View Full Forums : You ungrateful little (people).


Aeg
04-16-2004, 07:07 PM
So, I read several forums very regularly. On quite a few of them the thread of: http://thedruidsgrove.org/forums/showthread.php?t=7200 has come up. So I decided that its about time someone came and told you people, because it is rather obvious that you people really don't get it.

DRUIDS ARE THE WHINEYEST, MOST HATED GROUP OF PLAYERS IN EQ

Thats right, we all hate you. You complain about your nerfs, yes if you look at it, you have absolutely no right to. Druids are probably the most overpowered class in the game. Just look at your numbers? Its a self-purpetuating problem. You use zerg-force tactics to bully your way into getting EVERYTHING YOU WANT. And with a couple of little nerfs, or giving other people stuff to balance the playing field you don't shut up.

A few things.

*Whaaaaaaaa* I can't heal as well as a cleric. Too bad! Clerics do pretty much nothing but healing. Have any of you ever played a cleric? Do you know how stupidly boring it is to CH chain? They get the glory as a necissary class because they have to do the dirty work. Ohhhh you don't get to be as powerful a healer as them. Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* Other people can SoW and people can get SoW with items. Ohhhh muffin. I'm sorry. I was under the impression that SoW was the Shamans before yours anyway. They get it at 9. You get it at 14. Or have you zerg-rushed your way into getting it at level 1 now? Run 5 is almost as fast as SoW? Good! People have spent hard earned Xp (via AA's) to get it. So..... Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* You aren't the only ones that can stop the rain now? What a shame. Other people can now disable a minor annoyance. Hell, the spell should have never been in the game in the first place. Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* You aren' the masters of porting. News flash for you: YOU NEVER WERE. Wizards have always taken that title, and just becuase they do it better than you, you have no right to complain. After all yours is ALMOST AS GOOD. Too bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* You have a crappy pet. Oh really? Perhaps you didn't know this (because I'm sure most of you are just bandwagon jumpers) but Druids shouldn't have summoned pets anyway. Do you want to know why they were thrown in? Because a bunch of druids zerged Verant into giving them pets when Kunark was in pre-release. Awwwww. If yer not happy, then just don't buy the spell. Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* Mage Charm is better than Druid charm. You're kidding right. Seriously. You ARE joking aren't you? Mages get 1 charm spell, Call of the Arch Mage. There are so few elemental-taged mobs in the game, it makes it almost useless, other than on Tak. LDON's. The fact that anyone has the balls to say this shows just how pathetic you are. You already zerged your way into pushing mages out of the #2 nuking spot by lying and pressuring Verant into giving Druids #2 nukes at kunark pre-release. No matter what you want to say, They weren't always #2 spot, 810 at level 50 for mages 650 for druids is not equal. Too bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* They didn't make you more overpowered when they changed a few things to "rebalance" Go to hell. Look at the necros. They've been nerfed more than ANYONE. And they keep on ticking. Too bad. Cry me a river.

I don't know if you people realize how unbalanced you are.

1) Second best nukers in the game
2) Second best healers in the game
3) Best damage shields in the game (1 pt less than mages but yers are so much cheeper)
4) Second best porters
5) Best rooters
6) You have some of the best Ornate gear out there
7) Snare. Do you know how unbelievably overpowered snare / ensnare is? Don't say everyone has it. They don't. You guys do it best. That alone unbalances the class. At least other classes that get it have to re-apply frequently. Yers lasts what? 13 minutes or something dumb like that.
8) Third best DoT spells

If anyone wants to add to the list, please do. I'm sure I'm forgetting a bunch. I'm sure this post will be supressed or deleted, and I woudln't be surprised if my account was banned. But somebody has to call you on your crap. I call BS.

Flame me, threaten me, laugh at me, etc. I really don't care, because I know I have the support of the other classes to back me up. All you can do is delete my post.... and we all know what that proves ;)

CRY ME A RIVER.

~The Army of Aeg~

*edit* even though this is in Unkempt now, please watch the language in the subject lines :)

Chenier
04-16-2004, 07:12 PM
Wow. Take some lithium dude.

Leaving up so that others can enjoy. :ban:

Aidon
04-16-2004, 08:06 PM
Dammit, who let him see the DUCK files?

Stormhaven
04-16-2004, 08:32 PM
Why should I delete it? In fact, when have we really ever deleted any posts that had relevant subject matter? Quite frankly, you didn't directly insult anyone or break any of the other rules we have. The only thing you did wrong was put it into the wrong forum (which I've corrected for you).

Now the question is do you have the <b>data</b> and the <i>stomach</i> to back up your claims? There are more than enough people on this board who will provide hard data (re: logged numbers) to prove you wrong on many of your stereotypes.

...or, you gonna run away and hope to become a martyr by trying to get banned?

Chenier
04-16-2004, 08:35 PM
Opening so Alyn can /cackle

alyn cross
04-16-2004, 08:38 PM
CACKLE!



Thanks Chen!

Aeg
04-16-2004, 08:43 PM
Why should I delete it? In fact, when have we really ever deleted any posts that had relevant subject matter? Quite frankly, you didn't directly insult anyone or break any of the other rules we have. The only thing you did wrong was put it into the wrong forum (which I've corrected for you).

Now the question is do you have the data and the stomach to back up your claims? There are more than enough people on this board who will provide hard data (re: logged numbers) to prove you wrong on many of your stereotypes.

...or, you gonna run away and hope to become a martyr by trying to get banned?

What data would you like. I'm sure I can come up with it. A lot of it is pretty unquantifiable, ie. snare being stupidly overpowered.

I think it was quite funny that the thread was immediately closed for a while btw. First instinct was to not let the thread get any steam?

Mannwin Woobie
04-16-2004, 08:50 PM
In all honesty, this thread has no steam. You have no business coming here and cluttering up the place with this bunch of crap. YOU are whining about Druid's whining? And you are doing it on a Druid board? wtf is that? Trolls are just a waste of bandwith, and I feel like a hypocrite even responding to this....

Oh, the anonymity of the online world. We all get soooo brave when nobody really knows who we are.

Stormhaven
04-16-2004, 09:02 PM
/shrug, I didn't close it. I hardly close any threads. I think "warm" threads are fun - a lot more than the threads that just spew numbers over and over again. I'll delete your posts with no remorse if you go attacking people on a personal level, but after being a guild officer/partial leader of a "end game" guild for nearly a year, quite honestly it takes a lot to get me anywhere near "riled up" status when you're not breaking any of the forum rules.

As for proof, numbers, stuff like that, hell, I dunno. I stopped playing EQ a long time ago, and haven't looked back. I can say that a year ago, when I stopped playing, while druids were up in the top of the "hated" classes, so were quad-kiting wizards, zone-kiting bards, and "snooty" enchanters. Either way, there's always bad and good with any class - just like people and real life.

Strengths vs weaknesses? Sure, the druid can be 2nd or 3rd best at a lot of things - but the one thing you'll see is pretty consistent is that we've always asked Verant, and then SOE for something - one thing - for a useful skill for druids to be #1 at. Snaring or rooting? How often do you need snaring or rooting on a "boss" mob? Not only that - how often will those mobs actually <i>be</i> non-immune to changes in their run speed? Hell, how often do you run into a mob that's not immune? I'm working on PoP-based knowledge, but I know back then, it seemed like the mobs that were worth a damn were usually immune - even just xp-fodder.. Snare made a great aggro device, but that's about it. And aggro is a lovely thing for a caster - especially when we have no way to reduce it.

Kuolon
04-16-2004, 09:16 PM
Your fly is down, Aeg.

Artio
04-16-2004, 09:40 PM
I just don't get it. I don't know of any class that does not have their complaints. Everyone wants to see improvements. That's what keeps the game fun. I guess this person is 100% satisfied with his/her class and feels there is no need for improvement. Hooray for you.

The druids grove is filled with many good ideas. Call it brainstorming.
Heaven forbid someone should come up with a good idea. :eek:

Artio

Aeg
04-16-2004, 10:10 PM
I don't know of any class that does not have their complaints
There is a difference between having complaints and having valid complaints.

[quote]Your fly is down, Aeg.[\quote]
Jealous? Thought so.

Aeg
04-16-2004, 10:13 PM
Oh, and Why did I write this on the druid boards? Because I wanted the community to see how people felt about their whining. Being anonymous? I have my handle posted. If you really wanna find "Aeg" you can probably find it fairly easilly. The point is, if I thought a co-worker was whining about their job when they had it easy I'd tell them they were being a whiney brat too.

For god sakes, if you truely believe that you have it so bad, roll a monk.

Aidon
04-16-2004, 10:39 PM
Haha, there a rather large number of druids with monk alts...or there were when I was still playing.

Panamah
04-16-2004, 10:48 PM
There is a difference between having complaints and having valid complaints.

[quote]Your fly is down, Aeg.[\quote]
Jealous? Thought so.

LOL! I suspect your complaints are always valid.

Aeg
04-16-2004, 10:56 PM
The two things I've complained about:

1) When druids got better/equal nukes than mages when kunark came out
2) When pet canni was nerfed. Was it a valid nerf? Maybe. But they sold the same ability back to us in GoD which bothered me.

So yes. I would say that my complaints when i had them were valid.

Arienne
04-16-2004, 10:59 PM
Oh, and Why did I write this on the druid boards? Because I wanted the community to see how people felt about their whining...I dunno... last time I looked it up the term "people" involved more than one person. I think we know how you feel though, and let me be the first to say your post hit hard! So hard in fact, I think you have nipped all the whining in the bud here! Thanks for the feedback.

Oh! And don't let the door hit you in the backside on the way out!! :twak:

Regnon
04-16-2004, 11:16 PM
wow was i ever wrong.

I could have swore this was a rant, finally targeted at the single most disruptive, evil, down right insenstive and plain MEAN people in all of EQ.



Gnomes... :elfgrin:

Sskeli
04-16-2004, 11:33 PM
I knew you druids were sheltered but to be so ignorant as to not realize there are huge crowds of people (not just necr0z either) who dislike you, and your whining/bitching and your "teacher's pet personna", is amazing. lol


Hell I know people lable us necros rude crude 1337 sp34king teens with acne and no social skills.

Come out from under SOE's desk for a breath of air once in a while.

Kitsune Sama
04-16-2004, 11:52 PM
I like kitties





And pie

Panamah
04-16-2004, 11:56 PM
I like kitties





And pie

I like cute kittens (http://www.blogjam.com/cute_little_kittens/)

Chenier
04-16-2004, 11:57 PM
<-- closed it

<-- also happy she opened it


kitties!

Solice Farwalker
04-17-2004, 12:16 AM
Huge crowds of people hate us? I think there are huge crowds of people that really need to get a life!

Kaige
04-17-2004, 12:55 AM
So true! I shall go delete my druid immediately!

weeeeeeeeeeee


/dies

Megadwen
04-17-2004, 01:07 AM
5) Best rooters

we aren't the best rooters. shaman get an aa that roots a mob for up to 2 minutes i think it is? wizards get the same aa. and for a long time our root did damage which would piss off chanters, whilst other classes roots had no damage factor. but i really dont' care much about this cause i'll only use root to ghetto mez or something.

7) Snare. Do you know how unbelievably overpowered snare / ensnare is? Don't say everyone has it. They don't. You guys do it best. That alone unbalances the class. At least other classes that get it have to re-apply frequently. Yers lasts what? 13 minutes or something dumb like that.

don't even kid yourselves, this only helps when soloing if that. how long does it usually take necro's to kill a mob? prolly not 13 minutes!. and how long does it take for a group to kill something snareable? probably like 1 minute if it's a good group.
and on another point, it's not as if druids are hte only ones to get this skill. rangers get it too, and in fact rangers get an aa that lasts just as long, basically mana free and instant cast. WITH no aggro.
for druids, if the mob isn't snareable and you dont' have time gear, you wont' be killing it, and if the mob summons, same thing.

am i whining or griping about this? nope. just trying to show you that what you may have heard, or what your necro cronies tell you, might not be factual.

oh, and one more thing. to assume one druid speaks for the rest of us is ignorant beyond any standards.

Macnbaish
04-17-2004, 03:13 AM
I like my class.

Many of the "facts" in your post are incorrect.

Grow up.

That is all.

Mendan
04-17-2004, 06:37 AM
Hmmm, let's look at all the nonsense in the first post...

*Whaaaaaaaa* I can't heal as well as a cleric. Too bad! Clerics do pretty much nothing but healing. Have any of you ever played a cleric? Do you know how stupidly boring it is to CH chain? They get the glory as a necessary class because they have to do the dirty work. Ohhhh you don't get to be as powerful a healer as them. Too Bad. Cry me a river.

Riiiight, and that's why every post about healing says we don't want to be as good as clerics, that they should be the top healers, but that we just want to be up to par as secondary healers.

*Whaaaaaaaa* You aren’t the masters of porting. News flash for you: YOU NEVER WERE. Wizards have always taken that title, and just because they do it better than you, you have no right to complain. After all yours is ALMOST AS GOOD. Too bad. Cry me a river.

If you actually knew your EQ history, wizards never had port spells to start out. None. But they were deemed too one dimensional with only nukes and were tossed a bone and given ports. Since then the devs decided to expand on that and give them more porting options, i.e. tanslocate spells. And I don't know any druid, especially with the PoK stones in game, that really cares that the wizard class went that way. Last time I saw a real rant about druids lacking in ports was when you could make money porting people around, what was that a few years ago?

I don't know if you people realize how unbalanced you are.

1) Second best nukers in the game
2) Second best healers in the game
3) Best damage shields in the game (1 pt less than mages but yers are so much cheaper)
4) Second best porters
5) Best rooters
6) You have some of the best Ornate gear out there
7) Snare. Do you know how unbelievably overpowered snare / ensnare is? Don't say everyone has it. They don't. You guys do it best. That alone unbalances the class. At least other classes that get it have to re-apply frequently. Yers lasts what? 13 minutes or something dumb like that.
8) Third best DoT spells

1) Pretty much, no problem there.
2) No problem here either, although there are issues with druid and shaman not being able to heal well enough in GoD. This issues has even been acknowledged by devs who are looking into it, so I'm afraid you can't just claim it's whining and dismiss it.
3) You're kidding, right? Who cares about damage shields? With today's content I don't see them doing much help, and no one is going to invite you to a group or raid because of them.
4) Covered this above.
5) Best rooter? Not only is that wrong (wizzies get mana free unresistable root AA, shaman get same only slightly resistible and very short recast) but how does being able to root make anyone overpowered?
6) Not knowing much about other class' ornate gear I can't speak to this issue, but it's not really a class issue as much as a design or content one.
7) Now this is just silly. The only time our long duration snare is needed is when soloing, if you're taking so long to kill stuff that you wish you had Ensnare then you need to get another group.
8) We probably do have the 3rd best DoT spells...which are only really useful solo since nowadays the object is to kill every target faster than a dot needs to do it's work. Like snare, if you're not taking down targets fast enough to make dots less efficient than nukes you're doing something wrong.

So we have good nukes, good heals up until GoD content, and a few utility abilities that other classes are just as good at. Real overpowered. :bs:

*Whaaaaaaaa* Other people can SoW and people can get SoW with items. Ohhhh muffin. I'm sorry. I was under the impression that SoW was the Shamans before yours anyway. They get it at 9. You get it at 14. Or have you zerg-rushed your way into getting it at level 1 now? Run 5 is almost as fast as SoW? Good! People have spent hard earned Xp (via AA's) to get it. So..... Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* You aren't the only ones that can stop the rain now? What a shame. Other people can now disable a minor annoyance. Hell, the spell should have never been in the game in the first place. Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* You have a crappy pet. Oh really? Perhaps you didn't know this (because I'm sure most of you are just bandwagon jumpers) but Druids shouldn't have summoned pets anyway. Do you want to know why they were thrown in? Because a bunch of druids zerged Verant into giving them pets when Kunark was in pre-release. Awwwww. If yer not happy, then just don't buy the spell. Too Bad. Cry me a river.

*Whaaaaaaaa* Mage Charm is better than Druid charm. You're kidding right. Seriously. You ARE joking aren't you? Mages get 1 charm spell, Call of the Arch Mage. There are so few elemental-taged mobs in the game, it makes it almost useless, other than on Tak. LDON's. The fact that anyone has the balls to say this shows just how pathetic you are. You already zerged your way into pushing mages out of the #2 nuking spot by lying and pressuring Verant into giving Druids #2 nukes at kunark pre-release. No matter what you want to say, They weren't always #2 spot, 810 at level 50 for mages 650 for druids is not equal. Too bad. Cry me a river.

Now I don't know where all this crap came from. The link you gave at the top of your post is from a druid that was pretty much shut down by the rest of the grove as just a ranter blowing off steam and that the post wasn't very accurate. No serious druid cares about SoW, they're grateful not to be begged to cast it all the time. No serious druid cares about stopping the rain, oh boy that's an important class skill huh? No serious druid cares about our weak pet, at best it's a weak dot, at worst it's a nice roleplay ability, and everyone knows it was added just as a fun spell. And finally no serious druid thinks that mages are better charmers, if anything they just want our top charm to have a higher level cap like chanters and I *think* necros/mages.


So if you're going to troll make sure to keep it to the Unkempt section, General is for anyone who has real constructive criticisms and has real data to backup what they post.

Noliniel
04-17-2004, 07:55 AM
Hmm kinda useless to argue with those trolls with little education. However, thanks for the laughs though, havn't saw posts like this in a while. :)

divina
04-17-2004, 08:04 AM
Hmm... my current exp group involves 4 enchanters and 2 druids in FoZ. Ensnare is absolutely essential to the group.

Ensare is not just used for soloing. Infact most charmers do not charm unless there is a long lasting snare.

Iisbliss
04-17-2004, 08:10 AM
haha

harvey the dog
04-17-2004, 08:43 AM
WTG Aeg!

From this day forward, anyone with a name even remotely similar to yours ingame will get the full treatment from HARVEY THE TRAINBRINGER!

Harvey The Trainbringer shouts, "TRAIN TO AEG! GET OUT OF THE WAY"
Aeg says OOC, "WTF!?!?!"
Harvey The Trainbringer shouts, "TRAIN TO AEG! GET OUT OF THE WAY"
Aeg says OOC, "DOOD! U UBER DOODZ ARE RUINING THIS GAME CAUSE YOU..."
Harvey The Trainbringer has created a mystic portal.
/ignore aeg

Mortis_Operandi
04-17-2004, 11:33 AM
I gotta say, training a Necro purposefully is prolly the stupidest idea I've seen on this board.... I'd be carefull in the execution of that plan :nono:

Morti.

Islington
04-17-2004, 11:57 AM
I've seen quite a few Necros die to trains. Feign Death is pretty much useless to a Necro that can't channel the thing off with 10 mobs beating on them.

It's quite funny actually. Nothing brings a smile to my face more than seeing a Necromancer pasted on the floor.

Panamah
04-17-2004, 11:58 AM
Training is an important issue in this Presidential race! Pres. Bush is specifically going to budget $17.00 per unemployed person for training. So necro or not, you're going to get training! At least, $17.00 worth!

Sskeli
04-17-2004, 01:08 PM
Wow yeah I've never feigned off a bad pull with a bunch of mobs beating on me....NEVER EVER EVER!

Any more than one mob and I don't even bother to feign cause it's useless. I mean once they eat through force shield my spells can start be interrupted...and the extreme 1 second cast time of Death Peace makes it's pretty useless...not to mention if I fall to the ground I'd have to channel a 0.1 second cast of QVox and that'd be crazy and then I'd just be back to square one with the 1 second cast time of DP again. Let's not forget how useless channeling focus is too cause I mean we're talking more than one mob...that makes things impossible.

I envy druids with your ummm...healing...and your ummm....SoW...and uhhh....what else?....oh ya....rez......HO NOZ!!! MY BAD...no druid rez......SO SORRY ROFELLOLZ!!1


<3

Kulothar
04-17-2004, 01:37 PM
LOL and who says there are no Troll Necros.. hehe..

I guess that person never played a druid or looked at there equipment or manapool. Being second in a skill isn't so bad except we are also second in manapool to all the casters which reduces the effectiveness even more.

I love reading these to see how ignorant some players can be of other classes. In the past 5 years I have twinked up every class (except for Berzerker) to at least the mid 50's so at least I know a little bit when I make a stupid statement about another class.

Thanks for leaving this up.. I needed a good laugh.

PS. Appologies to necros if Aeg isn't one.
PPS. Appologies to necros if Aeg is one..

Darlyn
04-17-2004, 01:47 PM
DRUIDS ARE THE WHINEYEST, MOST HATED GROUP OF PLAYERS IN EQ

In all fairness, you don't know what the whole everquest community thinks of druids, so till you actually take a poll, don't make up some blanket claim..

now, go suck a sock....

/oops did i say that out loud?

Chenier
04-17-2004, 01:49 PM
/high five Darlyn!

Levidian OmniPresent
04-17-2004, 01:59 PM
-Actually dmg shields arnt useless in groups. in Ikkinz vs the unslowable quad hitter reds our warrior generated 490dps from his defensive melee and what else ? dmg shields.

and aeg being second in line in a catagory means about jack and sheet. its the gap between first and second. ide consider druids about 1/5th the healers clerics are.

-200more mana for a roungly 2k less CH.
-And one slow/fast heal which would be our baby S.light which heals way less.
-no HoTs
-no group heals
-no health balance ability ( arguably the most powerful ability in the game)
so we hae 2/5ths the healing types clerics have, at 50-60% the power.

and druids main argument is that they want a "fast" heal that heals more then a end game 1 group mob can dish out in 1 round of melee.

Personally i think Aeg if he is a necro got his arse kicked in a duel and got his ultra ego smashed down a little and now he feels like crying and brining attention to himself.

Elder Levidian OmniPresent[Prexus] <Unity> 555aa+

Fabelin
04-17-2004, 02:01 PM
Well first let me say I have a 61 Druild and a 65 necro and they are both the loves of my heart. Yes they both have there highs and there lows. I would say that druids do tend to be desired more in groups but hey thats how it gose we can heal which is great. And necros are wanted for DPS hey what can we say our pets and dots do us good. So I really do understand the good and the bad and the ugly of both classes. I really dont see any group necro or druid that really complains to much when its not needed. I do think most classes that have not played a necro or druid in the high end just dont understand. So I applaud both groups :clap: they are the icing on the cake. Are either class really needed in a group? I would have to say no but then again with out them its like eggs with out salt maybe just a little bland. I personally find when im in a group as a necro I like grouping with druids and vica versa. Believe it or not they both can really compliment each other so to all that i say cheers.

Druid > :cheers: < Necro

Megadwen
04-17-2004, 03:56 PM
i love groups with necro's in vxed or tipt+ cause if **** goes bad, they can FD, rez the cleric, mana dump the casters, and get us pulling again in no time *shrug*

an ssk... do you like hang out in crushbone or something? lol, try getting any spell off with 5 1k quadders hitting you. betcha you can't omgs!

TauTropfen
04-17-2004, 04:20 PM
LOL priceless, absolutely priceless :) Aeg, you made my day thank you.

And Fabelin, we'll have to burn you for admitting you play both a necro AND a druid *gets out the torches and pitchforks*

Teaenea
04-17-2004, 05:19 PM
<------ overpowered!

Yay, My EQ goal has been realized!

Time to be overpowered in game for a while. /wave

Sskeli
04-17-2004, 05:32 PM
oooo 5 1k quadders...possible 20k dmg in one round. When you talk about a group of mobs that could "1 round" any player in the game what's the point?

5 1K quadders on a monk, druid, necro....what's the diff?

/shrug

Kulothar
04-17-2004, 06:59 PM
hehe.. Sskeli you make 20K dmg sound like nothing.. For a Monk or Necro it is just time to FD before they hit. Unfortunately for a lot of lv 65 druids that is their entire mana pool. Then what.. med up for the SoW for the CR I guess. Necro's at least can rez themselves when they get back.

True if you let all 5 reach you and have a druid healer two things will happen....

1) you are dead since you can't FD (At least my lv 65 SK can't FD with 5 on him) and
2) The second druid heal will fall on a corpse if he hasn't already agro'd and died.

And if you do survive that round your Druid is OOM and you are dead anyway.

But then since you have never had the ability to play a druid to lv 65 or made the effort to research them, you would have no Idea.

Gus Fifo
04-17-2004, 07:10 PM
Quote Kulothar


..."Being second in a skill isn't so bad except we are also second in manapool to all the casters which reduces the effectiveness even more. "


Is the mana pool really that bad? I have looked at various mana calculators but have not compared all the pure caster side by side. Can anyone give me an idea where to find more info on this. I just assumed that all pure casters would have the same mana pool if they had the same stats, gear notwithstanding of course.

Kulothar
04-17-2004, 07:49 PM
I don't know,

but at lv 65 in planar gear, my base mana is 1300 , Direct mana is 849 and Indirect mana 1649 for a total mana pool of 3797. That is enough to cast 7 x 4.7k CH spells or 7 x 2.1k NI heal Spells. The clerics I group with brag of their 6.x K mana pools. Last night a lv 61 cleric was saying his mana pool was over 4K. I have never measured my clerics mana pool since he is just a rez Bot.

I know Wizzies have more mana than we do also. Shaman probably are as low as we are but I have been told all pure casters get a better mana ratio. But then you have to remember that Verant said the primary stat for Druids is AGI not WIS. Also we give up mana in our items for secondary abilities, AC or just due to a general lack of druid items.

So, those may been overestimates by clerics but I don't see why they would lie.

PS. And Yes, I know my gear is terrible. Most of the 65 planar druids should have better which means more mana.

Greylin
04-17-2004, 08:13 PM
I don't know,

but at lv 65 in planar gear, my base mana is 1300 , Direct mana is 849 and Indirect mana 1649 for a total mana pool of 3797. (7 x 4.7k CH spells or 7 x 2.1k NI heal Spells). The clerics I group with brag of their 6.x K mana pools. Last night a lv 61 cleric was saying his mana pool was over 4K.

...

So, those may been overestimates by clerics but I don't see why they would lie.

This is from Magelo? You might have forgotten Base mana. I'm not even elemental flagged, and I have 4258 mana according to Magelo (1560 base, 1143 direct, 1555 indirect):

http://www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=974708

Make sure that you're making accurate comparisons of mana pool. The safest is to just compare what Magelo says for each character. It may not be 100% accurate, but it's a point of common comparison. Some people may do something like calculate the number of times they can cast a specific spell and call that their mana pool, ignoring specialization, mana reduction, mana regen, etc.

Kulothar
04-17-2004, 08:24 PM
My information was directly from my Magelo which was up to date in late January. Only gear I have upgraded was a hammer and neck piece, neither of which has more mana on them.

oddjob1244
04-17-2004, 08:37 PM
rofl

Vindler
04-17-2004, 09:16 PM
Sorry to go back a couple of pages on you folks, but Aeg having the best snare/ensnare in the world doesn't do anyone any good if it is immediately overwritten by a wizzy or necro spell even if that person is 20 lvls lower than you are :/ I would hardly call that overpowered, but then again YOU may be operating from a different set of definitions than we do. Or maybe your playing a whole different game.

:spam1:

Aerokella
04-18-2004, 02:01 AM
now, go suck a sock....

EWWW :eek:

Kulothar
04-18-2004, 12:17 PM
Hehe.. well, I feel like I need to go on a serious gear upgrade. Asked my guild and one Druid that raids elementals said he just broke the 5K manapool with buffs. I used to be considered uber in my guild, but then had to go overseas for 7 months and now only the newbies think my Ornate is uber.

Greystone
04-18-2004, 03:10 PM
I as a druid, do agree with some of the things he says. Many druid complain about things that are not needed. We are the top 3 in 4-6 categories, that is how we were designed. SO for the record, as a druid, there is come truths in what he says. His delivery of these facts sucked, but still.

Noliniel
04-18-2004, 07:02 PM
What's with all the spamming lately in TDG channel and on the boards anyways? New born troll season? :p

Well let you tell you something trolls ! EQ isn't a real life, its a computer generated world that could gone anyday for any reason. It its just a computer game, your attempts in trying to annoying people is totally non sense and waste only your times , not ours. Classes are only there cause SOE created them, they there cause they server different purposes for the game and benfits the entire game. Your attempts of flaming another class its totally pointless since people would just laugh at your uneducated posts and walk away. Your attempts of getting attention from this sort of thing isn't working, you won't make people fear you or anything. You wil just be a laughstock for the whole EQ community and no one wil care about you. :)

I am glad the EQ community in general are very mature and only a few are pre-mature, 12 years old kid who have nothing else to do like you.

Sorry if my post its a direct attack or anything, just really mad at those trolls who have nothing else to do other tan spamming the boards and channels.

Rast
04-18-2004, 08:11 PM
For god sakes, if you truely believe that you have it so bad, roll a monk.

And so it has been written monks are now the black sheep of Everquest wtb a bone.

Sunfire
04-18-2004, 09:23 PM
I'll probably regret doing this but someone has to. You can freak out all you want but this community has been very consistent in asking for 2 things - viable healing improvements and, to a lesser extent, reasonable charm options roughly equivalent to the non-enchanter charming classes focussed on animals.


1) Second best nukers in the game

Actually, contrary to your assertions Mages are still, in many ways, the 2nd best nukers in the game. The only time druids are really "better" is in terms of FR mobs.

2) Second best healers in the game

True but a very distant second. I'm a 65 druid in mid-pop gear with 70+ AAs and I am still not effective enough as a healer to solo-heal an LDON hard in most themes and expect to win. Forget GoD. I don't believe Clerics should be required as healers for the harder stuff in game - sorry, I think thats "broken". If people die in an adventure or GoD trial - I cant rez or even bring them back. If someone else gets aggro while I'm CHing the MA (the only druid option for healing a MA) then they're dead - period - nothing I can do about it. I have one AA group heal I can use once or twice per adventure/ expedition. A cleric with the same mana pool as I do can cast almost 2x the number of CHs as I can cast KR and they are actually complete!Sorry but 2nd best doesnt mean close second.

3) Best damage shields in the game (1 pt less than mages but yers are so much cheeper)

You have been smoking crack here. Flameshield of Ro is a 45pt damage shield with stackable fire resistance that Mages get at 61 and costs 190 mana - Legacy of Bracken is 40pts, a 65 spell, and 380 mana.

4) Second best porters
But this isnt a skill that gets us groups or makes us valuable in raids anymore so how is it relevant.

5) Best rooters
By what measure are we the "best"? And in what context is being a good "rooter" valuable exactly? If you get adds in GoD and dont have a mezzer or Time-enabled off tank you die. You can maybe root-park 1 or 2 mobs in LDON hards but even that is risky and we're no better at it than anyone else. And you can't root while healing so who cares.

6) You have some of the best Ornate gear out there
Funny stretch - our ornate gear is only better than caster ornate gear in one way - we have less competition for bracers because Monks and BST dont want them as much as Nec/Wiz/Enc/Mag fight over the silk ones.

7) Snare. Do you know how unbelievably overpowered snare / ensnare is? Don't say everyone has it. They don't. You guys do it best. That alone unbalances the class. At least other classes that get it have to re-apply frequently. Yers lasts what? 13 minutes or something dumb like that.

Ranger snare = druid snare. Snare is one of the highest aggro spells in the game, if you snare and heal you will die - lots. Also, in PoP and GoD snare is only situationally useful at best since so many mobs are run speed immune. Yea if you're kiting raptors in Timorous snare is the bomb - do you want to kite Raptors in Timorous, I'd be happy to come and snare them for you.

8) Third best DoT spells

Ok, duh. How many DoT caster classes are there in your game anyway. 3rd best = worst. Do you really think we even use our DoTs "frequently" - if you read this board you'd see there's a 100% consensus for having our GoD dot replaced with a new heal. Our only viable DoT for group fights is Vengeance of Tunare which costs about 700AP to get - know what percentage of 60+ druids have that one?

And you forgot a few things: we have about the worst mana regen options of any caster in the game, we have the worst options for mitigating aggro of any healing class, and as you so adequately listed we have no "class-unique" abilities left and aren't the best at anything.

Mannwin Woobie
04-19-2004, 07:13 AM
Being anonymous? I have my handle posted. If you really wanna find "Aeg" you can probably find it fairly easilly.

Ummm...not what I meant. That is still just cyber-land. In general, people get very 'brave' in on-line forums. They would do things they would never do in 'real' life.

If all the Druids were actually meeting in a convention hall in real life, would you walk in, run up to the stage, and start spouting all the things you did in the first paragraph? I sincerely doubt it.

WEDruidVZ
04-19-2004, 03:13 PM
Aeg, your fly is on the side of your skirt, girlie!!! Still waiting on the numbers to back up your dumbass claims...and look behind you. What do you see? Me too, NOTHING and NOONE....where's your backup? Thought so. It's been said here and many other places and on many other forums...everyone complains about something regardless of class, and, except trolls which EVERYONE REALLY HATES, there are always going to be those that feel they're better and above everyone else. So why are you here... as for me, I hate whinners whinning about whinners, cry me an ocean...lol

Kineada
04-19-2004, 04:03 PM
Hehe.. well, I feel like I need to go on a serious gear upgrade. Asked my guild and one Druid that raids elementals said he just broke the 5K manapool with buffs.

Hrmmm ... I run around with about 7.2 kmana with Maelin's Meditation. Some clerics in my guild have more, others have less. Top druid on Terris Thule has about 7.5 kmana and top druid serverwide has about 8.1 kmana (go go Treviz!!!).

Crowly Kittenclubber
04-19-2004, 04:35 PM
Sorry to go back a couple of pages on you folks, but Aeg having the best snare/ensnare in the world doesn't do anyone any good if it is immediately overwritten by a wizzy or necro spell even if that person is 20 lvls lower than you are :/ I would hardly call that overpowered, but then again YOU may be operating from a different set of definitions than we do. Or maybe your playing a whole different game.



V, you lurker you...oh, and thanks for the kitten generator Panamah :devil-lau

Fakkin
04-19-2004, 04:56 PM
Hey I agree with Aeg. I have other Char but I love my druid, I dont understand why so many peps dont like there char and if they do just start another one. I like the fact I can heal,port, DD and DOT and buff.

Peregrinus
04-19-2004, 05:24 PM
Why does anyone complain about any class being better than another? There are 8 character slots in an account. Use them. I haven't made a necro yet, but I have a bard, a war, a pally, a chanter, a cleric, and a monk. I bought another account last year, and I'm sure I'll have one of every class just in time for Sony to shut EQ down and make me start all over on some other game.

Broad generalizations in this context are pointless. No one speaks for me except myself, so any are guaranteed to be wrong when they speak for all.

Iilane SalAlur
04-19-2004, 08:52 PM
Druids druids, we're forgetting how we deal with trolls...

I love cats :)

Noliniel
04-19-2004, 11:59 PM
Hey I agree with Aeg. I have other Char but I love my druid, I dont understand why so many peps dont like there char and if they do just start another one. I like the fact I can heal,port, DD and DOT and buff.

Well people have put their time in their characters and they just don't want have to redo it all over it again. Plus, playing another class when you unhappy with your current class isn't the answer for most people. Its like you buying a card, its broke and doesn't work well. Wil you just go off and buy another car? Or wil you fix it til it works? I think most people would go for the second choice. Same thing with EQ. :)


Hey Rast !

Logilitie
04-20-2004, 10:29 AM
wow lots of topic jumping in here.

i'm pretty happy with druid class.
sure our charm is kinda weak, our heals aren't as good as clerics,
our dots not as strong as necros, out pet is a joke...
but we do it all and pretty good
____

it's not very hard for a druid to have 7k HP and 6 Kmana with elem gear,
and there are uber time+ ( GoD ) geared druids with buffs that bust 10k HP and 8kmana!

princess0fdiabl0
04-20-2004, 10:31 AM
Druids druids, we're forgetting how we deal with trolls...

I love cats :)

cats clearly are better than dogs, i mean wtf dogs are stupid omglol :thumbs2:

Panamah
04-20-2004, 10:43 AM
Ok, you newcomers aren't familiar with the TDG's patented style of troll taming. Basically you take one flame and derail the hell out of it. Get 3-4 topics going, quite a lot of fun. Takes the wind right out of their sails.

Anyway, here's a joke:

Two guys talking together one says, "What's your dad do for a living?"

Other says, "Oh, he's dead".

First one says, "What'd he do before he died?"

Other says, "Grabbed his chest and yelled, "ARGH!"".

===========================================

Did you know the US has gone metric finally?
Yes, its true. We have a half-liter in the white house.

Aaeamdar
04-20-2004, 11:09 AM
I really enjoyed his use of the word "zerg."

Sildan
04-20-2004, 11:41 AM
I have read your comments Aeg and after some very careful thought I have come to a conclusion.....


"Zerged" is a really cool word. I like it almost as much as "Borked" :xblueman:

Chenier
04-20-2004, 12:06 PM
I know of a guild who recently tried to zerg Coirnav with 109 people......and lost!

Kulothar
04-20-2004, 12:54 PM
Wow, Nice gear Kineada..

Unfortunately, I think the only two pieces I recognized were the ammo and charm slots. Wonder what percentage of lv 65 druids have such nice gear.. Guess I seriously need to get back to work.. or find a more uber guild... or both. Like I said, my ornate doens't impress anyone but newbies any more.

Kellory
04-20-2004, 01:32 PM
I like pie!

Aerokella
04-20-2004, 01:52 PM
I like "Borked" better than "Zerged"

Peregrinus
04-20-2004, 01:58 PM
I always think of "Borked" as "messed up", where as "Zerged" is "being overcome in a rush of small things".

Mannwin Woobie
04-20-2004, 02:13 PM
I like Bork much better. Swedish Chef! hehe

The Swedish Chef Profile (http://www.muppets.com/profiles/chef.htm)

Darlyn
04-20-2004, 02:15 PM
Other says, "Grabbed his chest and yelled, "ARGH!"".

okay, my coffee just came out my nose!! stop doing this to me..

/wipes coffee boogers off the keyboard!

WEDruidVZ
04-20-2004, 02:34 PM
Actually, isn't "zerged" when you attempt something and "borked" is what happens right after they bend you over for wiping the raid???

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-20-2004, 04:15 PM
Judge Robert Bork.

President Ronald Reagan's nomination of Judge Robert Bork to the Supreme Court met with a fierce opposition in his confirmation hearings.

To be shot down, because of being originally broken.

Or to foul something (intentionally) such that it will not work or suffice.

Kineada
04-20-2004, 08:05 PM
Wow, Nice gear Kineada..

/blush

Thank ye kindly. Believe it or not, I am not a hardcore raider (work, life - it IS spring you know!, blah, blah, blah). Most of that stuff was rot status so I was able to get it. I play when I can and am lucky to be in a family type guild that happens to raid end-game content.

Panamah
04-20-2004, 08:09 PM
I think borked predates that appointment, either that or else I'm too old.

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-20-2004, 10:06 PM
I doubt both. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bork)

"Soon, a verb was invented from his name: to be borked is to be roughly treated and then fail confirmation at a Congressional confirmation hearing."

And obviously the word has mutated a bit since then. I distinctly remember hearing a leader of NOW use the term. Such as "If Reagan appoints another like him, we will bork him too".

I do not remember ever hearing that word before 1987.

Kulothar
04-21-2004, 03:11 PM
I think it is easy to use as a combination of Porked and Boinked... both existed before 1987. I may have just been absorbed to consolidate the feelings of the two.. ;p

Kuolon
04-21-2004, 08:02 PM
I know of a guild who recently tried to zerg Coirnav with 109 people......and lost!

I know a guild that tried to zerg Coirnav with 250+ people, wiped, then crashed the zone.

Panamah
04-21-2004, 08:06 PM
I thought "bork" came from the Swedish chef guy. Definitely predates that appointment.

Do you ever listen to "A Way with Words" on NPR? Love that show. :) Anyway, bet those guys would know. Last time I heard it they talked about where "Mind your P's and Q's" comes from. They had several possible originations but there is one that is most likely.

Anyone want to take a guess?


:sumo:
And wow! Some neat new smilies: )

:ban:

brum15
04-21-2004, 08:07 PM
I remember zerging emporer crush. 30+ level 5-8 characters. we lost. course this was a time when I was proud of my level 6 paladin being in full banded.

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-21-2004, 11:31 PM
"Anyone want to take a guess?"

I have heard a few, I don't know which is correct.

I think the typesetter one or the manners one are tied for most plausible.

princess0fdiabl0
04-22-2004, 12:00 AM
bork is a miss-spelling of broke, we borked the zone, we broke it. wtf are you guys smoking, reading into historical names too much work omg, its just the next TEH! ;)

Aidon
04-22-2004, 01:08 AM
Actually, bork, the transitive verb, is defined based on Richard Bork, as Fyrr said. It means, essentially, the systematic political destruction of a person.

The misspelling of broke into bork is just another jackass slang term created by dumb****s who think deliberate misspelling of words equals inventing new slang.

Panamah
04-22-2004, 01:35 PM
The P's and Q's ones that the "Way with Words" guys thought most like was:

Used to be in English Pubs they kept track of your pints and quarts on a chalk board. Thus P's and Q's. They'd total up what you drank and charge you for it. The admonition was to not drink too much such that you didn't notice the barkeeper was cooking your tally and overcharging you.

The other one was that on the old typesetters the lower case p's and q's looked the same when you were picking out the letters and it was easy to get them mixed up.

Stewwy
04-22-2004, 03:45 PM
*yawns*

Shoo troll don't bother me
Shoo troll don't bother me
Shoo troll don't bother me

BogebogbudicusRZ
04-22-2004, 05:21 PM
Boink = Um....err..."Sleeping with someone" but with less flowers and buying dinner first and more heat, passion and throwing her/him against a wall and working on a good mutual howl.

Bork = As in “Bork Bork” from the Muppets Shop…..It is a sign of happiness, like Ren and Stimpy = “Happy Happy, Joy Joy” I guess you could use it to carry a negative message….but those of us who remember Debra Harry and a band called Blondie, on stage with a bunch of puppets…..will never feel it’s a really bad vibe-word.

brum15
04-22-2004, 11:46 PM
Druids are evil. One changed me into a newt!!! I got better.

Mannwin Woobie
04-23-2004, 12:37 AM
Gotta love British humor.

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-23-2004, 12:46 AM
French Humor (http://data.classiccomedy.net/clips/mpfrenchknightsshort.rm)

Aidon
04-23-2004, 02:22 AM
Come back and we will taunt you a second time!

cosmoxx
04-23-2004, 02:47 AM
Cool.

Nice to see my rant filled everyone's day as well as it did.

Here is my magelo if anyone is interested. I have 4years of experience playing my druid. Quite a serious player, and currently playing the high end.
www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=350393

I liked how the necro posted about ornate gear, concidering ornate gear is terrible anyway. Much better to invest into playing time in LDoN then get ornate gear for any class.

Main point of my rant was not about healing or nuking or whatever. Main point was that SoE is taking druid abilites and standardizing them through the server. This has not been done to any other class, and any other class would have an uproar over it. But for some reasons druids just seem to turn over and take it. For instance the point about run5, sure it costs 30aa. But how many aa would you spend to get the ability to rez, or canni?.

Also many of you may not realize this, but playing a druid from 0 to 65 does not mean you know the class. You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD. The class playstyle changes constantly, and making assumptions because you're lvl 65 flagged to solro about playing the end game doesn't follow. But at the same time there are very few problems with the druid class like you correctly pointed out, from a class perspective. But does that mean that the class should continue to be eroded?

My original point is valid.

it's funny btw that the
-highest damage class
-2nd best rezer
-best soloer
-best doter
-best mana supplier
-best mana regen
-FD class
class would come here posted about a druid rant. But people do really get bored during the day. And might I point out that everything the necromancers can do are directly relevant to their role within the game, or are still widely needed.

Of the skills he listed for druids, which ones are widely used? or needed during a raid situation. Healing and nuking.... Nuking?? really? Do you nuke during raids? Or do you heal? Our role as secondary healers make us healers in raid situations. If we're lucky we get to nuke, but our primary job is healing. We might have ok mana regen, but does that really matter when healing spells cost 80% more and less efficient then spells from other classes?

And we are the 3rd best nukers, not the 2nd. We tie mages on some nukes, but they get better ones.
healing.
We are the 2nd best point healers.
We are the 3rd best group healers. Druids can't heal during major ae's if every group member gets hit. We'll blow our mana bar after the 2nd or 3rd ae.

Aerokella
04-23-2004, 01:42 PM
Also many of you may not realize this, but playing a druid from 0 to 65 does not mean you know the class. You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD.



Thanks for pointing that out, as I did not know that. I thought I knew my druid, but since I've not been anywhere you've mentioned, I guess I don't.

Ndainye
04-23-2004, 02:36 PM
Aralyn:

Amazing how some of the worst played druids I've seen are in Time guilds and some of the best played ones aren't! Being end game doesn't mean you know your class it just may make you more aware of issues that non end game players may have not yet experienced, that doesn't mean we don't understand that there are issues in the end game or what those issues are.

Personally I can click through Lucy and find all the druid spells that are on clicky items I didn't need you to tell me they were there. Druid lack of specilazation and the watering down of our utility by means of items and game advancements effect all druids not just end game ones, most of them aren't important enough to cry over (and as pointed out to you in your rant most druids don't).

Megadwen
04-23-2004, 02:48 PM
Of the skills he listed for druids, which ones are widely used? or needed during a raid situation. Healing and nuking.... Nuking?? really? Do you nuke during raids? Or do you heal? Our role as secondary healers make us healers in raid situations. If we're lucky we get to nuke, but our primary job is healing. We might have ok mana regen, but does that really matter when healing spells cost 80% more and less efficient then spells from other classes?


i don't really know how many raids you've been on, but (depending on the raid of course) i nuke/heal at 50/50 id' say on raids. i don't really see the point in over healing during raids so if i'm not needed to heal, i toss on a few dots and nuke, and considering i can get up to 4k~ crits with a bard in group and that is pretty significant damage, and much more worth my mana then patch healing a person that 8 clerics are spam healing.
of course, don't let this lead you to believe i'm not always checking tanks and their health, and more than ready to /tar anyone and quick heal, or won't debuff a mob if another druid can't get it on, it's just not all i do :)

Kulothar
04-23-2004, 03:02 PM
Humm.. I have played for over 5 years with this druid as my primary.. My guild hasnt gone completely through time/elem so I guess I was wrong. Guess I should go buy a lv 55 one that is Time flagged so I will know the class.

Kineada
04-23-2004, 03:17 PM
Guess I should go buy a lv 55 one that is Time flagged so I will know the class.

While it MAY be possible to flag a level 55 for Time, that toon won't be able to zone into Time until 65.

Kineada
04-23-2004, 03:22 PM
Of the skills he listed for druids, which ones are widely used? or needed during a raid situation. Healing and nuking.... Nuking?? really? Do you nuke during raids? Or do you heal?

Last night, I was in a group in Uqua with three mages, a wizzy and a bard. It'll give you three guesses as to what spells I was casting throughout the night.

Noliniel
04-23-2004, 05:13 PM
Here is my magelo if anyone is interested. I have 4years of experience playing my druid. Quite a serious player, and currently playing the high end.
www.magelo.com/eq_view_profile.html?num=350393

Playing 4 years doesn't mean you will know your class well. Cause you could playing on and off for 4 years or just don't learn /perferm well while someone else who has been playing for only 2 years non stop and loves to learn/perferm well will know the class better than you. :)

Also many of you may not realize this, but playing a druid from 0 to 65 does not mean you know the class. You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD. The class playstyle changes constantly, and making assumptions because you're lvl 65 flagged to solro about playing the end game doesn't follow. But at the same time there are very few problems with the druid class like you correctly pointed out, from a class perspective. But does that mean that the class should continue to be eroded?

Hi, knowing your class and been in the high/middle/low end has nothing to do with each other. Know you class means knowing what to cast, cast at what time, what to do, perform your task well. etc.. You can be time flagged with tons of gears and still be a crappy druid. or you could be a bazaar geared druid who knows her/his task very well. :)

it's funny btw that the
-highest damage class
-2nd best rezer
-best soloer
-best doter
-best mana supplier
-best mana regen
-FD class

I am assuming you talking about necros. Necros = highest damage class? You kidding me lol? Second best rezzer? Depends, Necro rezs are costly and limited. Pally would make a better rezzer in most of the situations since their rez its cost free and only 6 % less than cleric rez. :)

Of the skills he listed for druids, which ones are widely used? or needed during a raid situation. Healing and nuking.... Nuking?? really? Do you nuke during raids? Or do you heal? Our role as secondary healers make us healers in raid situations. If we're lucky we get to nuke, but our primary job is healing. We might have ok mana regen, but does that really matter when healing spells cost 80% more and less efficient then spells from other classes

Guess you havn't experienced GOD. In GOD, ( well least in my guild ) druids are considers healers in the same level as clerics. Since GOD mobs hits so hard and fast, every single heal is need for tanks during GOD raids. Alot of times you need to zerg the mbs and our nukes can provide decent dps. Its not the best but it certaily helps :)

Stewwy
04-23-2004, 05:47 PM
Sheesh Cosmoxx do you really believe what you are spewing?

If so my reaction is - :xblueman:

Aidon
04-23-2004, 09:03 PM
Also many of you may not realize this, but playing a druid from 0 to 65 does not mean you know the class. You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD. The class playstyle changes constantly, and making assumptions because you're lvl 65 flagged to solro about playing the end game doesn't follow.

I never got through elementals, time or GoD.

Guess I didn't know squat about playing a druid.

Tinsi
04-23-2004, 09:25 PM
You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD.

You, sir, are a snob. Not only that, you are a snob that is wrong. You can play a pre-elemental druid just perfectly without the faintest idea of what cures Quarm's epoch AE, how much Magmaton rampages for or how to pass ikkinz2 trial. There's no magical line passed when you beat rztw that goes DING DING once you pass this line you officially know your class, and there definitely is no line saying DING DING until you have passed this, you aren't fully aware of your class' abilities, and there is no magical change in the encounters as you zone into PoFire. It's just.. more mobs, new mobs, new encounters. Just like Creator, just like Gorenaire, just like Aten Ha Ra, just like PoN-B Terris. Just.. stuff you haven't killed yet when you first zone in.

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-24-2004, 01:13 AM
"Guess I didn't know squat about playing a druid."

I'm out too.

/shrug

Grenoble
04-24-2004, 07:54 AM
Ouch.

That attitude is partially why I stopped reading the Crucible forums. With the issues affecting shaman, there was a LOT of that, "You can't understand the problems unless you're ele/Time geared". Well...my shaman is 64, and leader of a small, family-oriented guild, which is enough for me and my play style, and yes, I CAN understand the issues.

The elitists sadden me to no end. Progression and flags do not make a good player.

Esanguiner
04-24-2004, 09:05 AM
Of all the classes I would say Druids are the least whiniest...

Besides.... we are NEEDED now to turn off the rain :halo:

This dude obviously got the attention he was seeking.

Kytelae
04-24-2004, 09:36 AM
Turning off the rain is what druids do best. When I raid, I spend 50% of my time turning off the rain.

Tiane
04-24-2004, 05:32 PM
Meteorological Rocket (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/item.html?id=8998)

Its actually cheaper than casting it since you get 10 charges... 8(

Arienne
04-24-2004, 09:54 PM
Also many of you may not realize this, but playing a druid from 0 to 65 does not mean you know the class. You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD. The class playstyle changes constantly, and making assumptions because you're lvl 65 flagged to solro about playing the end game doesn't follow.OMIGOD! How MANY trials in GoD? The ENTIRE EXPANSION is trials!! But it's OK! I'm learning to play a druid and if I can stop yawning long enough to finish the expansion... maybe I will know when I'm done!

I know of at least one PLeveled twink druid that has almost as much GoD as I have now. It's a bit bewindering to think that after all these years of almost solely playing a druid character, a twink would know as much about the class after less than a week or two /played.

If you were smart, you'd go in and delete the original statement to make it look as though *I* made it up and added your name to it! QUICK! No one's looking! :blow:

Solice Farwalker
04-25-2004, 03:14 PM
Gosh after five years as a druid, I discover I won't know my class unless I break down and buy GOD. Sob! Now I'm sooooo depressed. Rofl, someone needs to go back to their frat parties.

Panamah
04-25-2004, 03:39 PM
In my day good druids quad-kited raptors... naked! And we liked it!

Arienne
04-25-2004, 05:39 PM
In my day good druids quad-kited raptors... naked! And we liked it!But not half as much as the raptors did! :p

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-25-2004, 05:47 PM
I liked it.

Noliniel
04-26-2004, 01:38 AM
Where is the Meteorological Rocket from? WTB even though it doesn't rain indoors anymore it seems :p

Mannwin Woobie
04-26-2004, 07:22 AM
Player made - Tinkering.

I can't get to eqtraders at the moment, or I'd link the recipe for you ;)

Chenier
04-26-2004, 12:10 PM
Also many of you may not realize this, but playing a druid from 0 to 65 does not mean you know the class. You do not know the class until you've been through ele, and time, and entered and passed trials in GoD.
:wstupid:


oh! sorry...dude, get a clue.

Naked at raptors - eep! Okay, raise your hand and tell us what's the highest number of the corpse bone rod thingies you had use to find your corpse when you went LD quadding raptors and diiiiied! (3 for me - I hate that zone!)


I like donuts. Mmmm.

Aerokella
04-26-2004, 01:12 PM
MMMMM creme filled Krispy Kreme donuts =)

cosmoxx
04-26-2004, 03:05 PM
Maybe I worded it incorectly, I was being rushed. But my point was that if you get to nuke you're lucky. Our primary job is healing, there is no argument to that. As a primary job for healing, are druids adequate at it? Should we suck at healing because we have the ability to nuke? or an half assed ability to port?

Having a single spell that is capable of healing someone isn't exactly efficient healing class. And we only have a single spell, because both Tunare and Karana heals are too slow to use. And please answer this question. What happens to a druid healing a group that is taking AE damage? Who is the best, and 2nd best healers then? It's not a druid.

Are we still the 2nd best healing class then?

We're good at point healing, but how long can you keep it up? NI and SI take a ****load of mana.

Shall we look at it from another perspective? What is the best nuking class in the game... Wizards. Wizrads have every type of nuke imaginable. Now who else can nuke.. Well pretty much every class that has a mana bar. lets look at little closer at this.. which classes are competent nukers besides wizards. Magicians, Druids. All of these classes have a wide selection of nukes for different types of encounters. Whoa hold on here... Because druids and magicians are competent nukers does this mean that Wizards are useless as nukers? Are they obsolete because someone else can do their job and nuke a target almost as good as they can? Are wizards complaining about this? NO. So why is it that when you look at healing classes Clerics get a ****load of options like Wizards, but unlike wizards only a few healing type spells made it to other classes and in no case are any of those spells anywhere close to the proficiency that clerics have.
Well..
Wizards get alot of porting options
Clerics get to Rez at 96% and at 100% on occasion.
Wizards get to snare
Clerics get a mean stun

So then why aren't there a larger range of healing options availble for other classes like there are for nuking options?

True iF Soe gave druids more healing then druids would be to powerfull cause of all those nukes. Well, look at the nukes. Why the **** were we given the ability to nuke ICE when we've never had it before lvl 50? We had rain.. but **** it take it away. Give us a GD grp healing spell or Celest regen type spell. Take away porting too minus group evac, don't need that **** anymore anyway. Don't need SoE, SoW.. I can get that **** with aa. 30 aa, thats how much it costs to get run5 you say. Now how long it takes to get 30aa? Try 4-6 days. About 30 hours of experiencing. **** I'd gind for 100hours to get the ability to rez mana free any time I wanted. Or to heal a group mana free, anytime.

And not a one of you touched the point that spells are being taken away from the druid class, instead you all just role over like mother****ers and attack a perceived insult.

Ahh ok the insult. which is a perfectly logical statement... In different areas of the game the druid class is played differently. So if you've never been there how can you know EVERYTHING about the druid class? Why would you take insult at this? Are you not confident in you're own 99% knowledge of the class? Are you so ****ing insecure about the 1%?? Can you not accept that the game might change slightly for you when you're in Ele or Time or going through GoD? Do you honestly want to be doing the same **** with different surroundings for another year?

And I didn't say that you knew "nothing" about the class, I pointed out that there were things that you have not yet seen. Including the ****ty loot that is available for druids.

Also, if you looked at my gear, you'd realize that i have only a few items, but overall my mana base is fairly close to druids that are not in Ele or Time. Nothing special about this druid. Just because I'm in Ele and Time doesn't suddenly give me good gear. It's not as if the **** falls from the sky. If I'm more aggresive towards mobs it not my gear protecting me, it's my ****ing aa's. Aa's make much much more of a difference in encounters then gear does. When comparing ****ty to mediocre gear. I have a ****ing Elysian breastplate for godsake.

And Necormancers by far are the highest damage in the game. How? Well Wizards dish out alot of power, but they have long downtime due to medding like us. Necromancers do not. 1 necromancer can kill 3-4 times as many Doomfire soldiers in PoF to my 1 and medding. And to a wizards 2 and medding. The FD ability that necromancers get mean they can lay on the damage and then FD to kill aggro. The only time they have to worry about aggro are on raids, same with wizards mages and every other class. Like us wizards have more point damage.. but necromancer damages totaly ownes both us and wizards in the long run. A necromancer gets 2 mana bars, with the ability to self heal at low cost, even for free, and the highest mana regen in the game, not even counting hp regen. So ya it's a little funny to see a godly class laugh at us for whinning.

Chenier
04-26-2004, 03:53 PM
Aralyn, I skimmed...

Dude, the thread about beating the dead horse about druid helaing is the OTHER thread.


This is now a thread about donuts. Get it right.

Fun fact: Krispy Kreme, Inc. makes 7.5 million donuts a day and more than 2.7 billion a year.

Regnon
04-26-2004, 05:10 PM
Fun fact: Krispy Kreme, Inc. makes 7.5 million donuts a day and more than 2.7 billion a year.


Thats alot of happy cops :dance:

harvey the dog
04-26-2004, 08:30 PM
Panamah said...

In my day good druids quad-kited raptors... naked! And we liked it!

you forgot, "in the snow, uphill, BOTH WAYS"

its nice to know that part of the reason i quit, the whole raider elitist attitude is still the same. keeps my hands away from the credit card. and here, after almost 5 years, i didn't know what i was doing anyway. go figure.

btw, where do these people come from? i work with this control freak, self-rightious prick that i wouldn't pee on if he was on fire. how can you possibly live your life like that? i mean, do you then have to surround yourself with people that are equally self-rightious? and if so, how do you make it through the day without either beating the hell out of one of your pals, or having one of your pals beat you up?

Noliniel
04-26-2004, 11:23 PM
Hey cosmoxx, your post its too long for me to read it carefully, I just run though it but if you really want to the best healer, whatever. Go argue it in the other long long long long long long thread. Thank you ! Druid its suppose a class who can do alot of stuff but not really really good at them. Say if you really into healing and you mad that that we not the best healers or whatever. Go make a cleric or something or argue in that long thread or whatever. If you mad we not the best nukers or whatever, make a wiz or something. God, if you so mad that druid can't do this or can't do that. then don't play it seriously.

We're good at point healing, but how long can you keep it up? NI and SI take a ****load of mana.
Yeah and its same with clerics. In GOD,I oom almost the same time as clerics. Sure they heal a lot more and such but still . those are very costly.

Wizards get alot of porting options
Clerics get to Rez at 96% and at 100% on occasion.
Wizards get to snare
Clerics get a mean stun

Wizards gets alot more than that. Lures, familars to help them, spells that help them gain mana, more crit nuke aas than any other class etc..

Well, look at the nukes. Why the **** were we given the ability to nuke ICE when we've never had it before lvl 50? We had rain.. but **** it take it away.

Does it matter when they give us? As long we have it, its all good. What
rain?


Ahh ok the insult. which is a perfectly logical statement... In different areas of the game the druid class is played differently. So if you've never been there how can you know EVERYTHING about the druid class? Why would you take insult at this? Are you not confident in you're own 99% knowledge of the class? Are you so ****ing insecure about the 1%?? Can you not accept that the game might change slightly for you when you're in Ele or Time or going through GoD? Do you honestly want to be doing the same **** with different surroundings for another year?

Ok, let me make this clear to you. Knowing how to play your class =! Knowing how the encounters works. Its easy knowing how encounters works. Just ask someone or do it once or twice and you will know it. :) playing your class its knowing when you do cast your spells, what to do, how to react etc.. it isn't the same. It takes time and practice. Doesn't matter what it is. its always the same thing really.


And Necormancers by far are the highest damage in the game. How? Well Wizards dish out alot of power, but they have long downtime due to medding like us. Necromancers do not. 1 necromancer can kill 3-4 times as many Doomfire soldiers in PoF to my 1 and medding. And to a wizards 2 and medding. The FD ability that necromancers get mean they can lay on the damage and then FD to kill aggro. The only time they have to worry about aggro are on raids, same with wizards mages and every other class. Like us wizards have more point damage.. but necromancer damages totaly ownes both us and wizards in the long run. A necromancer gets 2 mana bars, with the ability to self heal at low cost, even for free, and the highest mana regen in the game, not even counting hp regen. So ya it's a little funny to see a godly class laugh at us for whinning.

You talking totally about another thing. You talking about do damage over time. That isn't really same as who can do the most damage since most of the time when we talking about it its usually who can do more damage in a short amounf of time or the damage done say per minute. Most of the raids/group encounters requires you to dish out damage in a short amout of time, not like waiting for you to kiling it slowly with dots. For example, wizards can kill mobs in pofire really fast with their nukes and they can quad. which means killing 4 mobs at the same with with like 1 mana bar. Necors don't spend much mana but they killing it pretty slow and it takes a bit of time. Its kinda the same when you considering a wiz killing 4 mobs at the same time, med to full than a necro dot kite 4 doomfire mobs. Wizs are a bit faster acutally...

Oh btw excuse me its a bit late here and my mind not really working :p

Aerokella
04-27-2004, 12:27 AM
blah blah blah blah I LIKE DONUTS blah blah blah blah blah blah KRISPY KREME DONUTS blah blah blah blah blah CREME FILLED KRISPY KREME DONUTS blah blah blah blah

I swear that's all I saw when I read Cos' post :blow:

Kulothar
04-27-2004, 08:25 AM
Well, look at the nukes. Why the **** were we given the ability to nuke ICE when we've never had it before lvl 50? We had rain.. but **** it take it away.

Ummm.. What class did you say you played Cosmoxx?? I know you don't play a druid since our Avalache at lv 39 was one of the best Ice based spells of the time (pre-Kunark) and Ice was used on every Naggy raid since it was cold based and debuffed FR for the other nuke classes.

Pre-Kunark fire resistance was the bane of most groups since the best non-fear/hate/sky lv 35+ exp was in Sol B since Perma was such a pain to get to and LGuk was overcamped. Our fire line as well as the other classes worked well in Perma but you could go OOM fast in Sol B casting fire based spells and not do any damage.

WEDruidVZ
04-27-2004, 01:55 PM
Hey Cosblow, does all the "****ing" help you feel better? So your gear sucks as well...Hmm. Does that mean that you HAVEN'T been able to fully experience the total druid class either? Let's say your next to a druid who has the VERY BEST gear in the game, MAX AA's and your both at the very END of the game...do you think that you're are still the consummate druid because you're there next to him/her? The other druid will obviously be working allot LESS, mana wise, then you per spell since he should have, based on his UBER top-shelf, Ele/Time gear. In other words, and according to your sludge, YOU could not know everything about the druid class in your current setup because he can do thing faster and more efficient....<br>
Point being, I am not a healer primarily. Why, because my current level and style doesn't require it. Yet, I feel I know my class as well as any other druid...that's to say any other druid at level 48. When I grow up, I'll realize, after having gained more spells and experience that there is more. But NOW I'm pretty happy in the knowledge I can heal if needed, nuke when required, DOT when it's appropriate...I can solo and do well, group and do just as well...I can charm kite, fear kite, quad and Root/Rot...I can even sit on my ass and watch the other 5 members of my group rip an LDoN apart, without as much as casting 1 or 2 spells the whole time...I WON"T, but I can. Because I feel I know my class, how it works, when certain things are required, and even how to just plain be lazy.
<BR>In other words, take your post, the one you were rushed through, and reword with the title: "This is NOT what defines the druid class"...
<BR>And why is your post even in this thread? It started out with Aeg having his zipper down and turned into a Krispy Kreme commercial (chocolate cream filling for me please).

Claeopha
04-27-2004, 05:43 PM
Yorn desh born, der ritt de gitt der gue,
Orn desh, dee born desh, de umn -
Bork! bork! bork!

Kytelae
04-27-2004, 08:55 PM
I would never use a tinkered item to stop the rain! Stopping the rain is what druids do best! Stopping the rain is my primary job on raids of all kinds!!!

Panamah
04-27-2004, 10:40 PM
Geez, you're getting back on topic again. I see I have to step in here and straighten you out again.

Don't make me have to hurt you!
http://a1259.g.akamai.net/f/1259/5586/1d/images.art.com/images/PRODUCTS/Regular/10007000/10007825.jpg

Or I'll send this one after you to jiggle his belly in your general direction

http://a1259.g.akamai.net/f/1259/5586/1d/images.art.com/images/PRODUCTS/large/10052000/10052001.jpg

Arienne
04-27-2004, 11:03 PM
I would never use a tinkered item to stop the rain! Stopping the rain is what druids do best! Stopping the rain is my primary job on raids of all kinds!!!OMIGOD we've been NERFED! They fixed it so that it doesn't rain indoors again. :/

Kytelae
04-28-2004, 10:17 AM
Oooh littie kitty kitty.... cute kitty...

Kulothar
04-28-2004, 02:23 PM
This is now a thread about donuts. Get it right.

Fun fact: Krispy Kreme, Inc. makes 7.5 million donuts a day and more than 2.7 billion a year.


Ummm... Who counts them every day??

Tak
04-28-2004, 03:09 PM
One thing every leaves out about druids being the "second best healer" is that we have leather armor. On multiple pulls, we need to throw a quick heal because the MT is dying quickly, which agros most of the mobs. We then die quickly. Plate or even chain class healers can survive until crowd control can kick in. -- So are we really the second best?

Arienne
04-28-2004, 05:06 PM
Ummm... Who counts them every day??There's this new-fangled calculator kinda thingamajig out now called a "computer".

Aidon
04-29-2004, 12:18 AM
There's this new-fangled calculator kinda thingamajig out now called a "computer".


When the computer's finally rise up and destroy us pesky humans...it'll because a certain computer finally went insane after counting donut 15,345,935,293,951.

Woody TM
04-29-2004, 10:40 AM
There have been so many rants, raves etc on this subject. Personaly I love the druid class as is. We arn't main healers, if you're a druid and you want to heal better, stop yourself, /log, go to your char. screen and delete your druid...remake a cleric, and then you can heal to your hearts desire. Let the druids be smaller healers and take care of spots and other minor healings please.

Now if we could get a new quad nuke, I'd take that. Maybe our little bear made to be a few lvls higher with a few more hps would be nice.

Other than that, great job on the class Sony, Im one of the few happy customers. :)

Panamah
04-29-2004, 01:50 PM
There have been so many rants, raves etc on this subject.

Yeah, that donut counting business is a hot button.

Fyyr Lu'Storm
04-29-2004, 09:58 PM
"you forgot, "in the snow, uphill, BOTH WAYS""

Well, actually it was in the rain, never did like the hills, but I did do them mostly running backwards.

Aerokella
04-30-2004, 12:15 AM
I would just absolutely love to quit my job and be a donut taster!!! Anyone know of any openings?

Arienne
04-30-2004, 10:11 AM
I would just absolutely love to quit my job and be a donut taster!!! Anyone know of any openings?I think you need to work on expanding your bottom line prior to the interview or you will have little credibility. Gotta get the preliminary reqs out of the way first! ;)

Iegluan
05-07-2004, 12:08 PM
Poor misquided Cosmo you really have no clue about the Druid class or atleast your guild is. Before you even think of attacking me I am Time flagged and Kod'taz flagged so yes I have been there done that. Druid's primary role can be both nuking and healing depends on your guilds outlook on the class you must educate them.

As far as having to be EP/Time/GoD flagged to know your class you sir are a idiot I played my Druid just the same before I joined a raiding guild as I do now. Sure I didn't know what would cure quarms DoT's does that mean I sucked at my class uh no just means I never had to worry about it.

You seem to think just because you are in the high end game you are better then the other Druid's I think not I bet you would be out performed solo wise by over half the Druid population just cause you think you are better then them. I know a few Druid's that can't solo a mob to save there lives and I know other Druid's that can't keep a group alive cause they have done nothing but solo.

Let me restate it for you. Just because you are EP/Time/GoD flagged does not make you god and does not determine wether you know how to play your class or not.

TeriMoon
05-07-2004, 12:38 PM
astonishingly, no new information has been generated by this thread.

Sobe Silvertree
05-07-2004, 12:39 PM
Yup - I have to agree.

Panamah
05-07-2004, 12:49 PM
I would just absolutely love to quit my job and be a donut taster!!! Anyone know of any openings?

Don't apply to Krispy Kreme! They've had to restate their earnings, close down some shops. Apparently the low carb diet phenomenon is hitting their bottom line!

astonishingly, no new information has been generated by this thread.


Hah! I bet you didn't know Krispy Kreme profits were down this quarter, did you?

Willain
05-07-2004, 01:01 PM
Don't apply to Krispy Kreme! They've had to restate their earnings, close down some shops. Apparently the low carb diet phenomenon is hitting their bottom line!

What dieting fad could possibly NOT hurt Krispy Kreme's bottom line? Irregardless, they must be doing OK, since one finally opened up in my town, allowing access to decent donuts for the first time since I moved up north 4 years ago.

Arienne
05-07-2004, 02:43 PM
Dieting? Have you seen the pics of the EQ Fan Faires? Proof positive that donuts still sell!

Sialata Anjelita
05-07-2004, 04:18 PM
Dieting? Have you seen the pics of the EQ Fan Faires? Proof positive that donuts still sell!

Ouch. Luckily, I'm young and can eat as many donuts as I want :D !

drakonon
05-08-2004, 12:34 PM
guys, as druids we probably won't be the best at anything, since as in an RP sense, which is what Sony/Varent based all our classes on. We are but nature protecting people, bound to leather armor by our dieties and given only a limit to our abilities as all classes are. So Role Playing wise, which would be why this game is called an mmoRPG, we are bound to the limits that the original RPGs of like of D&D set for druids. We can only use scimitars and clubs, wear leather armor, work entirely with just animals at best, and use most of our skills outdoors. Because Role Playing wise we are the embodyment of nature.

Now yes we are 2nd best in many things, but to be first best would pretty much reak havoc for the other classes. then this post wouldn't have been made and someone would be in some other class's boards, bitching about how druids have taken over their spots as number one. So if you wanna be #1 in something druids aren't your kind of class.

And you know, the first post on this forum was about how we whine all the time about being 2nd best. Why would we want to be anything more, better than being third or worst yet, not at all. I've been a druid for over 3 years now (ain't as long as some of u older gents/gals) but, as long as I can remember we have been a class that has been able to survive on it's own or in groups. Thus meaning we've had no real reason to complain. And those that have complained were probably just wanting something new. And if they are those non-stop complainers, tell'em to do exactly what a previous poster said, delete ur druid and make something else that is a #1 in something!

And for Aeg who was talkin about how snare completely unbalances our class. If you even played a druid, u'd understand that snare is the thing that makes us #1 in something -bout the only thing that makes us #1- , because aside from necros WE are the best kiters in the game. And that is because of snare. And why we have such a long snare over the necros and the wizards and the sks, is because we have to take 2nd best in everything. Necros = Dots/strong pets, Wizards = Nukes & more nukes, SKs = strong melee and hell still a better pet than us!

So, the relevance of even starting this thread so long long ago, is just down right idiotic, probably posted by some guy who doesn't even know the first thing on playing a druid.

PS: Thank you Sony/Varent for making a class that is my favorite and IMO well rounded class. I love my Druid very much!

-Drakonon Nightwind-
-----AV Member-----
--65 Storm Warden--