I dont have Command of Tunare yet but i've heard that charming some frogs in PoS is possible. Also, soloing Giants, and pretty much any other mobs in the zone... I'd like to know how. Could anyone elaborate on their methods?

You can't without CoT.

There are two type of frogs there. The frogs at zonein are (all?) too high to charm. These are the storm-drenched nophtans, etc. If you hug the wall to the right and go under the water tunnel, you get to the forest area. There are about 7 (hurricane|typhoon) lorok frogs in the forest on about a 15-20 min timer that don't summon. They are all charmable with CoT and i think they are all uniformly level 60.

If you're playing at 2am and have the zone to yourself, using one forest frog to kill the others is a viable option, although you will find yourself sitting and waiting for respawn about half the time. Otherwise, you can attempt to drag the frog elsewhere (if you try it, you'll see the reason for using the word 'attempt'. . . pathing there is horrid) to kill something else that doesn't summon in the zone. The only things i've found are the frogs at zonein. They are decent to kill, but the humans in the cave will assist them so you have to harmony to pull them from the caves. I've also heard of people using the frogs to kill summoners, but i haven't figured out how yet. I kill a couple of giants, get a charm break and have to use exodus. Then, if i try again, i get a charm break and end up quite dead.

The kill methods are same as any other charming. Snare, glamour, charm, haste frog. DS, regen, and skin are pretty worthless when stuff is hitting for 610 so i don't bother, which frees up some spell slots. I tend to use a cleric healbot to heal my frog but you could just as easily use disposable pets. As for pulling, the only aggro things in the forest are the frogs and static giants. Nothing assists the forest frogs except other frogs, but if you pull snakes/trees/bears you'll get some assists. Everything in the forest except the frogs does summon.

Coming from rat-charming in PoD, the one thing i had to learn quickly was you can't get hit by the frogs. In PoD, they will tear you up fast, but the PoS frogs can literally kill you before you can move even if you are on your toes. Even if you survive with a few hps, they frequently proc a dot which can kill you moderately quickly. When in doubt, kite farther away. CoT has a longer cast time than CoK, so you really need to either cast from max range or get some range IV item.

"Everything in the forest except the frogs does summon."

This is not true. The Storm bears and Trees with the longer name don't summon.

Thanks, didn't know that. I only tried one bear and one tree, figuring they all summoned since those did. What are the specific names of the ones that dont? Are they pretty good to kill? I presume they have friends that add so at least the pull would be more difficult.

"a storm gruezok" does not summon.

They are druid, will try to root you, cast moonfire, etc.

Not sure which tree's do not summon.

Storm Gruezoks and Beleaguered Ents do not summon. They both are druid casters, and will attempt to root/nuke/DoT/annul you. You cannot really pull them, as they tend to stay in one place and cast repeatedly (even if you run out of range, it takes a long while for them to decide to actually move after you).

Any snake, bear or tree in range WILL assist (as will armadillos in the other sections). Snakes are especially hard to see, they wander, and they do summon. You can be trying to kill a tree off in one corner and all of a sudden find yourself with a couple of snakes on your back.

Killing a summoning mob with a pet is pretty much the same as anywhere else. You buff the pet, attack the mob, and hope you kill it before charm breaks (or gets dispelled). If it breaks, hit exodus (or hope you get really lucky with egress).

On those mobs that assist.. Harmony works extremely well.

Does duo charming work well on summoners? Obviously if both charms break at the same time you'd still be in trouble, but barring that when charm breaks the bad guy should start hitting the other pet and not doing any naughty druid-summoning right? I've started a chanter and thought this might be a good way to do xp when i get beckon or command of druzzil (if beckon is high enough).

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>There are about 7 (hurricane|typhoon) lorok frogs in the forest on about a 15-20 min timer that don't summon.[/quote]

hehe, I thought this was pretty funny=)

Druid+enchanter+cleric works extremely well...it's sufficient to kill even minibosses relatively safely, and should be enough for Drornok (though I haven't actually tried Drornok with fewer than 5 people).

Duoing with almost any caster class, or bard, usually works pretty well against giants, even if the other person can't charm a second frog.

"Does duo charming work well on summoners?"

It does but not like that. Two CoT druids and one pet works great, if one gets summoned all he has to do is get clear while the other recharms.

To answer the question about 2 charmers. I've found it better to have 2 pets rather than just 1. 2 pets is relatively no risk while 1 pet and a charm break on a summoning mob usually = death or evac.

I've been able to move the forest frogs around the zone, but it's risky. You literally have to walk toe to toe with the frog thru the underwater cave to get him to follow. Pathing is horrid and if charm breaks kiss your butt goodbye. You won't be able to outswim the frog.

One other trick that I learned from our overpowered CoD charming chanter friends is to not bother healing your pet when he gets low health. Just invis, break charm and run out of range. Voila - fully healed pet that takes no mana. Recharm, rinse, repeat.

Tried this for the first time yesterday. Pity the frogs run out too quickly.

Any idea on the frogs in the center?

Center frogs summon and (if I remember right) are immune to charm.
Actually, the cleric ones may not summon, but I think they're immune to charm anyway.

In any case, moving the frogs around isn't that bad with some practice. I figured out how to get a frog through the water tunnel finally. I run out over the water section; the frog will turn around and start walking away. If I wait a bit, the frog will come back, and from that point on will follow me through the tunnel, so I can swim out some distance ahead of the frog. Moving to the desert is simple: take the long way around, don't try to cut across the south wall of the forest. If you plan to enter the frog cave with a pet frog, the desert side seems to be the easiest place to enter.

There's 6 Lorok spawns.

All Nophtans are too high to charm.

All frogs in the tornado cave summon and are immune to charm. (Not sure about the cleric tadpoles though, they're animals and within the level restriction, but never tried to make them summon or charm them.)

Beleagured Ents, Storm Gruezoks, and Wanton Tronera don't summon for sure. They're all druids though and they chain cast with a nearly limitless mana pool.

I hypothesize that "A Rock Storm", "A Waterlogged Floran and "A Floral Amalgam" don't summon, however I haven't tried them yet.

Well, now I'm pretty sure that "A Floral Amalgam" doesn't summon, but it's a shaman and it likes to slow my frog, which sucks, then I got 2 adds and egressed, I didn't see it summon, but it may just not have needed to.

Yeah, Floral Amalgams don't summon. I watched a Ranger try to bow kite one once... It was pretty funny.