View Full Forums : Does Skin to Vines stick to anything?


malibu66
11-15-2006, 12:50 PM
I know I've had Skin to Vines land on something before, but for the life of me I can't remember what.

For the last month or so, I can't find a single mob that it sticks too - I always get the "does not meet requirements" message.

What is the point of this spell? What are the requirements? (Spell description says level 75 or less, and of course I've tried those).

:eusa_booh

Vekx
11-15-2006, 01:43 PM
I think the point is to force you to group with a shamman.

malibu66
11-15-2006, 02:30 PM
LOL! I'm serious :ohwell:

What's it take to make this land? Do Shamman's need to cast some other debuff first? Turn the mob into animal so we can turn them into Plant???

Or is it just we need to be grouped with them?

No Druids in my guild even bother memming this anymore, please, please, tell me what it's good for???

/boggle

malibu66
11-17-2006, 04:11 PM
Well, I found this thread on EQ Live:

http://eqforums.station.sony.com/eq/board/message?board.id=Veterans&message.id=312194

This seems very sad to have yet another a wasted spell line like this. Does anyone know if SOE plans to relax the requirements for this? Seems like a nice debuff, I mean if it actually worked on anything...

Mellen
11-18-2006, 06:25 PM
the lvl requirement refers to the lvl of fire spells it will add dmg to not the mob it's being cast on's lvl.

I believe if a shm lands feralize before you cast vines it blocks it the same way vines blocks itself after wearing off. I'm not 100% on that one though.

Otherwise it used to land on icefall mobs and instanced hive spiders. After a short whiel I gave up on it before getting to really test it out much more.

Alaene
11-19-2006, 03:54 PM
This is another example of poorly-implemented-crap-that's-broken that SOE just can't be bothered to respond on. Seriously, stuff like this and the degrading-epic issue seem like no-brainers to me.

Fix it, for god's sake, and implement those cut spells like you said you were going to. And replace the new regen with something useful, like you said you were going to...

Kinyenya
11-21-2006, 11:42 AM
I have used this quite a few times yet i have seen no difference in the amount of damage my fire spells do.

Riverwinter
12-04-2006, 07:59 PM
My GL was liking what he was reading on this and how it could increase necro DPS and make SK more efficient DPS. I know that it has it's problems, and personally, I don't know what I would get rid of in my current spell line up to use it, but I said I would look into it.

Does anyone have anymore information on the usefulness of this spell?

Alaene
12-04-2006, 09:40 PM
Try it out. You will soon see it's failings. The biggest is that on a raid mob, it hits once, wears off and can't be overwritten/reapplied I say raid mob because typically trash mobs would die quick enough that the spell duration would never be exceeded.

daisywk
12-05-2006, 10:28 AM
I use this spell when I am going to be nuking, I do all the debuffs and use this as well. The mages in my guild love it. Not to mention I have been able to get a crit nuke for 9.3k using it. :)

I can get this spell to land on all the mobs in The Steppes. I load it and if it dont stick then I just unmem it.

DaisyWK
75th Level Druid
Tunare

serinity_inny
12-05-2006, 11:38 AM
I too just tried this out last nite and rk 2 is nice! Icefall goblins it sticks on ....now if it wears off yes bummer but I group with Wizard 98% of the time and he told me last nite for sure the dd crits and regular hits were higher and my own dd was higher on equinox rk 2 ....also stick on oozes in Sunder same thing.....so it might not be helpul on raids but for the more casual player who groups with mages and wizards it owns......plus I read on the SK board that the Black Roots in Direwind it works on which is nice exp too (sk/druid combo using their plant spells).

I am sorry it doesn't help raiders much but I will be using all the time now (my evening group even has an extra wizard so its even more important for us to get in on mobs)

Cibby
Nameless

Fanra
12-05-2006, 12:33 PM
I've considered this spell useless since it came out. I've never had it work on any mob I've tried.

Hearing what people have been saying, I'll have to try it some more. Maybe I haven't tried it enough. Either that or it only works on blue mobs or something. I had the same problem with our stun before I learned it only works on level 75 and below mobs.

Which makes this spell nice for casual players but useless for anyone who plays in areas like Ashengate.

P.S. I just noticed this:
(Spell description says level 75 or less, and of course I've tried those).


Bah. Ever since they upped the levels on trash mobs we have been screwed.

Remember back in the day when you could have all your spells work on trash mobs? Harmony and stun would work and you could nuke trash without having to debuff first?

Frankly, the higher level you get in EQ, the less powerful you become. It sucks. Your spells get longer cast times and work on fewer mobs. I would think that as you become higher level you should become more powerful, not less. I mean what are we working for?

serinity_inny
12-06-2006, 12:48 PM
worked on spiders in icefall last night......spell camp and awesome exp can't complain about that folks. (8 spells 2 hours....4 off one mob stacking 2 of them was awesome!).....I got 23% reg exp last night there to ding 75 for bp clicky......these spiders are yellow at 75 fyi....then switched to aa's and grabbed two of those.

Gaennen
12-07-2006, 06:10 AM
While it does work on some mobs it is at the moment obviously not working properly, lack of messages and the inability to reapply show this. I'm hoping that targets for this are also not working properly at the mo and that it will be expanded so thats in lands on a larger selection of mobs.

Palarran
12-07-2006, 07:25 AM
Hmm...maybe the body type change is permanent, blocking later casts of the spell (since you can't cast it on plants)?

And if so, then does the shaman Feralize permanently turn a mob into an animal too? That could actually be helpful!

Fanra
12-07-2006, 12:45 PM
Hmm...maybe the body type change is permanent, blocking later casts of the spell (since you can't cast it on plants)?
From Lucy http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=9869&source=Live:

Classes: DRU/73
Duration: 3.0 mins

Now Lucy could be wrong but since they get their info from the Spell.Dat file, I normally assume they are correct unless they made a mistake entering the information or something.

Riverwinter
12-07-2006, 01:58 PM
From what I have read, the debuff falls off after 3 mins, but the body change is permanent, which is why we can't reapply it. I don't know if a Shaman can cast feralize on the mob again, allowing us to make it plant again, but I do know that I don't want to depend on having a shaman around for me to do my job.

Palarran
12-07-2006, 08:08 PM
I was thinking more along the lines of shamans turning mobs into animals permanently, allowing us to tash and charm them.

Seirian
01-04-2007, 02:08 AM
It does stick on some of the giants in Valdeholm, which allows Pally stuns to stick. I have had pallies request this when they are main tanking there.

Rajolae
01-04-2007, 07:45 AM
From Lucy http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=9869&source=Live:

Classes: DRU/73
Duration: 3.0 mins

Now Lucy could be wrong but since they get their info from the Spell.Dat file, I normally assume they are correct unless they made a mistake entering the information or something.

Thats part of the bug, Fen tested this, once it fades the mob stays flagged as body type plant.

Fenier
01-04-2007, 07:51 AM
Thats part of the bug, Fen tested this, once it fades the mob stays flagged as body type plant.

Actually it switches to a bodytype which is not plant, nor animal, Which prevents it from landing a second time. Prathun finally acknowledged the bug, and forwarded it to code.

You can test this by changing an animal into a Plant with Skin to Vines, charming it with Beguile Plant, and once skin to vines wears off, being unable to charm it with either spell.

-Fenier

Rajolae
01-05-2007, 03:52 PM
Actually it switches to a bodytype which is not plant, nor animal, Which prevents it from landing a second time. Prathun finally acknowledged the bug, and forwarded it to code.

You can test this by changing an animal into a Plant with Skin to Vines, charming it with Beguile Plant, and once skin to vines wears off, being unable to charm it with either spell.

-Fenier

oops http://smiliesftw.com/x/redface.gif

serinity_inny
01-17-2007, 06:42 PM
Most of these changes are already on Live (sans the Rank III turn-in). Please let me know if you have any questions!

A vendor named The Quiet Wanderer has moved into Sunderock Springs. He offers spells and abilities of the calming persuasion, including several which were not previously available: Song: Whispersong of Veshma, Spell: Drifting Fog, Spell: Dulcify, Spell: Nature’s Placidity, Spell: Quiet Mind, and Tome of Phantom Silhouette.<NAMESPACE ns="http://www.lithium.com/unique/URI" prefix="o">
Based on feedback from the Druid community, Wildskin and Blessing of the Wild have been replaced on a one-for-one basis with Blistering Sunray and Sunscorch. The old spells will be replaced with the new ones.
Based on feedback from the Cleric community, Rectitude and Cure Corruption have been replaced with Blessing of Purpose and Ward of the Dauntless. Rectitude was swapped on a one-for-one basis with Blessing of Purpose. However, because Cure Corruption is used by multiple classes the spell could not be swapped directly with Ward of the Dauntless, so clerics can simply no longer use the Cure Corruption spell. Turning in a Rank III spell rune while you have Cure Corruption Rank III scribed will result in a copy of Ward of the Dauntless Rank III and a return of the spell rune. Aside from that, Cure Corruption can be deleted from the spell book.
The statistics on the items created by Summon Aenda’s Trinkets have been improved.
The number of “procs” that Steeltrap Jaws can fire before fading have been doubled.
Skin to Vines will now work on a wider variety of NPC targets.
bumping old post read last bullet!!! I think we got a little druid attn this time.

Rajolae
01-18-2007, 07:48 AM
Most of these changes are already on Live (sans the Rank III turn-in). Please let me know if you have any questions!
A vendor named The Quiet Wanderer has moved into Sunderock Springs. He offers spells and abilities of the calming persuasion, including several which were not previously available: Song: Whispersong of Veshma, Spell: Drifting Fog, Spell: Dulcify, Spell: Nature’s Placidity, Spell: Quiet Mind, and Tome of Phantom Silhouette.<namespace ns="http://www.lithium.com/unique/URI" prefix="o"></namespace>
Based on feedback from the Druid community, Wildskin and Blessing of the Wild have been replaced on a one-for-one basis with Blistering Sunray and Sunscorch. The old spells will be replaced with the new ones.
Based on feedback from the Cleric community, Rectitude and Cure Corruption have been replaced with Blessing of Purpose and Ward of the Dauntless. Rectitude was swapped on a one-for-one basis with Blessing of Purpose. However, because Cure Corruption is used by multiple classes the spell could not be swapped directly with Ward of the Dauntless, so clerics can simply no longer use the Cure Corruption spell. Turning in a Rank III spell rune while you have Cure Corruption Rank III scribed will result in a copy of Ward of the Dauntless Rank III and a return of the spell rune. Aside from that, Cure Corruption can be deleted from the spell book.
The statistics on the items created by Summon Aenda’s Trinkets have been improved.
The number of “procs” that Steeltrap Jaws can fire before fading have been doubled.
Skin to Vines will now work on a wider variety of NPC targets.bumping old post read last bullet!!! I think we got a little druid attn this time.

Not rly, skin to vines is still useless as you cannot recast it on something that has had it on it but it has faded and it still doesn't do all of the things that it should do.

serinity_inny
01-18-2007, 11:37 AM
if it takes you longer then 3minutes to kill the mob somethings wrong (in grp setting that is)

and it does help because I have two wizzies in our nightly set up and we were killing griffons and the non-dodh wizzy (lvl 70 spell) and lower aa's even got a 15.3k crit nuke while the other one does 16-23k regularly.....so don't say it doesn't help....it even landed on a namer axebeak......griffons are animals which druids should love this they can debuff and solo these even better now.

Riverwinter
01-18-2007, 02:05 PM
I agree with Cibby. Three minutes is a LONG fight in a group setting. Getting it to stick a second time is really a raid concern. Getting it to stick without having a shammy around to feralize first is an excellent step to getting full use out of the spell.

Rajolae
01-18-2007, 07:54 PM
if it takes you longer then 3minutes to kill the mob somethings wrong (in grp setting that is)

and it does help because I have two wizzies in our nightly set up and we were killing griffons and the non-dodh wizzy (lvl 70 spell) and lower aa's even got a 15.3k crit nuke while the other one does 16-23k regularly.....so don't say it doesn't help....it even landed on a namer axebeak......griffons are animals which druids should love this they can debuff and solo these even better now.

Uhhhh wizards already nuke exceptionally high, three and five percent are just very, very minor boosts to that.

serinity_inny
01-19-2007, 11:20 AM
its actally a 6% increase .....so if that is minor why do people want 30% fire focus over 25? why do us druids want better heal focus ? don't give me that crap.....any increase is good.

Rajolae
01-19-2007, 12:10 PM
its actally a 6% increase .....so if that is minor why do people want 30% fire focus over 25? why do us druids want better heal focus ? don't give me that crap.....any increase is good.

<table class="spellview" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td><table cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="spellview" valign="center">http://lucy.allakhazam.com/gfx/gem_162d.png?1 Skin to Vines Rk. II </td><td class="spellview" align="right">Detail | History (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=9870&source=Live) | Stacking (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/stacking.html?id=9870&source=Live) | Raw Data (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellraw.html?id=9870&source=Live) </td></tr> </tbody></table></td></tr> <tr><td> </td></tr> <tr><td align="center"><table class="spellview" cellpadding="3" width="95%"> <tbody><tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right" width="10%">Slot</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="90%">Description</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">1: </td> <td>Increase Incoming Spell Damage by 5%</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">2: </td> <td>Limit: Max Level(75) (lose 10% per level over cap)</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">3: </td> <td>Limit: Effect(Hitpoints allowed)</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">4: </td> <td>Limit: Spell Type(Detrimental only)</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">5: </td> <td>Limit: Resist(Fire allowed)</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">6: </td> <td>Limit: Combat Skills Not Allowed</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel" align="right">7: </td> <td>Unknown #367 (100/25/0)</td></tr> </tbody></table></td></tr> <tr><td> </td></tr> <tr><td align="center"><table class="spellview" width="95%"> <tbody><tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Mana:</td> <td width="30%">300</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Skill:</td> <td width="30%">Alteration</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Casting Time:</td> <td width="30%">2.5</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Recast Time:</td> <td width="30%">2.25</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Fizzle Time:</td> <td width="30%">2.5</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Resist:</td> <td width="30%">Unresistable</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Range:</td> <td width="30%">200</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Location:</td> <td width="30%">Any</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Time of Day:</td> <td width="30%">Any</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Fizzle Adj:</td> <td width="30%">91</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Deletable:</td> <td width="30%">No</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Dot Stacking:</td> <td width="30%">Yes</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Interruptable:</td> <td width="30%">Yes</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Short Buff Box:</td> <td width="30%">No</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Target Type:</td> <td width="30%">Single</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Spell Type:</td> <td width="30%">Detrimental</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Category:</td> <td width="30%">Dir. Dmg [Magic]</td> <td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Source:</td> <td width="30%">Live 01/17</td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td></tr><tr><td> </td></tr> <tr><td align="center"><table class="spellview" width="95%"> <tbody><tr><td class="spelllabel" width="20%">Classes:</td> <td class="spelldata" width="80%">DRU/73</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel">Duration:</td> <td class="spelldata">3.0 mins</td></tr> <tr><td class="spelllabel">Items with spell:</td> <td class="spelldata">Spell: Skin to Vines Rk. II (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/item.html?id=78207)</td></tr> </tbody></table> </td></tr><tr><td> </td></tr></tbody></table>People want upgrades on worn foci A) Because they are always going to have it. B) Im pretty sure people with 25% foci would want something much better than 30% foci when theres stuff out there with much better than that. The spell is crap.

serinity_inny
01-19-2007, 12:22 PM
see you are ASSUMING we are all raiders and we are not.....show me where I can get higher then 35% to fire focus for 1group casuals that goes up to 75? the staff quested is the only thing higher then our arms that I can find.

YOU might think the spell is crap but not all share that opinion and that is ok .......it is better to say I still don't think I will use it then to tell people its crap.....let them decide for themselves.

I still think its a great spell and will continue to report where I find things it will land on which is why this thread is started.....you saying it sucks makes you look like a 12 year old so please add something useful to the topic or don't post.

Fenier
01-19-2007, 02:29 PM
Lets play pretend.

You have Skin to Vines Rank II.

You cast Equionx Burn Rank II.

We take 5% and divide by half, to get the average percent increase to damage, so we use 2.5%.

So we take 2861 Damage - that of EBII and * it by 1.025 to get...2932, the result is STVII added 72~ damage to the nuke.

Now, lets assume some Wizard comes along and casts Ethereal Conflagration Rk. II, which deals 7041 Damage. A 2.5% increase means it delt 7217 Damage, which was an increase of 176 Damage.

Does an extra 2.5% average help out? Sure. Is it super awesome game breaking noticable? Not so much.

-Fenier

puchiguso
01-19-2007, 03:09 PM
That 2.5% may not be much for a single nuke but over 3 minutes on a raid target that adds up to thousands of extra damage. It may not make quite as much difference as some of the other debuffs but it's definitely worth casting.

Fenier
01-19-2007, 03:12 PM
She was talking within the context is a single group.

Skin to Vines will add likely less then 1k extra damage, and that is assuming a caster heavy group - prior to most mob's death.

On a Raid, the differance can be far more dramatic for sure.

-Fenier

Rajolae
01-19-2007, 03:29 PM
see you are ASSUMING we are all raiders and we are not.....show me where I can get higher then 35% to fire focus for 1group casuals that goes up to 75? the staff quested is the only thing higher then our arms that I can find.

YOU might think the spell is crap but not all share that opinion and that is ok .......it is better to say I still don't think I will use it then to tell people its crap.....let them decide for themselves.

I still think its a great spell and will continue to report where I find things it will land on which is why this thread is started.....you saying it sucks makes you look like a 12 year old so please add something useful to the topic or don't post.
Even if I were just a normal group, the spell would still suck and still get memmed as often as I mem it now, which is never. The spell still doesn't do all of what it was told to us on TSS beta that it was supposed to do, and still has issues with being reapplied to mobs after it fades. The spell sucks. If you are keeping this memmed over other, much, MUCH more useful debuffs, you are doing something wrong.

Riverwinter
01-19-2007, 05:12 PM
One of our officers did the math, a chain casting nuker tossing 2K or 4K nukes will get effectively one to two extra casts worth of damage after three minutes. Multiply that across the raid and it's significant, but missing a heal and losing a caster while you are Feralizing and Vining defeats the damage bonus advantage.

We plan on using it during raids when group healing is not an issue, and we have time to put it up, after all of the important debuffs get laid on.

In a group, three mins is still a long time. One of the reasons that Swarm DoTs are inefficient for general tank/healer/DPS groups is because the mob should not last as long as the spell. Likewise, S2V is not something I'd typically use as a group spell, cept for it's advantages of mana efficiency with certain Necro and Shadowknight spells that target plant types.

So overall, S2V goes in the category of nice to have if you have a couple of Druids in the Raid, but it's not something that's going in my everyday spell line up.

Rajolae
01-19-2007, 05:36 PM
One of our officers did the math, a chain casting nuker tossing 2K or 4K nukes will get effectively one to two extra casts worth of damage after three minutes. Multiply that across the raid and it's significant, but missing a heal and losing a caster while you are Feralizing and Vining defeats the damage bonus advantage.

We plan on using it during raids when group healing is not an issue, and we have time to put it up, after all of the important debuffs get laid on.

In a group, three mins is still a long time. One of the reasons that Swarm DoTs are inefficient for general tank/healer/DPS groups is because the mob should not last as long as the spell. Likewise, S2V is not something I'd typically use as a group spell, cept for it's advantages of mana efficiency with certain Necro and Shadowknight spells that target plant types.

So overall, S2V goes in the category of nice to have if you have a couple of Druids in the Raid, but it's not something that's going in my everyday spell line up.
You cannot multiply that across the whole raid, last I checked, not everyone gets fire based nukes.

Riverwinter
01-19-2007, 06:16 PM
Lighten up, Raj, I know how the spell works. I didn't say that it worked for all Nukes, just like I also didn't say it gives a bonus to melees using slashing weapons. Multiply that across the raid too.

Personally I don't like the spell. It's got issues. I've given an example of a plain and simple but effective strat for it's use. Others are finding uses for it too. Some people want that itty bitty bit more damage, it makes them feel good. Just like most people will take that 96 rez over a 90, even though the difference is just one blue mob.

I also did not say "across the whole raid" You've misquoted me to promote your personal agenda, which is just to prove that the spell is totally useless. It isn't totally useless, it's just not what you want it to be.

Sorrian
01-23-2007, 01:31 AM
As far as I can tell, the best use for this spell is for long raid fights where the target is perma-rooted and you can debuff before engaging it. Cast this just before the tank charges in and tell the wizard(s) to start blazing away. Wait for the tank to have good agro, of course:wiggle: .Other than that.....well everyone has their own personal preferences, I guess. Personally I find it a waste of a spell gem in any group situation. 300 mana cost? Why not just add another dot? It will do more damage in 30 seconds than this will in it's entire duration, regardless of if there is a wizard present or not. Not that big of an issue though, as it has it's uses, just not many.

Riverwinter
01-23-2007, 05:13 PM
I did hear that the slashing bonus was removed from this during the last patch, which reduces it's overall effectiveness. Anyone know the real deal?

Fenier
01-23-2007, 08:49 PM
http://eq.forums.thedruidsgrove.org/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=15305

Rajolae
01-23-2007, 11:53 PM
I did hear that the slashing bonus was removed from this during the last patch, which reduces it's overall effectiveness. Anyone know the real deal?

The slashing bonus has never been on the spell since it went live, and in fact, I'm not even sure it was ever actually put on it during beta.

Riverwinter
01-24-2007, 06:46 AM
Thank's Raj, Fenier cleared that up for me with his post on the other thread.