View Full Forums : Potions in PvP


Moonferal
03-19-2006, 10:02 PM
In a recent WSG I was in a warrior made the mistake of thinking I'd be an easy kill. He and I had a good fight that saw me close to killing him while I still had about 25% of my health. Well he's jumping all over the place, a tactic I find extreeeeemly annoying, and I get him in front of me finally and I see that what was his 10% or less health has jumped to almost 50%, we were solo, no others around to heal him, he obviously used a healing potion, warriors don't have a skill to heal themselves that I know of. This really got me mad, I'm screaming at him through the screen "you damn cheating bum..". He killed me, kept me from stopping the guy running with our flag. So this brings me to my question, should I be using potions in BG's?

It's been my understanding for some time (basically since I started playing game and thought about PvP) that using potions in PvP is considered cheating. But lately I've seen alot of it being done. I'd like to know what others think about this. I even saw a post here suggesting what would be a good potion for a flag-run.

Is this cheating or not? If not I could be doing alot better in BG's.

Kain Elderan
03-20-2006, 01:52 AM
I don't have the game yet so I guess I can't give a general feeling of what the "community" thinks, but I can tell you my experiences from years of MMORPG's.

If its available, use it. I played Ultima Online for many years and we had the "pot whores". Many people would complain about it, especially since there was no limit on consuming them in this game. I wasn't into PvP until later in my UO life, and when I did get into it I came to realize that its a very valid tactic. Why would Blizzard put it in the game if it wasn't supposed to be used?

Those who cry cheating are just upset that you came prepared, and that you're probably going to win the fight. Nobody prevented them from bringing their own potions, which would make the fight "even" in that regard. *shrugs* Granted this is just my opinion, but I can tell you thats how I'll play when I finally get the game.

Ghost Bear
03-20-2006, 02:57 AM
Those who cry cheating are just upset that you came prepared, and that you're probably going to win the fight. Nobody prevented them from bringing their own potions, which would make the fight "even" in that regard.

Yes this is correct. Fact is that anyone can make or buy pots. Its not some secret exploit. Every profession has something to bring to PVP. No one complains when engineers use their death guns. Or a warrior is running around swinging his arcanite reaper. How about a warlock in his Robe of the Void. No more crusader/lifestealing/spell power enchants. There is no reason anyone should complain about pots.

Kyane
03-20-2006, 05:59 AM
Pots are part of the game. We can heal ourselves without them, but some extra mana to get that last heal off on a tank as he takes down the general, is anyone going to complain?

Rogues live on potions, health, armor, agility, crits, speed, poison.

I never go into a BG now without some extra armor pots, mana, health and strength. You never know when you'll need it.

Atrus
03-20-2006, 08:32 AM
Yes, you should use potions.

It's part of the game and it needs to be done to in situations where you can help your team. I gaurantee if it is me or him and I can use a potion to win, I will use one.

Potions provide great buffs and advantages in and of themselves. I don't feel bad for using them because quite frankly there are people who I fight who have better weapons and better armor. We don't have even stats or equipment so I like to even the playing field.

It's great in lower BG's to take down a twink (can you say advantage) by popping a potion. I am sure they are screaming at the top of their lungs.

I know that potions fall under the 'cheating' catagory in most people's minds but in reality it is nothing different than having better weapons, armor, and enchantments. Basically you are getting buffs, stats, health, and/or mana from your potions.

Kireth
03-20-2006, 09:13 AM
I look at it like this...

If it were a real life and death situation you would do whatever it took to win right?

I do whatever it takes to win a PvP fight. Im on Arthas (a PvP server) and I have been shown NO mercy 90% of the time. Once in a while a 60 horde will ignore me but just as often he will kill me on sight. If I had a potion or trick to use, you bet I will use it.

If I had the ability I would mind control my opponent off a cliff lol...

Kireth
38 Druid
Arthas

Moonferal
03-20-2006, 09:35 AM
Cool, thanks for the input.

My thinking that it was cheating was based on what I'd heard from others. Guess not many people think that way anymore.

Going to have to peruse the offerings of my local alchemist or maybe go into alchemy myself. Free Action potions look particularly attractive for my flag runs.

It will be nice to have a way to even things out since I'm not really too twinked.

Thanks all

gwmort
03-20-2006, 09:39 AM
Potions are more than fair in BG competitin they are encouraged (one of the key perks of PvP ranks is dirt cheap pots that can only be used in BGs).

Where you see much more debate is people using potions in duels, as nothing is really at stake, and use of consummables seems a little "crutchy". One problem you will have if feral though is you can't use a potions in forms, so would have to shift out to caster to do the same thing the warrior did.

Sond
03-20-2006, 09:45 AM
I expect people to use whatever they have in PvP. Warlocks will use soulstones. Shamans will use anhks. Everybody uses potions. But the group of 60 Warlock and 56 Shaman that had to use soulstone, anhk and pots to take down a 59 druid know they got owned.

Rayze
03-20-2006, 12:21 PM
I am going to go with the majority on this one. People who hate people who use pots in battle, are merely mad at themselves that they didn't bring any along lol

In a duel setting however, the general consensus is pots = poo for skill. To avoid that verbal onslaught, just ask if pots will be allowed in the duel.

Rayze
03-20-2006, 12:22 PM
But the group of 60 Warlock and 56 Shaman that had to use soulstone, anhk and pots to take down a 59 druid know they got owned.

How about sending in 6 people to come in after me while I was healing up after we took down Belinda? lol

Bahroo
03-20-2006, 12:47 PM
Whenever my previous guild ran into another guild in BG, we go all out. In WSG, we'll pop potions, toss engineering bombs, use our goblin rocket helms, or our gnomish mind control caps on the opposing players, and anything else we have to win the game.

Hmm... free action potions, ftw.

Rayze
03-20-2006, 12:48 PM
Hmm... free action potions, ftw.

Yeah just wish they'd last longer...all the damn alliance seem to do is stun, fear, stun, fear, rinse & repeat lol

Anubrim
03-21-2006, 12:22 PM
Yeah just wish they'd last longer...all the damn alliance seem to do is stun, fear, stun, fear, rinse & repeat lol

Ya thats almost as bad as...stun, fear, stun, fear, frost shock, totem, frost shock, frost shock, totem, fear , stun........LOL.

Always! Always! Always have pots on you and use them.

Darleeg
03-21-2006, 03:40 PM
Use Pots in PvP, Just not in Duels...Duels are for Learning.

Darleeg
Medihv

Bulldoser
03-21-2006, 09:34 PM
One thing I love about potions in PVP. When that silly little ally Pots and I still kill him. hehe...wasted his money!

Bulldoser
60 Druid of Spinebreaker
Denizens of Defilement

Rainlight
03-21-2006, 10:11 PM
I had a 51 hunter pot on me when I took him down to about 10 percent in 5 seconds. Poor guy wasted a major healing pot and died 10 seconds later. I don't even bother potting if I know I'm going to die.

Uvgrin
03-22-2006, 01:14 PM
I think in a duel there is nothing wrong with it.. if you want to waste a pot do it.. either player can use a pot so there is no "cheating" going on that I see. I would define cheating as something one player could do but the other couldn't. Normally in a duel I never pot since I don't have to run backy to my body. Something like engineering I might consider cheating.. but I won't get into that whole speal.
In the pvp world though I would see it as anything goes.. they can use a pot or call in their 5 buddies to take you down... not many rules... corpse camping is a bit low especially 60's camping people 20 levels lower.. but hey if they want to waste their time go for it.

Waterloo
04-16-2006, 01:28 AM
I like to go get sandwiches whenever the horde sends their corpse camping armies....


I dunno what the allaince or horde are like on your servers but the horde on mine are trash...and there are quite a few nasty allaince people here as always. Taught me to never trust anyone who spams someone's a ninja in capital cities. =P

graceful chaos
04-17-2006, 06:36 PM
Potions in BG or duels, or anywhere you can use them are fair game. Like someone previously said, it's no more cheating than having better gear or weapons.
Corpse camping though... Don't get me started.

goa
05-15-2006, 12:47 PM
Using ANYTHING in fair PvP isnt cheating. You can use what ever sh!t you have at your disposal (engineering, potions.. freaking whipper roots is ok).

PvP is PvP. You use everything at your arsenal to win. If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen tbh. Only sh!tty players make excuses.. skilled PvP:ers are ready for anything.

If you don't like pots. Write a ticket to a GM and get em banned. But they are in the game.. get used to it or go back playing pacman! =)

I got flamed a lot for using FAP's in PvP by rogues getting their asses kicked (not all rogues mind you - many rogues can take it).. i mean.. if you CAN'T handle people using stuff that cripples your game plan, you need more practice. =) IMPROVISE FFS!

As graceful chaos said thou.. I don't have much left for corpse campers.. not that anyone can corpse camp me, but not all classes have it as easy as druid when it comes to doding fights.

Kill em once. /wave /bow and move on. No1 likes a corpsecamping retard. =)

Woolybully
05-16-2006, 11:53 AM
It's been my understanding for some time (basically since I started playing game and thought about PvP) that using potions in PvP is considered cheating. But lately I've seen alot of it being done. I'd like to know what others think about this. I even saw a post here suggesting what would be a good potion for a flag-run.

Is this cheating or not? If not I could be doing alot better in BG's.

Not sure on what your basing your opinion on but to me this is just typical PvP. In duels its commonly accepted that people shouldn't be potting or bandaging. But BG's and world PvP is different. I personally don't chug major health or mana pots in a BG. It just doesn't make sense to. I just use those mini pots you can buy from the Hall of Legends. In world PvP I'll chug one if I have one on me.

I've PvP'd for a long time. I've been playing WoW since open beta and stress test days. I love PvP'ing and its what keeps me playing WoW since raiding gets to be extremely boring. And when I'm out PvP'ing I use it all. Pots, bandages, healthstones... but I've never used stuff like whipper roots. And my opponents are doing the same if they are smart. World PvP is true all out war and this is why I love it. Use everything you've got cuz I'm going to do the same. Its generally small skirmishes, hit n' runs or people trying to gank you. To me this is the most exciting form of PvP'ing.

In battlegrounds I'm more conservative though. To me its a waste to chug the bigger pots or use somewhat valuable pots and items. The death rate is just too high to justify it and I don't mind dying in a BG.... it happens all the time to everybody. At its roots battlegrounds are just another place where you have to grind time to get a reward. In the case of battlegrounds you do it for PvP rewards and reputation to buy PvP items. Its a great place to hone your skills in fighting multiple people. But many times you just get zerged over without a fair chance to defend yourself. The more important thing is to get your rep and rank... then move on.

Woolybully
05-16-2006, 11:58 AM
One thing I love about potions in PVP. When that silly little ally Pots and I still kill him. hehe...wasted his money!

Bulldoser
60 Druid of Spinebreaker
Denizens of Defilement

Yea thats hilarious. I remember this Warrior who used major pots, whipper roots, used all these somewhat expensive items in Arathi Basin. On top of that he had MC/BWL gear AND usually had 1 or 2 people following him around healing him.... usually a pally or a druid. He had already been exalted in AB for a long time. He only went in there for easy kills since the rest of the people in there usually had pretty average blues and greens. I'd laugh so hard when he used all this pots, etc.. and still die. And it became common knowledge that this guy always had healer groupies so we'd specifically go after his healers. Ah what fun :texla:

goa
05-16-2006, 05:01 PM
waste? a potion? I can farm 25 potions in an hour. Why is it a "waste" to use em in pvp? When the hell should I use em then?

I only play PvP (oh well, sometimes the guild drags me to PvE some.. BWL is the favorite.. AQ isnt my cup of tea yet.. but still, killing da emperors was a fun mission=)).. so I rather "waste" my potions on the thing I'm here for. =)

Oh, BTW I've been exhalted in AB since october last year. I STILL use pots in AB. Why you ask? Because I like to pvp and I think it's the funniset BG.

Woolybully
05-17-2006, 08:38 AM
Well more power to you then. I consider it a waste when major healing pots go for around 1-1.5g a pop on my server. Not sure what yours is like. Perhaps your one of those guys who doesn't have other characters or as mentioned doesn't PvE much or does nothing other than farm flowers with his spare time. In that case it works out great for you.

In my case I have 4 going on 5 lvl 60's which will definitely put a dent in your gold stash. If I had only stayed with 1 or 2 characters I'd easily have over 2k gold just sitting around right now. So yep I am a bit miserly when it comes to using stuff in a BG just to keep from dying a couple times. Especially since I'm willing to take a few deaths for the team to keep a flag from being tapped or just to tie up the opposition and slow them down so our side can get another flag. To me its just part of the game.

I also think that AB is the funnest BG right now. WSG is fun for a druid.. no doubt but I'm not much of a CTF pvp'er. AV is just a zergfest but worth it to a druid to get a couple epics. Boring as heck to a feral druid though. AB is funner but has another benefit. It gives you a chance to learn how to fight 2-3 opponents at the same time. It also gives you the chance to do a few 1 vs. 1 in a purer pvp setting. My main is exalted in all 3 BG's but the best battles have been in AB. Can't wait til they bring out a new BG.

goa
05-19-2006, 06:55 AM
Ya I only have one lvl 60 character (and a ****load of lvl 10-20's). :D

Woolybully
05-19-2006, 12:19 PM
Thats kind of how I started. 1 60 and a bunch of little guys. But the 1st guy I rolled was an undead priest (this was before BG's and PvP rewards). So people pretty much expected me to be there personal healbot even though I was spec'd heavy shadow. I don't mind tossing up occasional heals and I do it often but I just didn't care for the "heal me now!" mentality that seemed to prevail at the time. 2nd character was a Lock so I could have a caster who wasn't required to heal anybody. It turned out nice because I love the complexity of the class. 3rd was a Shaman who was spec'd all wrong so I didn't pvp him much. After respec'ing he's a blast and I always itch to pvp with him now. 4th was Woolybully and how can you not like playing a druid I ask :texla: Funnest thing I do on a druid..... kill rogues :wiggle:

Be careful its contageous. Once you get your 2nd 60 you'll want a variety of 60's if not to have another character to pvp with and learn about another class but also to do instancing with your friends. Most of my friends/guildmates have multiple 60's so we can usually put together some kind of party to go do Scholo/DM or something. Only problem I've noticed is that it tends you make you poor. Thats probably my fault since each of my characters has some kinda max'd out skill like mining, leatherworking, tailoring, engineering. I think this has sucked up a bunch of my gold.

goa
05-19-2006, 09:49 PM
Thats kind of how I started. 1 60 and a bunch of little guys. But the 1st guy I rolled was an undead priest (this was before BG's and PvP rewards). So people pretty much expected me to be there personal healbot even though I was spec'd heavy shadow. I don't mind tossing up occasional heals and I do it often but I just didn't care for the "heal me now!" mentality that seemed to prevail at the time. 2nd character was a Lock so I could have a caster who wasn't required to heal anybody. It turned out nice because I love the complexity of the class. 3rd was a Shaman who was spec'd all wrong so I didn't pvp him much. After respec'ing he's a blast and I always itch to pvp with him now. 4th was Woolybully and how can you not like playing a druid I ask :texla: Funnest thing I do on a druid..... kill rogues :wiggle:

Be careful its contageous. Once you get your 2nd 60 you'll want a variety of 60's if not to have another character to pvp with and learn about another class but also to do instancing with your friends. Most of my friends/guildmates have multiple 60's so we can usually put together some kind of party to go do Scholo/DM or something. Only problem I've noticed is that it tends you make you poor. Thats probably my fault since each of my characters has some kinda max'd out skill like mining, leatherworking, tailoring, engineering. I think this has sucked up a bunch of my gold.

Goa - Rogue killer

I build my druid as a rogue killer (believe me, I've fought the best of em - even the master epic geared AQ40 rogues - my favorite target are undeads. ;))

I also roleplay my druid as a undead rogue slayer - drives them crazy, promise. :)

Many ppl thinks its all about epics - bull**** i say.. I have over 40 epic items, I still use blues in PvP because they are better.

Undead Rogue slayer FTW! :D