View Full Forums : What Happened to "Short Buff Box"

06-13-2003, 10:51 AM
Last year at one of the EQ fan faires, we were told that the devs at SOE were working on a new box which would hold short-duration buffs <strong><em>such as</em></strong> bard songs.

Somewhere along the way, though, the concept of a "short buff box" was scaled down into a "song-only box" and Bard was only class which benefitted from having many of its buffs not counting against their groupmates' 15 regular slots.

I'm disappointed that no other class can benefit from a relief feature that has been so long overdue.

When grouping and raiding, most people are still in the same position of having to decide which buffs to keep and which to click off. There are countless times during 'buffing' before big fights when we have to recast the same buffs because an unnecessary buff took the last spot before a needed buff could land.

Then you have short duration buffs, especially from hybrid catsers, that are only cast during fights, and if they take the 15th slot, beneficial effects like cleric Elixir heals and druid SoTW cannot land. Some cannot be clicked off at all (e.g shadowknight 'aura of..'), so if someone gets one of those buffs unexpectedly, they have to sacrifice a 'needed' buff to make room for heal-over-time effects.

My proposal to SOE is that short duration group buffs and short duration effects of <span style="text-decoration:underline">all</span> classes should be examined and where appropriate, filtered to the "short buff box" instead of using up regular buff slots. As for druids, I'd really like to see SoTW and Nature's Recovery redirected to the short box. Even if those abilities aren't retuned (e.g. refresh times lowered), they would still gain some usefulness simply by not using regular buff slots.

Ideally, I'd also like the short buff box capacity increased to eight, which would help retain enough space for bards to twist multiple short-duration songs and still have some room for effects of other classes.


06-13-2003, 11:24 AM
I dont think they need to increase the size of it. However it would be nice if SoTW, Elixer, and some of those SK buffs went there too.

06-13-2003, 11:28 AM
I could not agree more, Firemynd.

However, if there were bard songs, elixirs, sotw, torpors, paragons of spirit, and SK buffs gooing in this box, then it would need to have more slots.

06-13-2003, 11:43 AM
You know, I hadn't thought about that before but it really is a good idea.

06-13-2003, 06:06 PM
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>However, if there were bard songs, elixirs, sotw, torpors, paragons of spirit, and SK buffs gooing in this box, then it would need to have more slots. [/quote]Not if you code it so if these buffs are the 6th man out, they just go to the normal buff window...

That couldn't be too hard.. And certainly wouldn't be unfair~

Aldarion Shard
06-13-2003, 06:53 PM
good point. buff stacking in general (your specific example, making certain buffs stack like songs, is one such) is an unexplored area for new expansions.

I wonder if druid group appeal enhancement could be that easy. Stackable damage shields (stackable like dots, where 1 per player can stack)...

it would be balanced by buff slots if it tooka normal one, but maybe song versions could be added for raiding (standard raid-only buff balancing factors such as components, mana cost, recast time, could be used here).

06-13-2003, 08:15 PM
Have you checked it out with proc'ing weapons, or with a cleric or paladin? Try useing a proc with fleeting fury or something and see if that goes in there. If you have a cleric or paly, try yaulp and see where that goes.

It really sounded to me, that is about the duration of 'short buffs' they were talking about...the one that are blinking already when it lands on you.

06-13-2003, 10:00 PM
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Have you checked it out with proc'ing weapons, or with a cleric or paladin? Try useing a proc with fleeting fury or something and see if that goes in there. If you have a cleric or paly, try yaulp and see where that goes.[/quote]

This isn't something new on the test server. The 'song box' went to live servers months ago, so there is nothing to "check" that hasn't already been checked and cofirmed a thousand times over. No spells -- regardless of duration -- land in that buff box; only bard songs are flagged as eligible for those six slots.

I'm just wondering why SOE changed direction. What they announced at a fan faire would have been a great relief for several classes, yet they chose to restrict its use to only one.

In the light of a hard nerf to soloing in PoP (second nerf for charm soloers in the past two months), SOE is apparently bent on forcing soloers to seek grouping in spite of the fact that groups don't seem to want them.

Alan asked why we believe groups don't prefer druids, and asked for suggestions on what SOE could do to improve the situation.

One among many answers, is that other players cannot possibly appreciate some of our most group-oriented abilities when those effects constantly bounce off people with full buffs. A viable solution to would be to allow more short duration (non-song) effects to land in the song box instead of taking up the slots where players prefer to see their most beneficial long duration buffs.


06-13-2003, 11:02 PM
Have to agree. I have <em>never</em> been in a group where I've had every slot in my Song box taken up. In fact, I can never remember a time where I've had more than 4 Bard songs on me at once, and even then that is rare.

There are a lot of spells that could benefit from this besides just songs. I can rarely cast my aggro/de-aggro visage spells on people. Of course, for other classes it'd be really nice to have HoT spells go into that box as well.

Personally, I think short buffs should go differently than songs though. Where Songs go in the song box all the time unless there is no room, short buffs should go in the buff box all the time unless there is no room and then flow over to the song window.

Aidon Rufflefuzz
06-13-2003, 11:18 PM
You're personal icon still scares the hell outta me Canta.

Hold me.

06-16-2003, 02:14 PM
It was awhile ago, but I think the wording was something like, songs, and other short duration buffs.

With that, yaulp, fleeting fury, haste procs would go in there.

Haven't tried it myself, and I didn't keep up with it. I don't usually have so many buffs that I have to worry about it either way.

06-17-2003, 12:09 PM
at the very least they should expand it to heal over times and taps/recourse spells. SK/necro grp taps are great but annoying as hell when they're not the ones that benefit you.

As a druid the nice atk bonus from SK's __ of hate taps are not worth not being able to be healed =p

Falamil Woodhelven
06-17-2003, 12:32 PM
In my groups four of those slots are filled already.

If you want the other two, no skin off my back. Until, that is, a bard has to start dropping songs because all the crap has now been diverted to the song box.

Speaking of which, have you ever looked at the buffs people spam you with on raids? AGI buffs? ATK buffs? Come on. I play a melee on most raids and I can clear at least three buff slots just looking at what is useful to me and what isn't.