View Full Forums : Just how bad the CS really is


Oryane
11-16-2003, 03:00 AM
Many of you probably know, but for those of you who don't 3 time enabled guilds took on Kerafrym tonight on Rallos Zek. They were set to win it. They got him down to 25% and were still going full force. Then he despawned. GMs claim to have not despawned him, but they also claim that "Classes are not that out of balance". Some people say it is because he has to be alive in EQ2, but they should've thought about that before creating EQ2 and who cares? Tons of mobs have been killed that would as alter lore in EQ2. Aren't they supposed to be 2 completely different games anyways? GMs aren't going to do anything for the 3 and a half hours they spent on it either. Everyone from every server was piled into chat channels keeping up on it. There were AT LEAST 6 channels completely full of people. This is just depressing that they would do this. A reason some people are trying to say is that the zone is on a set timer after Sleeper is awoken however that isn't feasible considering Sleeper zone has had to go down before it was updated and it didn't do it this time. *sigh* It really sucks when GMs go out of their way just to F*** up your day. The guilds were Wudan, Ascending Dawn, and I can't remember the third's name. If you ask me I think that THIS should be the thing people are standing down for.

Tiane
11-16-2003, 03:48 AM
Magus Imperialis Magicus

And yes, it's quite a disgrace, and unfortunately typical of SoE CS.

Nice of them to waste 4 hours of 170+ peoples times, plus at least 1000+ watching via the channels and ooc's...

Cantatus
11-16-2003, 04:11 AM
Ironically, it attracted more attention than any event Sony or Verant ever created..,

Centain
11-16-2003, 08:48 AM
A bit ticked that they would go to the zone, watch them do this, see people taking 15+ deaths on each toon...

and quietly laugh to themselves knowing they are going to depop him anyways without telling anyone.

Would have much more respect if they just said /shout Dont waste your experience, we are despawning him anyways.

Drake09
11-16-2003, 09:39 AM
Sony's first responds said they didn't despawn him, was z bug in the code.

Chenier
11-16-2003, 10:27 AM
Aw man...that sucks...

Way to go, Sony. =P

Oryane
11-16-2003, 11:41 AM
See, Thats the thing. EVERYONE that was on at the time knew about if and to some extent was following it. As of now, I have no respect for them. They DAMN well better impress me with the melee reconstructuring they have been promising soon.

Kuolon
11-16-2003, 12:33 PM
All I have to say is /rude GMs and /rude SoE

If they don't want a mob to be killed remove it from the game or make it untargettable.

Panamah
11-16-2003, 01:39 PM
I heard it was a Z axis bug and it just despawned on his own.

MadroneDorf
11-16-2003, 03:18 PM
I call BS on that, its just an excuse

Daeloan
11-16-2003, 04:36 PM
http://home.comcast.net/~oldphone/matt/gm.jpg

Wyte
11-16-2003, 04:42 PM
Dengit! I missed it!

Some pretty kewl shots on MiM's site here (http://www.mimrz.com). Ascending Dawn (http://www.ascendingdawn.com/) may also have some stuff on it, not sure. I dunno what Wudan's site address is.

They must have code explicitly despawning mobs due to Z axis (be it a bug or not). It's pretty pathetic that a wolf can hit me from under the world in Western Wastes and yet an epic mob poofs when it hits Z problems.

/boggle

And that had better not count as the flag that awoke the sleeper. The RZ server has waited a loong time for the Sleeper, and there's a bit of history to it, iirc.

Wyte WorldKnot

Wyte
11-16-2003, 04:55 PM
Oh my, drama! Some say Z axis, and one GM says Development did it on purpose.

Here's what gets me... If Development really "doesn't want it killed", then there must be a reason.

[list=1]
The script will fail if the Sleeper is killed. Okay, so what... scripts have failed before.
Roleplaying; the Sleeper is supposed to show up later. Okay fine, but let the players have their fun and bring the Sleeper back anyway. Just like there's several versions of some gods.
The sleeper has loot that SOE doesn't want players to have and/or even see; placed on it for whatever motive.
[/list=1]

Who knows what the truth is anyway, since I doubt they'll come out with a statement.

Chenier
11-16-2003, 06:36 PM
Originally posted by Wyte
[list=1]
The sleeper has loot that SOE doesn't want players to have and/or even see; placed on it for whatever motive.
[/list=1]

cloth cap! uber!

Moorgard
11-16-2003, 11:16 PM
Just to put one conspiracy theory to rest, there is no plot to keep Kerafyrm alive for the sake of EverQuest II. Killing the Sleeper on any EQ server would have absolutely no impact on the story of our game.

It's not like we're running around trying to stop EQ players from killing Sir Lucan or Lord Nagafen, and both those mobs play an important role in EQ2.

Fyyr Lu'Storm
11-16-2003, 11:39 PM
"I did not have a 13 year relationship with that woman".

Tiane
11-17-2003, 01:52 AM
FYI, copied from monkly-biz (http://pub147.ezboard.com/fmonklybusiness43508frm1.showMessage?topicID=42417 .topic)

Kurakai Khan
Young Grasshoppah
Posts: 10
(11/16/03 10:01 pm)
Reply Re: .
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What a freaking fun event.

Well until the despawn.

Just to clarify, we killed the FA before pulling the last warder (only warder 1 was up when we entered, it's what everyone leaves up until respawn). The FA respawned after Kera popped at 26% so it wasn't "Normal" respawn.

The GMs said the script was bugged, and gave everyone involved 20% real xp and 2 aa's and invited us to try him again. As of now he is confirmed back sleeping again.

Was one of the funnest events I have ever participated in, in some 4 years of eq I have played.

Will keep you updated as to what happens next

Kurakai

Transcendent of Ascending Dawn.
Rallos Zek

A nice gesture. I wonder if they'll try again. Organizing and motivating 170+ people once would be hard enough. Doing it again after such a FUBAR result would be a miracle.

Fanra
11-17-2003, 06:56 AM
The GMs said the script was bugged, and gave everyone involved 20% real xp and 2 aa's and invited us to try him again. As of now he is confirmed back sleeping again.
Hopefully this post will stop the hatred of Sony.

At least on this issue :)

Macnbaish
11-17-2003, 11:25 AM
I bet they're scrambling to itemize him now ;)

Chenier
11-17-2003, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by Macnbaish
I bet they're scrambling to itemize him now ;)
hello?! CLOTH CAP!!!! =)

okay, Sony, ya dun gud

Wyte
11-17-2003, 12:46 PM
Yay Sony and GM's! I didn't know they cared so much about this.

Hrmmm.... I doubt he has a loot table, but what kind of items should the Sleeper have?

IMO artifacts (and plenty of em) because he won't ever be back, plus something for everyone.

How 'bout:
Manastone that can be used anywhere
Original Donals BP
Original Druid Vox scimitar - the original one that procs the uber hitting pet, which can be buffed
.. other uber stuff

Yeah yeah, this is all unbalancing stuff, but there'd only be one per server ever!

For everyone:
2 or 3 million PP for split :)

Dang, you know... this really is how artifacts should enter the game. Kill an "unkillable" mob requiring many high end guilds cooperating, on a "once per server" mob.

Wyte

Wyte
11-17-2003, 01:11 PM
Some Rallos Zek server history:

Rallos Zek has a history of players who "grief" other players. Be it by corpse camping, bind camping, zone camping, KS'ing, or any number of other things.

Basically, a "rule" of sorts was made regarding the 4 warders in Sleepers Tomb. You may kill any 3 of the warders, but leave a 4th one up.

Killing the 4th warder is considered griefing those that are up and coming behind you, so to speak, since much of the loot changes once the Sleeper is awakened. Everyone has stuck by this rule, which is a real testiment to all Sleepers capable guilds on RZ.

Oh, by the way, you can transfer characters now with all of your items. Come over to the RZ server, the best one of them all!

Wyte

Stewwy
11-17-2003, 02:06 PM
I refuse to believe The Sleeper is itemized.

Ariell
11-17-2003, 02:21 PM
You can bet he'll be itemized now for the 2nd fight. SOE will not miss this chance to muck around and turn this debacle into a PR win for themselves; that's how they think.

Wyte
11-17-2003, 02:45 PM
It looks like a Catch 22.

If the Sleeper is itemized, all servers are going to want their 'one shot' at it again.

If the Sleeper is not itemized, people are inevitably going to lay into SOE for that as well, seeing the amount of effort that's been put into it.

I'm not sure that there's a way where people won't be upset. Well, maybe if all servers were reset to pre-awakened Sleeper to give everyone one more chance might do it. Hrmm, a non-itemized sleeper would seem the less damaging PR move of the two, since it only affects one server.

Nimchip
11-17-2003, 02:46 PM
we got him to 26% and he depoped.. cry.

our guildpage was updated right after we engaged and people were uploading screenshots the whole time, however, its is down right now because we have had SOOOOOOOOO many hits on it..

heck it was down when kerafym was at 40% due to the page hits.

it was an awesome event and i'd like to extend my thanks to the members of wudan and mim who came to wake the sleeper with us.

as for why he depoped at 26%, no one is sure.. the gm's claim they didn't depop him, and don't know why he did. some people are arguing that it was a time thing, but what is odd is that he depoped after 3 hours and 2 minutes or so.. i.e. it was an odd %, and it was an odd amount of time for him to depop after.

and to those who will say that the taiwan guild got him down to 15% or whatever:
1. that is a localized version of eq.. not sure how much soe monitors it or how it really is run in relation to the normal servers.
2. they were utilizing a bug with negative hp regen by the sleeper... we weren't.. (this bug hit many mobs in eq a week and a half ago or so.. remember the patch, and then the serverside patch the night after? - that's when the taiwain guild did theirs.. they day of the patch) how can i prove the difference? it took approximately 60 of them less than an hour to get him to 15%.. it took 160+ of us 3 hours and 2 minutes to get im to 26% using time gear and weapons.. they were using velious era gear/weapons.. also, during times when he'd get pushed onto the bubble and we were unable to keep much dmg up on him he would regen a bit of hp, i watched it happen a few times


also note, this isn't the same sleeper that was asleep during velious era.. he's been buffed up.. he hits for 6999 dmg not 2k as he did during velious, he still procs dt, and can cast dt though.

i was playing a warrior named dexsta during the fight, as my main (a mage named daetien) isn't keyed.. it was a great fight and i'm glad i was a part of it... all in all i blame buggy programming on soe's part for the depop.. not a gm.. why? because the gm could have depoped it anytime starting at about 85% when he showed up.. but instead he hung around for 2 more hours and watched us.. besides, with 3/4 of the eq population online at the time cheering for us it would be mighty stupid to depop the mob and piss sooooo many people off...
from:
http://www.thesteelwarrior.org/forum/showthread.php?threadid=4345

okay, heres the scoop:

apparently the reason it "despawned" was that the script takes around 3hours and 15 mins to complete totally, but since we didn tlet him move along with his script, when he reached that point fa simply respawned. They assure us that it's been fixed and have respawned sleeper + all 4 warders.

also, gms will be replacing all lost exp and giving everyone who attended last night 2 aa's. Furthermore, due to the high request for titles, IF we win, discussion will be opened between us and gms and possible titles will be awarded.

Meaning were giving it another shot, tomorrow. Tune in to serverwide.enchanter:enchanter or rallos.sleeper where im sure constant updates will be given.

He goes down tomorrow.
from:
http://www.therunes.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1036

Tubben
11-17-2003, 02:51 PM
Originally posted by Wyte
Some Rallos Zek server history:Oh, by the way, you can transfer characters now with all of your items. Come over to the RZ server, the best one of them all!

Wyte

RZ dont have a european ep capable guild =).

Beside this, meeting our old hated enemys, the Prophets (Now called Ascending Dawn - even if i believe not many of the old Prophets still play), would be fun, hehe.

Tubby

Oryane
11-17-2003, 03:00 PM
I think they should have the Sleeper as a mob that always spawns when the 4 warders are killed. Why not just make it where you can only have a chance of killing him once a month though? They would seriously need some major planning and if the gms saw it as getting easier they'd be able to beef him up more. It'd basically be an event where you would need 3 guilds like this to kill him. Not many people could pull it off but there would be some.

Regnon
11-17-2003, 03:26 PM
Dragonslayer

has a nice ring to it for a title.

also big congrats to RZ for keeping the sleeper up as long as they did.

PK server has done what many a blue server has not, swallowed their arguments and pride and kept up a mob and a zone , that to many is the best zone in eq. All Phat lewtz discussion asside.

Scirocco
11-17-2003, 05:04 PM
As for itemization, the solution is clear: 172 cloth caps, one for everyone. And silkscreened on the cap:

"I went to kill Kerafym, and all I got was this cap!"

Centain
11-17-2003, 05:04 PM
Props where theyt are due. Grats sony!

Tiane
11-17-2003, 05:10 PM
Heh, maybe I'm just cynical but I really dont think you can put that down to simply a "greater spirit of cooperation."

Fact is that other people on RZ could literally and legally make playing a living hell for any guild that decided to wake the sleeper before it was commonly decided to do so. Fear of retribution was no small factor in keeping it asleep.

I also expect that, at this point, there's a smaller concentration of a**holes left on RZ due to this same point. The kind of self centred jerks who felt the need to ruin one aspect of their server are protected on bluebie servers, and would never open themselves up to being held accountable to ther peers for their actions.

Anyway, good luck to the RZ guilds on part 2 of the drama!

Perhaps you'll get your gold names! 8)

Aidon
11-17-2003, 06:59 PM
It is so...odd to see Moorgard posting as an EQ employee.

Chenier
11-17-2003, 08:00 PM
Originally posted by Scirocco
As for itemization, the solution is clear: 172 cloth caps, one for everyone. And silkscreened on the cap:

"I went to kill Kerafym, and all I got was this cap!"

YESH! (but add in "stupid" before cap)

Iilane SalAlur
11-17-2003, 09:09 PM
Well, rallos zek people are at it again. Kerafym is at 85% as I type this and their gm-admin is in sleeper's tomb watching them.

Noliniel
11-17-2003, 11:49 PM
4% atm. all 25 sleeper channels are full. each channel can only contain 200 people. 200 x 25 so =p Sleeper engaged at 9%. No warders poped at all.

Noliniel
11-18-2003, 12:11 AM
Dead, no loot :mad:

Ndainye
11-18-2003, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Wyte
The sleeper has loot that SOE doesn't want players to have and/or even see; placed on it for whatever motive.
[/list=1]
[/B]

I would highly doubt that the sleeper has any loot on it at all. If the sleeper is not meant to be killed most likely they never populated the loot for it ie.. cloth caps

Chenier
11-18-2003, 04:29 AM
Absor speaks! (http://eqlive.station.sony.com/community/dev_view.jsp?id=59485)

Tiane
11-18-2003, 05:15 AM
The Sleeper (11-17-03)
Over the weekend several guilds gathered on Rallos to fight with the Sleeper. Unfortunately, their encounter was cut short due to an apparent bug.

I wanted to take a moment here and apologize to those that were there, and to those that have heard about the event through their friends. The bug concerned an NPC in the zone that appeared to have been causing the Sleeper to not focus on the player characters. The decision was made at the time to end the event. Further investigation has only served to make it unclear if this was a real issue or not.

I, on behalf of the company, apologize for any consternation this may have caused during your play time. If anyone is going to defeat the Sleeper, it should be done without any question about the validity of the event. We're very sorry that this first attempt was halted, but at the time it seemed like the best thing to do.

We have resurrected and restored those that participated. We have corrected the potential problem, and have reset the encounter. Other than that one potentially problematic NPC, nothing else about the encounter has been changed.

We want to wish those on Rallos that are planning to tackle the Sleeper the best of luck.

Send me some screenshots of all of you standing around the corpse, I'd love to post them on the site.

Thank you and thanks for understanding,

Alan


Thats pretty vague. If he actually said what specific NPC or what specific issue it was, I'm sure several dozen players could provide relevant logs of the event to show whether or not any "problems" were actually taking place.

Considering that the 2nd fight took basically just as long as the first (less, I believe, but had more people... roughly equivalent, nothing earth shatteringly different), I suspect that there was not much of an issue, if any.

Either way, bottom line is even if there was an issue, it was so minor as compared to the staggering amount of effort that went into the first fight, and the fact that certainly nobody (but some itchy kill-trigger finger gm) noticed anything unusual, the event should not have been interfered with. Thats not understandable. It was a bad decision. It was a mistake. Nobody but the gm's had any question of the validity of the event, and if they were so concerned they could have looked at the data afterwards (or during... surely that would be possible, and if it isnt, you had no right to stop the event to correct a failure of your own tools), and not worry so much that someone's ego at Sony was going to be bruised.

Although, IIRC Kendrick was the guy behind most of ST and Kerafym, and he doesnt work there anymore... so still not sure what they were so worried about.

But I'm glad you apologized on behalf of the gm's that did the deed, and made some amends to the people who had every right to a fair, interference-free fight.

Tip for the future... sometimes the fact that a thing happens (is happening) is more important than whether or not it happens in the "right way." Emotional people are not concerned with correct and incorrect. Step in the way of an emotional event with cries of logic and you will be lynched.

When the whole point of playing EQ is to have fun and experience pleasure, an emotion, then stopping that fun for the sake of it being correct fun means you've lost sight of what the whole game is supposed to be about.

Oryane
11-18-2003, 06:50 AM
It doesn't really matter anymore. They got a second chance and blew away with it. Kerafrym IS dead. :)

Wyte
11-18-2003, 11:12 AM
Awesome post Tiane, I totally agree.

And to continue with my conspiracy theories... Kera prolly had mind bogglingly uber lewt all along 'cuz he was unkillable, and they had to poof it so they could quickly wipe the loot table. :D

No, but seriously, SOE did the right thing afterwards, even if they didn't do the right thing to start off with.

Wyte