View Full Forums : Bark Skin - Whats the problem?


Windfyre
01-23-2007, 03:23 PM
I have heard so many people on this board and on my server complaining about the druid teir 2 BP effect "bark skin". They say that other casters get a 1800 damage nuke and our effect is not "on par".

<a href = http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=9656&source=Live>Bark skin</a> is 580 DS for 4 hits atleast and its castable on other people. Isnt that an unresistable 2320 damage when casted on a tank?

Id take this over a nuke anyday... Helps the tank hold argo and its unresistable.

I got the BP and plan on using it all the time (as soon as i hit 75).

Fenier
01-23-2007, 03:31 PM
The same issues people have with Barkspur, no doubt.

Netura
01-23-2007, 04:29 PM
I'm pretty sure the damage shield effect does not increase aggro.

Riverwinter
01-23-2007, 05:11 PM
In any case, it's better than having the agro count toward the Druid.

Rajolae
01-24-2007, 06:59 PM
It only lasts two hits, the raid version lasts four. And, much like Barkspur, it sucks hardcore, especially so since it is on a fifteen minute recast timer.

elty
01-24-2007, 07:34 PM
http://lucy.allakhazam.com/item.html?id=39801

Woven Bramble Tunic, POR tier 1 BP (140 hp) has a 1892 nuke with only a 7 minutes recast. Compare to the Barkskin it is almost 4 times more DPS.

Barkskin is inferior to this old bp in almost every way, unless you never see a non cold immune mob in your life.

Alaene
01-24-2007, 08:10 PM
it sucks hardcore

Testify!

I wear the BP, and the click is utter, utter junk. Particularly compared to some classes, but even balance aside it sucks.

/slurping, gurgling sound

Riverwinter
01-25-2007, 08:14 AM
/chuckles

Discussions on the increased DPS of clicky effects that you use every 7 or 15 minutes? How about we realistically look at that as Damage per Hour?

The Bark Inlaid Leather Tunic is a decent item if you can get it, and clicky effects aside, a better overall item than the Woven Bramble Tunic. The avoidance, mana regen, dotshielding, hp and mana mean more to me than the ability to throw one extra nuke for 1400 additional damage every 15 mins.

I think gathering the parts for the Bark Inlaid is a bit easier than to get the Mark to drop for the Woven Bramble. Both are easier to get than the Everliving Bramble Tunic up in ToB, which is better than both.

Don't forget, TSS was made for the casual player to get some decent gear. If you are complaining about the clicky effect, your gear is probably good enough that you don't need a Bark Inlaid Leather Tunic.

elty
01-25-2007, 01:00 PM
/chuckles

Discussions on the increased DPS of clicky effects that you use every 7 or 15 minutes? How about we realistically look at that as Damage per Hour?

The Bark Inlaid Leather Tunic is a decent item if you can get it, and clicky effects aside, a better overall item than the Woven Bramble Tunic. The avoidance, mana regen, dotshielding, hp and mana mean more to me than the ability to throw one extra nuke for 1400 additional damage every 15 mins.

I think gathering the parts for the Bark Inlaid is a bit easier than to get the Mark to drop for the Woven Bramble. Both are easier to get than the Everliving Bramble Tunic up in ToB, which is better than both.

Don't forget, TSS was made for the casual player to get some decent gear. If you are complaining about the clicky effect, your gear is probably good enough that you don't need a Bark Inlaid Leather Tunic.

Except that your theory make absolutely no sense. So is it suitable for the raid level bp has a single use wraith of the wild with a 30 minutes timer? Since you get more hp, you are not allowed to complain about a clicky downgrade, even though all the other class get something better? This clicky is even worse than the bard PoR BP (fire debuff dot with 597 total damage every 7 minutes).

A good clicky adds favor to an item. No one is expecting a rez or divine balance that sort of clicky, but at least something more useful than this junk.

Riverwinter
01-25-2007, 01:45 PM
Let's see:

1) Bark Inlaid better than Woven Bramble (clicky effect not withstanding). Check.
2) Bark Inlaid easier to get than Woven Bramble. Check
3) TSS targeted toward the casual player. Check.
4) Neither item significantly adding to DPS. Check.

I don't see where my "theory makes absolutely no sense". Must be cause it's not a theory.

But I do have a theory about Druids: They complain. A lot.

Seriously, what you see as a downgrade is an upgrade to the casual player that Sony was trying to reach when they made TSS. The next expansion is coming soon, you'll have more toys to play with (and complain about) then.

Fenier
01-25-2007, 01:48 PM
The issue is the Raid level BPs share the effects. The Raid Level BP from the highest end TSS encounters should have a better click effect then this.

I am not sure it qualifies as easier to get then Wovan Bramble. The Mark drops off a named which is 10x easier then Lowfire. You then need a power source off yet another named mob.

-Fenier

Alaene
01-25-2007, 01:56 PM
I think gathering the parts for the Bark Inlaid is a bit easier than to get the Mark to drop for the Woven Bramble. Both are easier to get than the Everliving Bramble Tunic up in ToB, which is better than both.

Disagree with the latter - the ToB BP is inferior to the TSS (rank 1, powersourced). I have the ToB BP in a top level inventory slot for the click, and wear the TSS one in preference... yet the effect on the TSS BP is so poor I don't have space among 20 keyboard shortcut/hotkeys to bother hotkeying it. That tells you something :)

(I guess I should qualify the statement - the TSS one is better because of the spell shielding, dot shielding & saves... the ToB BP has 35 extra mana, but IMHO it's not worth the trade).

Riverwinter
01-25-2007, 02:04 PM
Easy is relative I guess.

I camped that Spirit Mark of Battle quiet a bit, used to port to Arcstone on the chance that someone got one of the names to pop and got killed by them. I really wanted the clicky Gfrost. I think one dropped for a guildy last week.

I personally have never seen Firelash or Shekar up, but I have seen Lowfire up, and killed. I know flickering powersources drop off several named mobs, so collecting those pieces, to me, is easier.

Alaene
01-25-2007, 04:28 PM
Easy is relative I guess.

I wasn't commenting on the ease to obtain, actually - just the quality of the pieces.

The ToB BP isn't easy to obtain - TSS tier one is clearly easier.... but I think PoR tier one is easier still.

PoR tier one is soloable, or duaoable (and just takes time, and luck getting Shekar to pop, with Spirit Mark in his pocket) whereas taking out Tarnuk + helpers, and getting your hands on a powersource, is for TSS tier one takes a decent group.

Having said that, I don't mind which is harder - the fact is that the clicky effect on the TSS one bites the wax tadpole :)

Riverwinter
01-25-2007, 05:29 PM
Originally Posted by Alaene
The ToB BP isn't easy to obtain - TSS tier one is clearly easier.... but I think PoR tier one is easier still
Originally Posted by Riverwinter
Both are easier to get than the Everliving Bramble Tunic up in ToB
Somehow, we are agreement on that.

And while the mobs are much easier to kill for the PoR Tier 1, (because we're freaking Uber) getting the mobs to pop has been my issue.

My point through this has always been, to the person that can get whichever item they can get, if it's useful to you, great. I'm all about using all the tools in the toolbox. But talking about these items like they are bringing anything other than negligible DPS is silly at best.

Alaene
01-25-2007, 06:09 PM
I didn't want to make this a balance issue, mainly because I don't want to look like a class-envy whiner, but I guess to appreciate the complaint about the crappy effect one needs the context of what other classes got.


Warrior - 2k self heal, 0.9 cast time, 15m recast
Paladin - self buff, reverse procs to help gain agro, doesn't stick with WoT
SK - self buff defensive proc w/ lifetap, lasts 1 min
Bard - 2 tick stun immunity, AC & double atk increase

BL - 1 min duration pet proc/self heal buff
Monk - unclear - either fade (ie bard ability, score) or cancel magic (good for pulling - instacast, recast delay 30 seconds)

Necro - pet lifetap proc
Ench - mob debuff, lowers resist rates, 0.3 cast time, 7 tick duration, 5 min recast
Wiz - GoM proc (0.9 cast time, 15m recast)
Mage - 1 min duration pet buff (100pt/tick heal, 15% dmg mod)

Rogue - 5 tick duration 125pt dmg proc, 6 min recast
Zerker - 24pt AC debuff, 3 min duration
Ranger - swarm pet summon, 15 min recast, 7 tick duration

Druid - 2 hit max 580pt physical, or 980pt vs. spell, damage shield, 15 min recast.
Sham - resist rate debuff, instacast, 7 tick duration, 5 min recast
Cleric - Increase healing aura, +50%, 7 ticks (same effect as anguish BP but upgraded to lvl 75, 5 min recast)



Frankly, I think druids are among the bottom few. Pallies are (possibly rightly) pissy that their click doesn't stack with WoT. Some classes made out like bandits. Once again clerics get a sensational effect (upgrade of anguish BP effect for goodness sake!), and druids get the shaft. Shamans didn't make out badly either - from a dotting perspective they have long complained about the need to pre-debuff mobs - this instaclick completely remedies that issue. While I'm no fan of fixing problems by itemisation, this BP is is really a strong option for two priest classes. The other priest class gets a lovely bark-inlaid stick right up the @55.

Not that I'm bitter - as always I'll march on and play the game for fun. But if I had the option of an anguish-BP effect upgraded to work at lvl 75 as against a 2 hit DS.... I don't think I'd have to think too long to choose :)

*edit - depluralised "classes"*

Fenier
01-25-2007, 06:38 PM
Warrior - 2k self heal, 0.9 cast time, 15m recast
Paladin - self buff, reverse procs to help gain agro, doesn't stick with WoT
SK - self buff defensive proc w/ lifetap, lasts 1 min
Bard - 2 tick stun immunity, AC & double atk increase

BL - 1 min duration pet proc/self heal buff
Monk - unclear - either fade (ie bard ability, score) or cancel magic (good for pulling - instacast, recast delay 30 seconds)

Necro - pet lifetap proc
Ench - mob debuff, lowers resist rates, 0.3 cast time, 7 tick duration, 5 min recast
Wiz - GoM proc (0.9 cast time, 15m recast)
Mage - 1 min duration pet buff (100pt/tick heal, 15% dmg mod)

Rogue - 5 tick duration 125pt dmg proc, 6 min recast
Zerker - 24pt AC debuff, 3 min duration
Ranger - swarm pet summon, 15 min recast, 7 tick duration

Druid - 2 hit max 580pt physical, or 980pt vs. spell, damage shield, 15 min recast.
Sham - resist rate debuff, instacast, 7 tick duration, 5 min recast
Cleric - Increase healing aura, +50%, 7 ticks (same effect as anguish BP but upgraded to lvl 75, 5 min recast)


Cleric, Enchanters, Shaman and Monk all got Upgrades to their Tier 1 / 2 Omens Effects.

Fading Memories is a Dispell which only effects Bennifical Spells the mob has cast upon them.

We go from having 25% Bennifcial / Detri spell haste which stacks with Quick Damage and Worn Focus (IE, Cutting cast time in half with decent item haste) to having a 2 / 4 Shot Damage shield which also happens to work on spells.

-Fenier

Vekx
01-25-2007, 08:38 PM
Bah, I had to stop reading all this because it's just too silly.

If you are NOT a (hard) raiding druid this might be slightly nice. Mainly for solo action. Possibly a tad for group action. If in lower end raiding it might be fun to use if there wasn't something better to do.

what use is 5K damage elsewhere? (just made that number to be nice).

Free 5K would be nice if you could do it every 1 min, maybe 3 min.

Unless you are in the super duper top guild where each druid can and will remember to cast each and every free clicky/AA etc, and in a proper rotation if needed, most of this type of stuff is fluf.

Make us a 15K nuke (or DS or whatever) - (unresistable) with a recast of 20 min... then someone should pay attention.

But mostly this is only good for solo stuff - which we are not supposed to do anymore.

Rajolae
01-26-2007, 12:29 PM
I didn't want to make this a balance issue, mainly because I don't want to look like a class-envy whiner, but I guess to appreciate the complaint about the crappy effect one needs the context of what other classes got.


Warrior - 2k self heal, 0.9 cast time, 15m recast
Paladin - self buff, reverse procs to help gain agro, doesn't stick with WoT
SK - self buff defensive proc w/ lifetap, lasts 1 min
Bard - 2 tick stun immunity, AC & double atk increase

BL - 1 min duration pet proc/self heal buff
Monk - unclear - either fade (ie bard ability, score) or cancel magic (good for pulling - instacast, recast delay 30 seconds)

Necro - pet lifetap proc
Ench - mob debuff, lowers resist rates, 0.3 cast time, 7 tick duration, 5 min recast
Wiz - GoM proc (0.9 cast time, 15m recast)
Mage - 1 min duration pet buff (100pt/tick heal, 15% dmg mod)

Rogue - 5 tick duration 125pt dmg proc, 6 min recast
Zerker - 24pt AC debuff, 3 min duration
Ranger - swarm pet summon, 15 min recast, 7 tick duration

Druid - 2 hit max 580pt physical, or 980pt vs. spell, damage shield, 15 min recast.
Sham - resist rate debuff, instacast, 7 tick duration, 5 min recast
Cleric - Increase healing aura, +50%, 7 ticks (same effect as anguish BP but upgraded to lvl 75, 5 min recast)



Frankly, I think druids are among the bottom few. Pallies are (possibly rightly) pissy that their click doesn't stack with WoT. Some classes made out like bandits. Once again clerics get a sensational effect (upgrade of anguish BP effect for goodness sake!), and druids get the shaft. Shamans didn't make out badly either - from a dotting perspective they have long complained about the need to pre-debuff mobs - this instaclick completely remedies that issue. While I'm no fan of fixing problems by itemisation, this BP is is really a strong option for two priest classes. The other priest classes gets a lovely bark-inlaid stick right up the @55.

Not that I'm bitter - as always I'll march on and play the game for fun. But if I had the option of an anguish-BP effect upgraded to work at lvl 75 as against a 2 hit DS.... I don't think I'd have to think too long to choose :)

SKs also don't like theirs as it is a defensive proc that doesn't stack with their own spell (much like paladins) and is a DoT.