http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsyVd_Kqp-8&eurl=

Keith Olbermann takes a look at Bush's claims about thwarted terrorists plots and fact checks them. Pray tell, what shall he ever find?

I had been wondering about how real these terrorist schemes are. This was good.

He's like Stephen Colbert, right?

He seems so serious.

But he's funny.

I expect the guys in the fourth plot will be in the UK courts sometime near the end of this year. There should be enough public evidence for you to make your own minds up then. The trial of the July 25th 2005 London bombers is going on at the moment.

There is some question about how many of the people arrested under terrorism charges in the UK are actually being convicted, however there does seem to be plenty of evidence that terrorist plots are a continued threat. I'm actually quite surprised that there hasn't been another attack within the US yet.

It's not a matter if if, it is a matter of when.

I really think it's coming.

The thing that I kept seeing in my head, was this idiot doing this schtick a week before 9-11.


"And Mr. Bush, who in his televised address to the nation this last week, stated that he and the government have broken up a small gang of hoodlums, who they thought were going to hijack a bunch of planes, now get this,,,, with box cutters."

"Can you believe this nonsense?, box cutters?, who in their right mind would hijack a plane with a box cutter? Now Mr. Bush, we know you are stretching things just a little too much. But these guys didn't even have a plot to piss in, Mr. Bush."

"I'm sorry, Mr. Bush, but these guys did not even have the know how to land a 747. How can you come to us, in front of the nation, and tell us that this small town amateur gang, were actually going to be able to hijack anything. They couldn't even hijack a bus,,,,box cutters?"


"Plot to piss in", I bust myself up, just like Keith does.

Britain says arrests foil terrorism plot.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-terror1feb01,0,4621234.story?coll=la-home-world

At least the US is protected from dangerous cartoon characters http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6319211.stm.

Hehehe, I was watching Adult Swim and they had a big long apology as a buffer between the shows. I had to Google "Adult Swim" and "Boston" to figure out what the heck it was all about. It was great.

I wish I watched TV, so that I would have seen how CNN played out the coverage.

It's not a matter if if, it is a matter of when.

I really think it's coming.

Oh sure, it is. We'll never be 100% secure. We've got our own citizen terrorists if nothing else. But as usual you have to ask yourself how much freedom do you want to give up for how much security? The government is trying to make it sound like the threat is worse than it is so we'll give up more freedom and think they're doing a good job at protecting us.

I wish I watched TV, so that I would have seen how CNN played out the coverage.

Love youtube!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=zx2ytr2Oyv4

Haven't you all seen that you tube thing talking about how governments are using fear as a motivator rather than promises of a brighter future?

I actually think I found it here.

I no longer have it on my laptop. It was a three parter. The Power of Nightmares.

In my own mind, and I don't think everyone else has to think this, every time we jump through hoops because someone somewhere says they are going to do something, the terrorists win.

I watched V for Vendetta and while I don't advocate blowing things up, I found myself early on rooting for the guy fawkes fella. While I didn't agree with the premise that the U.S would be in a civil war, I could easily see our own country becoming much like the one depicted in the story.

What's worse is we will let it happen a small piece at a time and welcome it.

When the next terrible act does come, we'll not blame those who did it, we'll instead seek to place blame where it isn't because its easier. Some will do it out of ignorance, some will do it to build a power base while destroying another. Some will do it just to advance their own agendas, whatever those may be. Then we'll tighten up on security even more by giving away more freedom, and again, we'll welcome it and want it. Until its all gone, then we'll wonder where it went.

In the end, we will have neither security nor freedom and we'll have brought it on ourselves.

Haven't you all seen that you tube thing talking about how governments are using fear as a motivator rather than promises of a brighter future?
Aye, fear is a powerful motivator and it's cheap and easy to use. It's also quite destructive. Marilyn Manson's summed it up nicely in one of his quotes in Bowling for Columbine:

"the media wants to take it and spin it, and turn it into fear, because then you're watching television, you're watching the news, you're being pumped full of fear, there's floods, there's AIDS, there's murder, cut to commercial, buy the Acura, buy the Colgate, if you have bad breath they're not going to talk to you, if you have pimples, the girl's not going to fvck you, and it's just this campaign of fear, and consumption, and that's what I think it's all based on, the whole idea of 'keep everyone afraid, and they'll consume."

While he was referring to the media in his quote, the fear/consumption dynamic works for any product or idea.

I've just given up TV -- yup, cut the cable so to speak. I guess I'll have to get my dose of fear mongering through the internet.

I've just given up TV -- yup, cut the cable so to speak. I guess I'll have to get my dose of fear mongering through the internet.
That's a pretty dire response. Won't you miss Lost and Heroes?

You can "find" the episodes online. Other than picture quality (since most are sampled down for size) I think they're much better. No commercials and you can watch it whenever you want.

When the next terrible act does come, we'll not blame those who did it, we'll instead seek to place blame where it isn't because its easier. Some will do it out of ignorance, some will do it to build a power base while destroying another. Some will do it just to advance their own agendas, whatever those may be. Then we'll tighten up on security even more by giving away more freedom, and again, we'll welcome it and want it. Until its all gone, then we'll wonder where it went.

I 100% agree with you Dela... and I have been saying this since 9/12/01. I knew it was going to happen, because America was shocked, hurt, and terrified. And that was played on... and continues to be played on. How much safer are our Airports and Airplanes today? I have seen studies that show they aren't.

The president has continued to increase his power and take away bits of our freedom during his entire presidency. It's scary - and there are people like Tudamorf who think its ok - as long as we get some security out of it. Mind boggling to me.

Aye, fear is a powerful motivator and it's cheap and easy to use. It's also quite destructive. Marilyn Manson's summed it up nicely in one of his quotes in Bowling for Columbine:

My sister is a huge Michael Moore fan, and made me watch Bowling for Columbine and Ferenheight 911. Although I believe that Michael Moore does his own form of fear mongering, I was impressed with some of the interviews and footage in both films. Particularly Marilyn Manson. He was a bit more eloquent than I expected (see how stereotypes can get you into trouble) and I agreed with his position regarding the fear mongering in America.

How much safer are our Airports and Airplanes today? I have seen studies that show they aren't.

I think US airports are far more secure than they were five years ago. Five years ago they had incredibly lax security. Now they'll be as secure or more secure than most western nations. They might even be too security conscious, as shown when the air marshall shot the sick lady aboard a plane.

In the end, no, US airports will never be secure because we disallow profiling.

Israel hasn't has a plane blown up or hijacked in decades. That's because the security at El Al knows what to look for (and they have the human intel to be able to determine when what they should be looking for changes)...and focuses their attention on suspicious people...not 80 year old grandmothers from Hoboken.

Generally speaking, profiling is bad. There are, however, appropriate times and places for it.

I've just given up TV -- yup, cut the cable so to speak. I guess I'll have to get my dose of fear mongering through the internet.

I lived my years in California TV free. I only have one now because my wife wants it.

<-- I'm an oddball, though, so not a good standard to measure by.

Israel hasn't has a plane blown up or hijacked in decades.
Yet people are blown up all the time in busses, shopping malls, and restaurants. If Israel is unable to stop this sort of thing then we don't have a hope in hell of stopping it. We can spend ridiculous amounts of money to provide the illusion that we are able to do so but, in the end, all that will do is inconveinince us and encroach on our rights. You know, kinda like it already has. :)

Yet people are blown up all the time in busses, shopping malls, and restaurants. If Israel is unable to stop this sort of thing then we don't have a hope in hell of stopping it. We can spend ridiculous amounts of money to provide the illusion that we are able to do so but, in the end, all that will do is inconveinince us and encroach on our rights. You know, kinda like it already has.

Well there can be too much security. On the whole though there does need to be protection aginst terrorist attacks. The public do need the assurances of safety, the economy needs airline travel, and the terrorists should be denied successful missions. If you compare the cost of airline security against the losses of 9/11 and cost of middle east wars then airline security seems pretty cheap.

Terrorism will eventually be seen as a poor methodology for political change. Until then we will need security.

If you compare the cost of airline security against the loss off life, planes, and property on 9/11 and cost of middle east wars then airline security seems pretty cheap.
It remains to be seen just how much safety we're actually getting from a bunch of mindless, minimum wage earning, nail-clipper confiscating, TSA drones. Way too much money is being spent on the illusion of security rather than actual security. For example: Airport screeners fail to see most test bombs (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2003327485_screeners28.html)

I had one trip where they took a small pair of nail clippers I'd forgotten I had on my key-chain and then, during the flight, I was served a meal that came with metal cutlery (including a knife). Go figure.

Terrorism will eventually be seen as a poor methodology for political change.
At least for positive political change. :)

It's scary - and there are people like Tudamorf who think its okI don't think it's OK.Terrorism will eventually be seen as a poor methodology for political change.Really? Judging by recent events, one might conclude it's one of the most effective.

I would rather listen to Marilyn Manson anyday over most people.

Especially the other MM.

It remains to be seen just how much safety we're actually getting from a bunch of mindless, minimum wage earning, nail-clipper confiscating, TSA drones. Way too much money is being spent on the illusion of security rather than actual security.

Yes, I agree. However the problems with the wrong level of security don't alter the need for the right level of security.

Aidon is precisely correct.

If you have limited resources devoted to security, it is absolutely fcking retarded treating every single person equally as a suspect.

That is stupid.

That's a pretty dire response. Won't you miss Lost and Heroes?
I will miss them. But they'll be out on DVD. Meanwhile wow! I feel like I have time again. When I went to the cable company to turn in my equipment they were almost incredulous. :)

The first few days were really odd, but I'm adjusting.

Yet people are blown up all the time in busses, shopping malls, and restaurants. If Israel is unable to stop this sort of thing then we don't have a hope in hell of stopping it. We can spend ridiculous amounts of money to provide the illusion that we are able to do so but, in the end, all that will do is inconveinince us and encroach on our rights. You know, kinda like it already has. :)

Its alot easier to blow up a bus, mall, and restaurant when all you have to do is cross a border and you're within four hours of your target, max.

Seriously, if someone enters Israel from East Jerusalem, they can be anywhere in Israel within 2.5 hours by car.

America is so large that suicide bombing a Sbarro's Pizza just about anywhere would have a negligble social impact..which defeats the purpose of terrorism.

America is so large that suicide bombing a Sbarro's Pizza just about anywhere would have a negligble social impact..which defeats the purpose of terrorism.

Unless the media keep talking about it 24h on 24 for the next year. And it is used a excuse to get more power to the administration and less to you because the administration say: Never mind that we didn't have done our job to protect you corectly, we are in a crisis and we need to take even more power from you to be able to protect you even more......

Eridalafar

The first few days were really odd, but I'm adjusting.
Well, I'm glad you gave up the tube rather than the Grove. :)

Unless the media keep talking about it 24h on 24 for the next year.
Aye, they would harp on it endlessly. They'd do specials on every news station with titles like "Are we safe?" and "Could it happen to you?" -- they'd probably even have a made for TV movie about it.

And it is used a excuse to get more power to the administration and less to you because the administration say: Never mind that we didn't have done our job to protect you correctly, we are in a crisis and we need to take even more power from you to be able to protect you even more......
Yep, it would be inevitable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsyVd_Kqp-8&eurl=

Keith Olbermann takes a look at Bush's claims about thwarted terrorists plots and fact checks them. Pray tell, what shall he ever find?

Keith Olbermann (count down to no raitings) is a complete azzhat.

http://marklevinshow.com/keith.php