Well, attempting to promote fear and hatred with gay marriage isn't working so well right now. Being gay just isn't as evil as it used to be. With Hollywood stars coming out and TV shows having gay people in them, even the sacred cow of marriage isn't rallying the faithful as much as they would like.

Same-sex couples can currently marry in five states (New Hampshire, Iowa, Massachusetts, Vermont and Connecticut) and the District of Columbia, and, strangely enough, the world hasn't ended. The Anti-Christ hasn't gone on a murder spree and killed all good Christians in their bedrooms at night. Every straight married person hasn't woken up and found their marriage worthless (well, at least not more worthless then before:).

So, it's time for a new crusade to get people to attack something.

Yes, it's Islam.

While we have the thread here Christians: "Islam is Not a Religion" (http://thedruidsgrove.org/eq/forums/showthread.php?t=19608), it's now moved past that into official GOP policy that all Islam is a threat in the USA and is more than just not a religion, but a "cult" that seeks to destroy America.

The harsh Republican response to President Barack Obama's defense of a mosque near ground zero marks a dramatic shift in the party's posture toward Islam — from a once active courtship of Muslim voters to a very public tolerance after Sept. 11 to an openly aired sense of mistrust.

Republican leaders have largely abandoned former President George W. Bush's post-Sept. 11 rhetorical embrace of American Muslims and his insistence — always controversial inside the party — that Islam is a religion of peace. This weekend, former Bush aides were among the very few Republicans siding with Obama, as many of the party's leaders have moved toward more vocal denunciations of Islam's role in violence abroad and suspicion of its place at home.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=73970F80-18FE-70B2-A80D70412CF038CB

Naturally, with only a very small percent of the American population being Muslim and since most of the people who get upset at this policy of fear and hatred are already voting Democratic, the Democrats are mostly silent on this issue.

Obama had the guts to speak up and was immediately accused of all kinds of the same crap that we have heard before. Everything from he's an idiot who doesn't take terrorists seriously (never mind the "war on terror", even if the term isn't used, is killing more terrorists then ever and Obama has ramped up the fight), to he hates America and seeks to destroy it, to, of course, he's secretly a Muslim himself.

Yup, I'd like to say the collective IQ of the USA has been dropping for years now but that wouldn't be true. It's always been in the single digits.

FUD sure seems like a good drawing point to a lot of people. Must be our brains are either wired that way or not.

http://punditkitchen.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/political-pictures-gay-fabr.jpg

While we have the thread here Christians: "Islam is Not a Religion", it's now moved past that into official GOP policy that all Islam is a threat in the USA and is more than just not a religion, but a "cult" that seeks to destroy America.
Some of these brave defenders of the Constitution, the free market, limited government, and private property rights are proposing the use of eminent domain to prevent the Muslim community center near the WTC from being built (http://blog.timesunion.com/capitol/archives/29821/paladino-would-use-eminent-domain-to-block-mosque/).

Same-sex couples can currently marry in five states (New Hampshire, Iowa, Massachusetts, Vermont and Connecticut) and the District of Columbia,Add California to the list in two days.

Yay for smart judges who actually believe in the Constitution.While we have the thread here Christians: "Islam is Not a Religion", it's now moved past that into official GOP policy that all Islam is a threat in the USA and is more than just not a religion, but a "cult" that seeks to destroy America.They're just recycling an old tactic.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/70/Praemonitus_Praemunitus_-_The_Protocols_of_the_Wise_Men_of_Zion_-_The_Beckwith_Company_%281920%29.jpg/395px-Praemonitus_Praemunitus_-_The_Protocols_of_the_Wise_Men_of_Zion_-_The_Beckwith_Company_%281920%29.jpg

Looks like the Democrats are jumping on the bandwagon.

WASHINGTON – The Senate's top Democrat on Monday came out against plans to build a mosque near the site of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, moving away from President Barack Obama on the controversial election-year issue.

Locked in a tight race, Nevada Sen. Harry Reid became the highest profile Democrat to respond to Obama, who last week backed the right for the developers to build a mosque near ground zero. Since his comments Friday, the Democratic president and his aides have worked to explain the statement, which drew criticism from Republicans and Democrats alike.

"The First Amendment protects freedom of religion," said Jim Manley, a Reid spokesman. "Senator Reid respects that, but thinks that the mosque should be built some place else."

So two blocks is no good, and "should be built some place else". So is three blocks ok? How about 10?

Perhaps just no mosques in NYC at all? Or, more likely, none in the USA.

Yes, let's stoop down to the level of the haters, because standing up to principle doesn't get you votes. While pandering to hate and fear (idiots) does.

Perhaps just no mosques in NYC at all? Or, more likely, none in the USA.

Sounds like a good start.

I am more for religious freedom. I don't have any religion and I don't want anyone trying to tell me about going to hell for not believing, but I think that anyone should be able to believe whatever they want. Ands if that means that there is a mosque in NYC, so be it. There are synagogues and churches, so what not? Religious freedom was one of the founding ideas of our country. If we cant stand up for that NOW why should we continue to exist as the same country?

Sounds like a good start.

If you are actually serous and not trolling or being sarcastic, then there isn't much I can say.

Government run religious restrictions are something that people came to America to get away from. Imposing them now means abandoning the very principles this nation was founded on.

Perhaps you feel it is time to abandon those principles. All I can say is the world loses something very important every time the United States gives up the values that make it the nation that others look up to.

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin

That's the best quote I can come up with in two seconds of thinking. Ironically, the "World Trade Center mosque" (a misnomer) doesn't even involve any safety issue at all. The community center (which has a mosque as a small part of it) is zero risk to anyone. It is nothing more than denying religious freedom because of fear, hatred and ignorance.

If you are actually serous and not trolling or being sarcastic, then there isn't much I can say.

Government run religious restrictions are something that people came to America to get away from. Imposing them now means abandoning the very principles this nation was founded on.

Those same religious pilgrims, sanctioned by their government, burned women at the stake for being witches.

We don't do that anymore, do we. Because we are better people now, but just barely.

One day in the future, we will be better than we are now, and find all religions as equally offensive; as you find burning women at the stake for being witches. Or blowing yourself up to kill other people in the name of your god Allah.

Yes, I am absolutely serious. One day, your great great great grandchildren will look back at you religious nuts, and think the same of you, as you do of witch burning and book burning.

Eventually, we will become rational humans, maybe requiring an evolution of sorts. Where we no longer believe in invisible beings, ghosts, zombies, and spirits which control our lives. And we can tear down the temples edified for their worship.

It is nothing more than denying religious freedom because of fear, hatred and ignorance.
How about realizing that all religions are based, founded upon, on fear, hatred, and ignorance.



Not in my lifetime, certainly. But people will eventually become rational. And belief in the supernatural will be only available in the books of history and fiction, of how horrible mythology and superstition are to humans.

Eventually, we will become rational humans, maybe requiring an evolution of sorts. Where we no longer believe in invisible beings, ghosts, zombies, and spirits which control our lives. And we can tear down the temples edified for their worship.A belief in the supernatural is instinctive in most humans, so that will not happen any time soon, especially without eugenics, since religious zealots breed more.

In the meantime, we can't allow one fear-mongering con artist to corner the religion market. If churches are allowed, mosques should also be allowed.

This has to continue until the people choose, of their own free will, to reject religion.

It is instinctual to want to kill people who make us angry too. It is instinct for males to rape females. But most of us have moved past that. And we are able to contain, and compartmentalize, our instincts. Rational people do that.

We can start with one obscene cult at a time.
And Islam is one of the most obscene cults in existence, right now.

I know I have no common ground with you, Tudamorf. For you deny that the Earth revolving around the Sun causes global warming, as so does the rotation of the Earth around its axis. When any 5 year old, who has experienced the season or day and night, knows differently. Having a discussion with you is like having a discussion with a person from the 11th century, when the Sun revolved around the Earth.

We need to start with one cult at a time.
And considering that Islam is the most extreme, obscene, and murderous cult right now, seems like a good start, to start with them. Give us a couple hundred years, we will get to the others.

If churches are allowed, mosques should also be allowed.
.
Why?


Because of your Liberal notions of fairness, and equality.

Are all cults to be treated exactly the same?

Is this a matter of principle on your part, or is it because you can't tell the difference between the two cults?


You don't have the ability to say, that this cult is worse than this other cult?
You don't have the ability to discern the difference between the two?

Ron McNeil sounds like a real winner. He wants to use the powers of government to tell Muslims what they can and cannot do yet on his web page (http://www.ronmcneiluscongress.com/) he claims he's for:

Promotion of Limited Government
Proponent for Free Enterprise
A True Constitutional Conservative

________

Candidate: Islam is against everything America stands for (http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/panama-32000-america-stands.html)

PANAMA CITY — A Congressional candidate told local high school and middle school students Tuesday that Islam’s plan is to destroy the American way of life.

“I’m totally against it. If I had my way, it would pretty much be over my dead body,” said Ron McNeil, a candidate for the U.S. House District 2 seat, who was referring to a controversial plan to build an Islamic center and mosque near Ground Zero in New York City. “That religion is against everything America stands for. If we have to let them build it, make them build it nine stories underground, so we can walk above it as citizens and Christians.”

[More... (http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/panama-32000-america-stands.html)]

Looks like the Democrats are jumping on the bandwagon.
Yeah, Harry Reid is running against a Tea-Party guy, so apparently he thinks he has to stoop to their level. Disappointing.

I heard a bunch of Baptist Tea-partiers are trying to get mosques blocked from their area too.

What is it about Republicans always trying to deny everyone else the rights they enjoy?

It is instinctual to want to kill people who make us angry too. But most of us have moved past that. And we are able to contain, and compartmentalize, our instincts.You mean, like you and Michael Morales? :rolleyes:And considering that Islam is the most extreme, obscene, and murderous cult right now,Christianity is by FAR the most dangerous one.

Why?

Because of your Liberal notions of fairness, and equality.

Are all cults to be treated exactly the same?It has to do with self-preservation, not liberal notions of equality.

If only the majority gets to keep their cult, then everyone who is not a member of that cult is at risk. Even those of us who reject cults altogether.

Christians, as the most dangerous cult on Earth, cannot be allowed to corner the market on fear and mind control.

You mean, like you and Michael Morales?

It is just and fair that murdering rapists die.

I think that justice and fairness are an innate trait.
Experiments on primates show that even they know when something is fair or not. So I am sure that it is not a learned behavior. You could probably unlearn it, or not possess it as a trait, of course.

And if one were to say that justice and fairness is an innate trait, then hopefully this trait will be with us for as long as the trait to murder exists.

I hold no anger for Michael Morales. If anger exists, it is with those in the legal system who subvert justice and fairness.

Michael Morales raped, tortured, mutilated, and murdered a 17 year old girl.
http://imgs.sfgate.com/c/pictures/2009/02/21/mn-executions22__0496096724.jpg

It is fair and just that he die for his crime.

It is just and fair that murdering rapists die.Because you don't like him.

And you want him to die.

That instinct doesn't go away in a few hundred years, and neither will the god gene. It will take quite a bit of focused evolution to eliminate it.

focused evolution....interesting concept

Because you don't like him.

And you want him to die.

That instinct doesn't go away in a few hundred years, and neither will the god gene. It will take quite a bit of focused evolution to eliminate it.
You can't focus evolution.

Traits are retained, even when they are no longer necessary.

If you provide ground level bushels of food to a giraffe for a thousand generations, it is not going to grow a shorter neck. Just because food is available at ground level.

That is just silly. They will still have long necks. Unless you kill long necked giraffes before they can reproduce.

But some people are born without certain traits, while some are retained.
I happen to have been born without the god gene. Most humans retain that trait.

I suppose that if you were to selectively breed giraffes with shorter and shorter necks, that eventually you would have giraffes with the necks of say dogs. Look what we have done with wolves, selectively bred them to tea cup chihuahuas, or pit bulls, or greyhounds. But that took 60 thousand years to do. But when any of those dogs hear a siren, or a coyote howl,,,what do they do. They are still wolves, and will howl.

Even after 60 thousand years of selective breeding, you can't breed that out of them. They retain that trait.

Because you don't like him. No, because that it is just.

And you want him to die. Yes. He is a murderer and rapist. He sliced off her boobs. Beat her head in 23 times with a hammer.
He deserves to die. Which is just and fair.

We have a fairness and justice gene in us.
Even primates like chimpanzees have that gene.
Maybe you were born without a justice or fairness gene, just like I was born without the god gene.

Yes. He is a murderer and rapist. He sliced off her boobs. Beat her head in 23 times with a hammer.
He deserves to die. Which is just and fair.http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100819/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_saudi_justiceSaudi judge considers paralysis punishment

CAIRO – A Saudi judge has asked several hospitals in the country whether they could damage a man's spinal cord as punishment after he was convicted of attacking another man with a cleaver and paralyzing him, the brother of the victim said Thursday.

Abdul-Aziz al-Mutairi, 22, was left paralyzed and subsequently lost a foot after a fight more than two years ago. He asked a judge in northwestern Tabuk province to impose an equivalent punishment on his attacker under Islamic law, his brother Khaled al-Mutairi told The Associated Press by telephone from Saudi Arabia.

He said one of the hospitals, located in Tabuk, responded that it is possible to damage the spinal cord, but it added that the operation would have to be done at another more specialized facility. Saudi newspapers reported that a second hospital in the capital Riyadh declined, saying it could not inflict such harm.

Administrative offices of two of the hospitals and the court in Tabuk were closed for the Saudi weekend beginning Thursday and could not be reached for comment.

Saudi Arabia enforces strict Islamic law and occasionally doles out punishments based on the ancient legal code of an eye-for-an-eye.See, that Saudi judge is just like you. Same instinct.

Michael Morales hurt you (by doing something bad to someone you like), so you want to hurt him.

The Saudis call it "justice" too.

You can't focus evolution.Of course you can. You can breed out traits rather quickly (relative to evolutionary time) if you make a concerted effort.

There are definitely some people born without the god gene, and I'm one of them. If we all interbred and reinforced our instinct with atheistic ideology, "god" would be dead in short order.

Now in our society, people are too afraid to be called Nazis, so we can't even speak of selective breeding without an angry mob forming to lynch us just to prove that they aren't Nazis. But that doesn't mean it isn't possible.

People still think Obama is a muslim... (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/thefix/morning-fix/-1-2-3-1.html?nav=rss_email/components).
Not surprisingly, there was a strong linkage between those who wrongly believe Obama is a Muslim and those who disapprove of the job he is doing as president. Of the 41 percent who disapprove of the job he is doing, fully two-thirds identify say the President is a Muslim.

In terms of political affiliation, the sharpest rise in those who say Obama is a Muslim is among Republicans (up 14 points) since 2009. But, the religion question is also not purely partisan; among independents the number of those describing Obama as a Muslim is up eight points since last March and the number of Democrats identifying him correctly as a Christian is down from 55 percent to 46 percent.
I guess stupidity is contagious.

Oh this one is even better:


Are Americans total numbskulls? (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/achenblog/2010/08/are_americans_total_numbskulls.html)

God help us. Could so many Americans really be that dumb, ill-informed, paranoid, gullible and goofy? It must be tricky being Barack Obama, winding down the U.S. presence in volatile Iraq, trying to keep Afghanistan from degenerating, pondering war with Iran, even as, according to the latest bulletin, one in five Americans thinks he is a Muslim.

People still think Obama is a muslim... (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/thefix/morning-fix/-1-2-3-1.html?nav=rss_email/components)I wish he were a Muslim.

A Muslim president leading a Christian fundamentalist nation, now that would be four years of pure entertainment.

Because you don't like him.

And you want him to die.
I have no feelings towards him.
He just happens to be the murderer who changed my opinion from anti-death penalty to pro-death penalty.



That instinct doesn't go away in a few hundred years, and neither will the god gene. It will take quite a bit of focused evolution to eliminate it.
I suppose by focused evolution you mean eugenics. Where we selectively breed good genes in people. I thought you were against eugenics.

See, that Saudi judge is just like you. Same instinct.
I suppose most humans retain a fairness gene.

Michael Morales hurt you (by doing something bad to someone you like), so you want to hurt him.
Nope, never knew her. He never hurt me.
I was friends with his brother Chris Morales, though.

The Saudis call it "justice" too.
I am sure if some intelligent alien were to come down to observe us...

That it would think that punishing someone with boredom for killing and raping another innocent member of our species is very very unfair and unjust penalty.

Spare me your 1984 newspeak witticisms. I will write them for you, save you the effort.
Freedom is Slavery.
Fairness isn't Fair.

I guess stupidity is contagious.



The average IQ is 100.
Which means that half of Americans are less than that.

I suppose most humans retain a fairness gene.It's not "retained". It's a by-product of the cooperative nature of our species.

When someone else is treated unfairly, we instinctively empathize with their situation and feel wounded, as if we were the ones being treated unfairly (assuming of course we start off with no contrary feelings).

Just as you feel about Michael Morales.

You can label it "fairness" or "justice" or whatever you want, but it is what it is.

He hurt you, and now you want to hurt him.

I suppose by focused evolution you mean eugenics. Where we selectively breed good genes in people. I thought you were against eugenics.Paying attention isn't your forte, is it?

The average IQ is 100.
Which means that half of Americans are less than that.

And that is one of the saddest facts I have ever heard.