View Full Forums : DOT Table


Cassea
10-09-2005, 11:58 AM
This has been updated to include most of the high end nukes.

Everquest Druid Damage Table
<TABLE cellSpacing=3 cellPadding=5 width=756 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD width="30%" height=26>Spell


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>Level


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>Damage


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>Mana


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>Ticks


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>Total


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>Ratio


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>DPS


</TD><TD width="9%" height=26>MPS


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Flame Lick

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>12


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>7


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>28


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2.33


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0.67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0.29


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Stinging Swarm

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>14


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>32


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>71


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>320


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.51


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.33


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1.18


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Creeping Crud

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>24


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>49


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>107


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>9


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>441


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.12


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>8.17


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1.98


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Immolate

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>29


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>32


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>72


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>9


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>288


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.33


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1.33


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Drones of Doom

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>34


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>71


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>145


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>9


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>639


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.41


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>11.83


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2.69


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Drifting Death

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>44


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>91


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>189


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>910


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.81


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>15.17


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3.15


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Vengeance of the Wild

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>49


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>124


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>180


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>744


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.13


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>20.67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Winged Death

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>53


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>122


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>229


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1220


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.33


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>20.33


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3.82


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Vengeance of Nature

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>55


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>174


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>316


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1044


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3.30


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>29.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>8.78


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Immolation of Ro

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>62


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>144


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>295


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>11


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1584


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.37


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>24.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.47


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Swarming Death

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>63


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>224


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>357


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2240


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6.27


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>37.33


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.95


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Vengeance of Tunare

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>64


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>305


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>345


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1830


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.30


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>50.83


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>9.58


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Sylvan Embers

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>65


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>142


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>315


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>11


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1562


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.96


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>23.67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.77


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Immolation of the Sun

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>178


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>358


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>11


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1958


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.47


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>29.67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.42


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Wasp Swarm

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>68


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>289


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>454


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2890


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6.37


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>48.17


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>7.57


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Vengeance of the Sun

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>69


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>412


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>454


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2472


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.44


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>68.67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>12.61


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Wrath of Nature (Epic 1.0)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>50


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>55


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>30


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1650


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>DNA


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>9.17


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Tempest Wrath (Blade of the Tempest)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>DNA


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>75


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>20


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1500


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>DNA


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>12.50


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Choking Spores (Sporecaller)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>50


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>58


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>580


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>DNA


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>9.67


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>0.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Ancient Glacier Frost

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>70


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2042


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>405


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2042


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.04


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>204.20


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>40.50


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Dawnstrike

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>70


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2125


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>482


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2125


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.41


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>212.50


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>48.20


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Glitterfrost

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>70


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1892


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>381


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1892


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.97


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>189.20


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>38.10


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Solstice Strike

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>69


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2201


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>494


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2201


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.46


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>220.10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>49.40


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Ancient Chaos Frost

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>65


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1450


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>290


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1450


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>145.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>29.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Tempest Wind (3 hits)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>66


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1168


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>623


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3504


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.62


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>116.80


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>20.77


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Tempest Wind (4 hits)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>66


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2336


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>623


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4672


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>7.50


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>233.60


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>31.15


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Sylvan Fire

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>65


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1761


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>435


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1761


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.05


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>176.10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>43.50


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Winters Frost

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>65


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1357


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>305


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1357


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.45


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>135.70


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>30.50


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Summer’s Flame

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>64


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1600


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>395


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1600


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.05


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>160.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>39.50


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Winters Storm (3 hits)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>61


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>850


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>500


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2550


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>5.10


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>85.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>16.67


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Winters Storm (4 hits)

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>61


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1700


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>500


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>2


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3400


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>6.80


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>170.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>25.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Ancient Starfire of Ro

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>60


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1350


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>300


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1350


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.50


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>135.00


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>30.00


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Moonfire

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>60


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1132


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>263


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1132


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>4.30


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>113.20


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>26.30


</TD></TR><TR><TD width="30%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>Wildfire

</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>59


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1294


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>335


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>1294


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>3.86


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>129.40


</TD><TD width="9%" bgColor=#ffffff height=26>33.50


</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Prepared by Cassea (with help) on 10 October 2005 using data from the Luci online database and assuming maximum level for each dot.

Notes: Damage Over Time (DOTS) on top, Direct Damage (Nukes) after. I did not calculate all nukes because you would use only a select few nukes and chain cast them while there is an advantage to DOT stacking. I spaced nukes 10 seconds appart to account for recharge and cast time. While this is not perfect it is close enough to get a comparison. Specialized nukes were not included.
Ticks: 1 tick = 6 seconds Ratio: Damage caused per 1 point of mana DPS: Damage per second MPS: Mana used per second

Fenier
10-09-2005, 12:09 PM
Missed Wrath of the Tempest (Blade of the Tempest) and Choking Spores (Sporecaller)

RuadhTheRed
10-09-2005, 12:37 PM
This is an excellent thread, Cassea. I'm moving it to the Spell forums for reference and using your ratios as I update our individual spell listings on TDG.

I'm confused on why people are debating on "which is better, dots or nukes." Nukes are good for shorter fights when you need burst damage and dots are good for longer fights (they do more damage per mana when they run their full course.) This is assuming a single target. If you are facing a larger number of targets, AE nukes are a better option when you can easily kite.

Am I missing something?

- Ruadh The Red
TDG Content Manager

Cassea
10-09-2005, 01:36 PM
Missed Wrath of the Tempest (Blade of the Tempest) and Choking Spores (Sporecaller)

Added those. Please check the numbers and thanks for the info!

-Cass

Mellen
10-09-2005, 02:56 PM
Think (will double check in game later) that the total dmg is actually (displayed ticks + 1) x dmg

Has something to do with the way ticks are counted... scirocco posted about it a long time ago and probably some others. Not even sure if it's something that happens only if timed properly or somethign that happens 100% of the time but I know I've counted the dmg reports and saw it for myself before.

Cassea
10-09-2005, 03:59 PM
I'll test that later and if we get a free tick (crosses fingers) I'll add extra tick to all of these.

Thanks

-Cass

Cassea
10-09-2005, 04:03 PM
This is an excellent thread, Cassea. I'm moving it to the Spell forums for reference and using your ratios as I update our individual spell listings on TDG.

I'm confused on why people are debating on "which is better, dots or nukes." Nukes are good for shorter fights when you need burst damage and dots are good for longer fights (they do more damage per mana when they run their full course.) This is assuming a single target. If you are facing a larger number of targets, AE nukes are a better option when you can easily kite.

Am I missing something?

- Ruadh The Red
TDG Content Manager

The debate, if you want to call it that, is whether you are better off just nuking or root-rotting. Each seems to have advantages and disadvantages but IMHO it boils down to this...

If you will get 90%+ of DOT damage you are better off dotting otherwise Nukes (Rains) may be better.

I wonder if people prefer nuking because it's fast "impressive" damage that the group can see rather than the slow but steady "un-noticed" damage?

We all love the big booms and both types can be affected by crits.

Any thoughts?

-Cass

Marpedod
10-09-2005, 05:59 PM
Can't forget the advantage of being able to do damage without the potential of breaking root

Soloun
10-09-2005, 06:02 PM
I think there is alot to the argument that people like to nuke so it can be seen that they are adding to the group, but then there are often groups where doting is simply not the way to go as mobs are going down way to fast. It comes down to what works best at the time.

Nice table with kewl info, thanks for going to the trouble Cass.

Cassea
10-09-2005, 09:08 PM
Think (will double check in game later) that the total dmg is actually (displayed ticks + 1) x dmg

Has something to do with the way ticks are counted... scirocco posted about it a long time ago and probably some others. Not even sure if it's something that happens only if timed properly or somethign that happens 100% of the time but I know I've counted the dmg reports and saw it for myself before.

You were correct and I have adjusted the table so each dot reflects this "extra" tick. Seems to happen everytime so far for me.

Makes the Dots even better :)

-Cass

Fenier
10-09-2005, 09:32 PM
I do not have a level for Blade of the Tempest. Sporecaller min level is 50.

Cassea
10-10-2005, 12:13 AM
Seems the extra tick does not apply to clickie items - at least I only got the 30 ticks with Epic 1.0

Anyone confirm?

-Cass

Cassea
10-10-2005, 12:13 AM
I do not have a level for Blade of the Tempest. Sporecaller min level is 50.

Thanks Fenier. Will add next update.

Was thinking of doing the same list for nukes if any would find that usefull.

-Cass

Winenose
10-10-2005, 03:49 AM
Nukes would be interesting too.

But much more interesting is how high is max crit chance with either?
And.. how exactly do crits work with either? For DoTs it's straight double damage and with nukes it's (damage * 2.25)?

voronus
10-10-2005, 05:03 AM
And.. how exactly do crits work with either? For DoTs it's straight double damage and with nukes it's (damage * 2.25)?

Nukes is damage *2.25 at maximum! Unlike dots, nuke crits are on a sliding scale and will usually not do the maximum damage.

Cassea
10-10-2005, 08:50 AM
Well I left out crits and all of that because it would be too hard to do as most of the percentages are speculation (IE SOE does not tell you exact percentages)

Sure we can guess (and many do) but I feel it's easier to compare apples to apples when we use the base numbers.

If I have the time this week I'll add Nukes to the chart. There is also an ecellent spreadsheet chart that can be used to calculate your exact numbers posted somewhere on the board but to me honest, it requires you to put in alot of data and the number of variables so great that it would defeat the very purpose of this chart.

My intent was to compare spells and see which are worth casting and which are not. Since "Dot crits" affect all dots it does not matter in the chart since all I wanted to see was which dots were best to use and which should be put at the back of the book.

As you can see by the numbers both Wasp and Swarm are darn near identical in mana/damage ratio (6.37 vs 6.27) while Wing at 5.33 drops off a bit. Sun at 5.47 seems better than Wing until you realise that Sun is fire damage and not affected by focus items that affect only magic.

So to keep these charts usefull for everyone it prob is best to just keep them basic and let you guys adjust the numbers based on any special equip you may have.

-Cass

Aelfin
10-10-2005, 01:07 PM
nuke data can be found at:
http://home.comcast.net/~aelfin/downloads/InstantSpellData.xls

it's an evolving spreadsheet i take a look at from time to time. it let's you enter various focus and aa values and gives ya info based on static casting and "dynamic" --- taking into account manaregen.

you can type in stance percents if ya want, too.

only the druid info has been updated with any recency. mage/wiz/cleric data is prolly way out of date.

EDIT:
also, your table doesn't show DPS. generally speaking the following are close:
Flame Lick 0.67
Stinging Swarm 5.33
Creeping Crud 8.17
Immolate 5.33
Drones of Doom 11.83
Drifting Death 15.17
Vengeance of the Wild 20.67
Winged Death 20.33
Vengeance of Nature 29.00
Immolation of Ro 24.00
Swarming Death 37.33
Vengeance of Tunare 50.83
Immolation of the Sun 29.67
Wasp Storm 48.17
Vengeance of the Sun 68.67
Wrath of Nature 9.17
Tempest Wrath 12.50
Choking Spores 9.67

not completely accurate as they don't take the cast time of the spell itself into account

Dayuna
10-10-2005, 02:59 PM
For the debate of nukes vs. DoTs...

In groups, I generally will use Vengence of the Sun if the fight is gonna last more than 30-45 sec and nuke once VotS is on. Otherwise, you don't get the full efficiency of the DoT.

Soloing, I prefer using only DoTs unless quad kiting. Mana efficiency is everything when soloing. The more free dots you have the more mana you can spend stacking other dots. Potime orb (if you have access to one) is <3 <3 <3 for soloing, and the epic 1.0 at a minimum will prevent mob regen from undoing your handiwork if you need to med on the fly.

I tried doing something out of boredom a few days ago. I did a chart that plotted time, what was cast, and how much damage was being done during a theoretical fight. Started with Wasp Swarm, added in Swarming Death, added in Vengence of the Sun, then chain nuking and refreshing DoTs as needed (VotS was the only one really). Unmodified and assuming 0 delay between a spell recast delay going off and the next spell being cast, druid dps maxed at 386dps between 17 and 47 seconds into the fight (I'm pretty sure that's the range I measured dps over).

Kamion
10-10-2005, 11:46 PM
DoT vs. nukes...

When grouping with a high end warrior dots are nice... You can't nuke while mob is just engaged because you'll draw aggro, but dots are lower aggro initially. Even though dots usually end up to be more aggro, warriors agro, unlike knights, escalates on a steep curve over a short time due to procs. Wasp swarm is nice in groups even if it doesn't get the last tick or 2 in, will still do more damage (on average) for less mana with last casting time than any nuke. Also keep in mind wasp virtually never resists.

In groups I usually do hand on inc, than click SD orb, than cast vengence of the sun than nukes. If I'm low on mana I'll do tempest wrath after sun than vengence of tunare.

On raids I don't even waste spell gems for vengence dots. I usually do immo, wasp, swarming, and tempest. All of these (save tempest) do more avg damage per cast than our nukes, under most conditions. The lower cast times are very nice as well, especially since we're usually casting damage spells between our heal and cure casts.

Tempest wind has great average damage per cast, but in xp groups it's efficiency isn't all that great. However, I usually use it on nameds where high dps is nice to have (ie MPG trials.) On raids I use it on any mobs where I want to pour on the dps, however on some raid mobs resists can be a problem - due to the fact CR debuffs suck ass.

Tenielle
10-11-2005, 01:51 PM
In groups I usually do hand on inc, than click SD orb, than cast vengence of the sun than nukes. If I'm low on mana I'll do tempest wrath after sun than vengence of tunare.

In most group settings, I find that immo debuffs the mob enough for reliable fire nukage. I hit immo on inc and sw orb immediately after follwed by fire nukes nukes (unless in a fire resistant zone).

When soloing, I'm all about dots. I try to make the most of the free mana damage from the sw orb by pulling as many mobs as I can handle and swapping between mobs.

Sometimes I pull several cleric mobs in PoF for fun. I've had 7 locked down before. This was probably the best use of the sw orb I've ever had. The ridiculous part isn't their nuking or healing, it's when they get LoM the only spell they can cast is dispell, and they use it on each other like mad. I hear a lot of people say PoF is lame because it's boring, pull a bunch of clerics and you might change your mind.

Fenier
10-11-2005, 04:33 PM
I strongly perfer DoTs to nukes in most settings. I get heavy heavy milage out of my Blade of the Tempest and Orb of Clinging Death. If I really want to save mana, and the time it takes to kill the mob is not an issue, I may also hit the creature with Wrath of Nature, and Choking Spores (from Sporecaller).

In group settings I typically click Both the Orb and the Sword less the dps of the group is exceptionally high.

If mana is an issue, I use Anicent Chaos Frost. If its not, lately I have been favoring Dawnstrike.

-Fenier

Nimchip
10-12-2005, 04:58 AM
its Wasp Swarm btw, you have it as Wasp Storm :(

Cassea
10-12-2005, 11:30 AM
its Wasp Swarm btw, you have it as Wasp Storm :(

Ack :)

Thanks for noticing

-Cass

duralupal
10-13-2005, 01:26 PM
Anybody know a good parser for DoT's? Yaulp, EQParse, and EQCompanion all seem a bit iffy on it. Seems like the %s of crit DoT's should be easier to figure out with good confidence than nukes given just how much raw data you get when root-rotting.

tatankawd
10-13-2005, 01:48 PM
I used "grep" on a UNIX box, worked pretty well ;)

I came up with 3.07% crits with Critical Affliction 1, over about 9000 individual dot ticks.

Tat