you die, just loot up, buff up and keep going, ressing wastes time and can be done after the dungeon is over."

OK, I understand your point perfectly, but have a question. Can you all bind at the dungeon entrance? If not, then those who can't bind themselves nearby will have a long run from the nearest city (or PoK). In that case, rezzing is probably quicker.

Tat

The zone ins are all in old world zones. For instance, if you do a Miragul's adventure, the zone in will be in Everfrost, so yes, you can bind in them. They also added soulbinders to all of the Wayfarers camps as well.

"For instance, if you do a Miragul's adventure, the zone in will be in Everfrost, so yes, you can bind in them."

Yes, but those who can't bind themselves would have to bind in Halas.

"They also added soulbinders to all of the Wayfarers camps as well."

That's the answer there, I'm guessing. If you can't bind yourself, you use the soulbinders at the camps. I read somewhere else that they're adding a way to hop between the wayfarer's camps easily.

So it looks like they've got this problem covered pretty well. The main thing that bugs me, is you pretty much NEED to bind near the dungeon then. I usually am bound somewhere that I don't like to change, a place to farm tradeskill stuff, etc. Having to change bind spots all the time will be annoying, but oh well =(

Tat

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Normal is easy. Really easy. Easy like I prefered to tank the mobs rather then let the betabuffed warrior waste my time.[/quote]

That might be your gear talking? I've heard other folks say they found them quite difficult.

Normal adventures were pretty similar to tier 1 PoP ... trash mobs hit for high 300s, named mobs hit for 500s, and if the goal of the adventure was to kill someone, he'd hit for mid 800s.

Here are some summary notes I posted on my guild's webpage, perhaps they will be interesting to you as well:

I haven't tested in the past week, but before that tested about 6 different group dungeons (at least one at each wayfarer post) and one raid.

The group leader forms a group. The group leader than goes to the Wayfarer and selects a normal or difficult adventure. I never did a difficult one, but supposedly you get more points. My goal was just to pass the normal adventure. The Wayfarer gives you an adventure based on the number of people in your party and their levels - it is NOT based on classs.

Your adventure seems to be one of three types. Collect X number of pieces, find X person and clear an escape path, or find and kill X mob.

One of you asked if you can just camo back to the goal to mitigate the timer. We tried that on a "rescue mission", and we're told that we had to clear an escape path. So no, not really. And sometimes the "boss" mob you have to kill won't spawn till you kill a certain number of mobs in the zone.

Once you have accepted the adventure, you have 30 mins to find the starting point for the adventure. This is plenty of time to get there AND have everyone buff up before zoning in. Once the FIRST person zones into the adventure, your timer starts for the adventure itself (60-90 mins typically). So the SMART people wait until everyone gets to the adventure zone and all zone in at once. The impatient pick up groups you sometimes get in test don't do this, and so you get the joy of timing out and failing.

Then you zone into the adventure itself. Once you have zoned in, someone can go LD and when they come back in they'll still be able to go back into the instanced dungeon. You can also zone out to clear agro and still zone back into your dungeon. If you die, you can either get rezzed in, or you can run back and rejoin your group. Note - be careful if you hunt near the entrance, its really easy to zone out if you're near the zone in...really really really easy.

DPS is of course important in any adventure, but from what I've experienced not essential. The only thing that seems to be essential is some form of slow (bard/Bst is sufficient), and some way of single pulling or crowd controlling. FD pulling is the SUCK in many dungeons due to stupid annoying casters. Indoor harmony and mezzing works much better. Root ghetto mezzing is fairly useless due to tight corners and caster issues.

As Spiritual mentioned, druid CH (our 58 level one) is sufficient healing even if you don't have a cleric. In fact, I rarely had a cleric on any of my adventures.

I passed two of the six dungeons I tried with what I would consider a not-"perfect" groups. One had 2 SKs, one beastlord, a magician, and myself. So no KEI (don't even try to get ahead of time, it will just get debuffed) and no cleric. And we still passed. The other had Cleric, SK, myself, magician, enchanter, and ranger who didn't know how to play his class (fake ranger) so couldn't even track. I'd say mobs hitting for Tier One level is about line - they really don't hit that hard except in one crazy dungeon off of SRo.

Other comments:

-Decide loot stuff rules/numbers of time. The timers are very very strict, don't want to be messing with that stuff to get an oh so not exciting +2 augmentation item.
-Get your treasure chests and stuff after you finish your adventure goal - you can stay in the dungeon an extra 30 mins before ported out.
-Make friends with your local rogue, tracker or eye of Zomm to find your end goal, or you'll never get done in time.
-On average, I get about half an AA point in a non-raid 72 min adventure. So average XP, nothing exciting nothing horrible.
-As far as charm, there were some animals in dungeons but none low enough I could actually charm them. However, there were a few NPCs that conned indifferent to me and when I hailed them they became my "enchanter like" pet (i.e. couldn't control them) for a period of time. That was fun.

Normal mobs hitting for 300? I assume that is for a group of 60+ players. Did anyone test LDoN dungeons with lower level groups?

Second, from what I am reading and hearing from many forum and player sources, enchanters are mandatory in ALL cases for LDoN groups. CC > Slow. Also, thief skills are mandatory.

Any comments on this?

Yes, that was with a level 65 group.

I wouldn't call CC mandatory at all -- though lull of some sort helps a lot, we handled pulls of 3 or 4 with a slower just fine.

Edit for clarification.

I did a level 25 adventure with no enchanter. It was pretty easy. I played cleric and had crappy gear, no mana regen. Party had to sit and wait for me to med constantly. But then again... that's what level 25 is like.

LDoN is a nice step for EQ, but I think it's a bit too late for it to really turn EQ away from the loot whoring it's become. Nothing can really be done about the past timesinks and quests. So casuals I think will always be considered lesser creatures just because their gear is subpar. *shrugs* I didn't get much of a chance to beta-test it though. Money's tight and I had to cancel EQ this month. And SWG is holding my interest quite capably right now... that being said however... here's my beta experience.

I logged on to the beta and began fooling around with the betabuff command since I didn't have time to wait for a character copy. I decided to see how well I could play a level 65 cleric. Most of my problems early on came from fixing my spell list and organizing my spell book.. and then someone told me about a command that would fill your spellbook with all the spells, so I used it and it undid everything I'd already done....

When I finally did get to try out my first adventure, I joined a group and was asked if I'd ever played a cleric before. I have... just not at level 65... *chuckles* I didn't lie... they just didn't ask the right question.

So we gather a group (Cleric, Monk, Chanter, Warrior, Druid, Shaman - all 65), get the adventure, taking a normal difficulty one for starters. On the way to the dungeon the group gets disbanded via some bug and regroup outside the entrance to the adventure in Oasis. The warrior LD's and we decided to press on anyway with the monk tanking.

Our quest was to gather 30 of these vestments for the Wayfarer's and return them. Time limit was 90 minutes and we spent a good amount of that time running around killing stuff and no one ever came close to dying, even during some sudden afk's that cropped up. The chanter brought along a charmed pet from the very beginning which made for a few tense moments during pulls with several mobs and charm breaking.

It was fun and I brought out my summoned hammer, bugging the chanter for haste and the shaman for melee buffs. Not many clerics get Ferine Avatar. *chuckles* The astute shaman surmised that I must play a rogue main since I bothered him so much for FA.

Time was running out and we had cleared all the mobs down a dead end path and we needed just one more vestment, but weren't sure we could make it back in time to the other tunnels where there were more mobs... I jokingly suggested that the chanter's pet might have it... it was looking at me supsiciously after that... and so we killed the chanter pet and got our last vestment with much laughter.

We did kill one named mob and the loot was ok, but nothing a character equipped in VexThal or higher would really want. We didn't clear all the chests/crates and did not wait til the end to do it. We just did it as we went along. That was the end of my first adventure.

I then spent some time makign a betabuff level 65 rogue which had 4k hitpoints unbuffed... which is almost as many hitpoints as I have raid buffed. The rogue was near 7k hp with buffs and came with Khalshazar and Epic.

My group went in on an asssasination mission (shaman, druid, rogue, necro, shadowknight - all 65). We spent some time clearing some paths and then the shadowknight went LD and I ended up tanking while we had six mobs in camp. Necro was kiting one... shaman/druid were root parking and healing me. It was fun... but we waited for the SK to come back and he never did... so we just gave up on the adventure and I ran around exploring it messing around with whatever crates and chests I could find.

Got a massive train after me at one point and kept running in circles when I realized what AA buttons I had made earlier. One of them was Escape! Which MY rogue does not have... so I ran as fast as I could and ducked around a corner with over twenty mobs chasing me down and hit escape and left them all confused and befuddled.

That was fun too... but then I decided I was done exploring and logged out for the night. I never did get to see the adventure points loot, but I did get a few augmentation links and they seem to be a fun new toy/tool to add to the game.

One thing I realized about clerics... is that it really doesn't take any skill at all to play them once you get the basics down and have the common sense to right click on the spells to read their descriptions. Heh.

commentary over at the mage board
forum.magecompendium.com/...sc&start=0 (http://forum.magecompendium.com/tower/viewtopic.php?t=7325&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)
1) (Raiding): Do you have to fight to the encounter, or is it like zoning into AD's lair (i.e. no clearing).


You do have to fight, but as there is a timer running during the raid (usually 90min) you won't have to clear too much. Also it is not as boring as let's say.. uh... Vex Thal or PoAir. There are some nice scripts running during those raids which will keep everyone busy. Well, if everyone is NOT awake you will wipe within minutes... Don't worry, it will be some great fun and it will teach you NOT to afk at all, hehe

...

on the spells from what ive seen they range from 20+ points - well not seen a higher than 44 and that was 48points

...

Spell go up to 400ish points IIRC.

I had about 500 points in the Mistmoore theme, got to unlock some really cool stuff.

once you get a certain number of points more items started showing. For me at level 65, I started seeing loot at 250 points, but they've changed how it's done since then.

Now, you can see the next "tier" of loot beyond what you have the points for. I guess it's sort of the proverbial carrot on the stick, something to keep going for.

Also, at least in the case of augments, once you reach the level 65 stuff, you aren't done, it goes up from there. At around 400ish points I had unlocked level 65 Augments, but I kept adventuring after that, and unlocked more (better, and more expensive of course) level 65 augments.

Edit - At this point, I've only unlocked items up to level 58 (Augments are cheaper than items), and can view lvel 63 items, so I can't say if this holds true for level 65 items, but I would imagine it does

...

the points you recieve are based on two factors:

1. Your level
2. The difficulty selection of the adventure (Normal or Hard)

At level 65, a Normal adventure yields 51 points, a Hard adventure yields 71 (ish, I may be off here, I didn't do many Hard adventures).

Number one actually seems to depend on the whole group's average level. If your entire group isn't 65, you won't get the full 51 points.

Oh, something I totally forgot about that is very cool: The Leader Board!

The server keeps track of everyone's adventure records and posts them to a board. You can break it down to see who has the most total wins, or who has the highest percentage success rate. You can further break this down for each individual dungeon theme. (i.e. Most Mistmoore wins, I was ranked #17 in beta, since Mistmoore Caverns was my primary adventure focus)

"Yes, that was with a level 65 group.

I wouldn't call CC mandatory at all -- though lull of some sort helps a lot, we handled pulls of 3 or 4 with a slower just fine."

Well, the good news there is, that bodes well for Druids and Mages, as DSs will come in very handy. A room full of mezzed mobs, and one slowed mob on the tank, and a DS is nice, but no big deal. With 3 or 4 mobs on the tank (or 2 tanks), and now your DSs are doing some decent DPS.

Tat

from same mage board link
---------------------------
I confirmed today item rewards do keep on going up even after level 65 stuff, if you continue to get points. A friend of mine has 1400 points in the Mistmoore theme, he had unlocked level 65 stuff and nothing else was showing up. We were about to call it quits on Mistmoore when we did one last adventure, which pushed him over the edge and unlocked a new level of loot.
===================================


my commentary:
sigh... saving points for the "unknown" sigh

<span style="color:red;font-family:verdana;font-size:medium;">Originally Submitted by: Balise</span>
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>One thing with the expansion I hope people will realize is that you do not need the -trio- to succeed.

For groups of 60-65'th level players druids are needed to fill in for many roles, whether it be CC, healing, DPS, buffing, or just a small portion in all those roles.

Root parking will have to be refined if you want to be good at it as there is little space to get the mobs parked away from the group, healing is minimal with slowed mobs on normal difficulty, but with a 3-5 pull comming in (because no monk or lull puller) quickheals will be needed. DPS is doable so long as your tank is able to taunt enough. Tracking is a benefit to keep an eye out for the named or other unique spawns, but rogue scouting, eye of zomm, or ranger tracking is obviously supperior.

From a druid's perspective I was needed and able to contribute to almost any group going that didnt have a 6th member. The betabuffed druids were really lacking in appropriate equipement and AA's so not many people were playing druids on the beta server and the ones that were were druids that were copies of their mains from the main servers so you were almost gaurenteed to get a group as a druid because there were simply so few around. But even with that advantage I was able to stack really well with another druid in a couple groups even with a cleric as main healer.

It all depends on your group makeup how you will employ a druid's various abilities as a mellee heavy group with a cleric healing can take many hits and with no enchanter/bard having a DS up increased DPS a noticeable bit. On a group with two enchanters, pally, druid (me), SK, cleric, we had the two enchanters get pets and we tore up the normal level dungeon. There are many different ways to employ our spells in these dungeons that allow us to really shine in terms of our versatility.

The monotony in the dungeons is a downside after your first couple runs through, but overlookable.

My advice to Druids looking to really get into the dungeon crawling is to be very aware of all the possible ways you can contribute to the group you are in or looking to get into. If you are able to successfully CC for your group on a 3-5 pull (sometimes very hard to do in these small areas), or heal the whole group with/without a slower, or add in dps significantly while keeping mobs snared and assist heals going, then you will be wanted in many groups after

On charming, I didnt really notice many petable mobs (some npc's that when hailed will latch onto you as an enchanter-type pet), but it doesnt really matter because we have many other effective ways to contribute.

These dungeons are not a boring "camp" that you would do in PoV or PoS, pulling mobs singular with maybe an add and resting when needed and continuing. If one member dies, you res and keep going while that member is med'n back up. If your cleric dies, the druid has to take over healing till the cleric is able to run back (bind outside of the dungeon exit/entrance is recomended). You are not able to stop for long (if at all) due to the time limit, so the druid in many cases must pickup for whatever group member is out of commision at the time.

Group Regen and (group/single) DS (depending on group makeup) I found to be very usefull as it helped notcieably with healing when almost all members of the party would take a hit here and there that the regen would soon heal or the DS would add some damage.

Anyways, I had not as much time as some to test the expansion due to only being able to play in the middle of the night/early morning, but from what I was able to test and feedback on I think this expansion will be very entertaining for all playstyles. Of course it will not hold everyone out of all the other areas of EQ, because it is simply not as much content as the other expansions, but it adds something to EQ that was definately lacking from the begining.

<a href="http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=47458" target="top"><span style="color:maroon;"><strong>Balise</strong></span></a>[/quote]

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>One thing I realized about clerics... is that it really doesn't take any skill at all to play them once you get the basics down and have the common sense to right click on the spells to read their descriptions. Heh. [/quote]

Yeah, about like rogues. :p

*chuckles* Very true. Especially as the game currently stands. I've hit the glass ceiling where I can't really advance anymore and even warrior tanks have no problems keeping aggro from me. So I just turn auto-attack on and hit backstab when I care to remember to. I got SWG to keep me happy though.

*shrug* it's easy to be a cleric in the same way that it's easy to be a druid, imo.

- Xylem, E'ci

Well i played a cleric most of beta (no way in hell was I going to play a beta buffed <strong>heffer</strong> druid).

I found that crawls were pretty easy yes on normal but still fun :)

One tip though.. learn where the places are which you need to go. Some arnt so obvious to find and when your given an adventure your on a timer to actually get to the zone aswell as complete it.

Theres a nice feature that you buy stones which you give to mages at each camps which port you directly to the other camps (no running). These stones are bought with adventure points though costed 1 on beta.

Tils

I remember a while back we were all having this discussion about buffs and what a bad/good idea it would be it they were stripped....
I haven't seen anything really indicating yes or no either way..anyone have a comment? If we decide to get buffs BEFORE will it be pointless?

It was just a player's idea, not something actually in the game.

It is recommended you get buffed outside, before you go in the dungeon.

I only played my 65 druid during beta, and here is some info, it is very trivial info but I still post it.

Be open for different roles
==============================

I am an evocation specialized druid,
but on 70% of all adventures I was main healer.
With a slower in group I could nuke 1-2 Summer's Flame on a mob and keep group alive without
ever going under 60% mana. (I have 200ish AA, and mana preservation and improved healing IV).

LDoN normal adventures are very easy compared to PoP zones. Regular mobs hit 300ish. Crowd control and slow
is not really needed. Only important thing is, have lots of DPS in your group or you fail.
(for elemental/PoTime equipped people it is way too easy, for casual players it is sometimes too hard to keep up)

Spells used:
===============

Preparation
-----------

Porting people is not required. With PoK stones and TL NPCs, moving around in old world is very fast.

Before adventure starts, I always buffed flight of eagles, nine and legacy of bracken to claim buff slot.
Protection of Seasons is usually not needed, only cast if there are enough buff slots available.


Dungeon
-------

* I always casted summer's flame - overall its least resisted spell and we have nice mana preservation items on it.
It is still recommended to have mobs maloed or hand of ro in.

* When I was primary healer I avoided Karana's Renewal and just casted Nature's infusion, unless tank had 8k+ HP.
In LDoN you move alot and pull 3-4 mobs, if tank is at 50% and a pulls 4 mobs you will get
aggro (yes lots of tanks are scared to build AE aggro). Or tank is at 40% and some @#@§## sets off a trap. I'm not saying you should avoid KR, I'm just saying keep in mind when we are healers there is usually no rezzer around, and a death is REALLY bad without rezzer. (wait for adventure to finish + 30 min to get corpse out of zone).
During beta people didn't care about taking unrezzed deaths, but this will change on live servers for sure... This could even make us VERY unwanted as primary healers if no paladin is in group.

* If you are in a pickup group there will always be someone setting off a trap at worst possible moment. I usually
had Spirit of Wood/RadiantCure3 ready for that...

* Sometimes tank can't keep 3 mobs aggroed, I use AE root on pull then (if no bard/enc around)

* Animals in dungeons seem to be immune to charms. ("This NPC cannot be charmed").

* Takish has alot of summoned mobs.



--Zorx

I'm wondering... since mobs don't hit THAT hard if avoiding slow, and using stacked damage shields might be a better way to go.