View Full Forums : Wish Blizz would change this!


windsaber/windriss
02-14-2008, 04:02 PM
I wish Blizz would change the feral gear to include defense on it!
I have T4 gear and not one piece has defense on it. The T5, T6.. doesn't have defense on it.

It makes it hard to get enough defense to be uncrush. and crit. without taking away stam.

What do you all think?
Windsaber

Kauroth
02-14-2008, 04:11 PM
Welcome to Warcraft.

Use rings/cloak/enchants/gems/trinkets.

:D

Kyane
02-14-2008, 04:18 PM
I hope you just meant uncrittable, since we cannot reach uncrushable.

Claritondeus
02-14-2008, 05:01 PM
sup niner

AppleJax
02-14-2008, 09:18 PM
Y'know, for a game with "craft" in the name, WoW's crafting system is pretty pathetic. A better game would combine the crafting and raiding aspects of the genre with fully-customizable gear.

Cuba
02-15-2008, 08:27 AM
Speaking of defense.. I heard something about 450 being max. Is this true? =P

And do you need 450 def + 103 resilience (Think i read that somewhere here on the grove) to be uncritable or am i totally wrong?

Kauroth
02-15-2008, 10:01 AM
It's not 450, it's 415 Defence (if you have 3/3 Survival Of The Fittest Talent) or 103 Resilience to become "uncrittable".

The reason I put it in quotes is that there's no way to become 100% uncrittable, but having 415 Defence or 103 Resilience will get you to something like 0.000001% chance or something like that.

If you don't have 3/3 SoTF, you'll need 490, just like a Warrior.

To find out if you're ok with a combination of both Def/Res, open your character tab and mouse over your Defence, it will show you a percentage.

You're shooting for 2.6% as SoTF will top out the next 3% to give you 5.6% Avoidance which is what is required for Raid Bosses.

So there are some people who say stacking Defence above 415 is beneficial, but I think once you hit 415, focus on Agility.

Hope that helped.

Claritondeus
02-15-2008, 01:32 PM
^ this is correct.

To expand, you need to get to a total of 2.6% crit reduction (you need to have SoTF). You can do this by combining resil and defense. The 103 resil number is what you would need to get the 2.6% using resil only and no defense. You can combine defense and resil any way you want, as long as you get to that magic 2.6% number (as seen by mousing over the Defense and Resil in the character tab and adding them together).

Also, stack agi, and get a Badge of Tenacity. Dodge is win, as we have no block or parry.

Claritondeus
02-15-2008, 01:56 PM
Our MT

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/irahi/over100.jpg

AppleJax
02-15-2008, 02:45 PM
How much avoidance (dodge, parry, block) do you need to push Crushing Blows off the table? 100%? 105%? I mean, does your main tank there have to deal with crushing blows anymore?

Kauroth
02-15-2008, 03:12 PM
If you notice, he's activated both trinkets.

His un-trinketted dodge must be around 75% as those 2 add 24.5% Dodge when activated.

Wowzers.

http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Blackrock&n=Bizkin

I think he's gemming way too much Agility.

Any idea how his Rage generation is?

Claritondeus
02-15-2008, 06:17 PM
Crushing blows are never off the table afaik for druids. During the time he pops his trinket, he only has to worry about magic dmg. Usually only does this when healers are in trouble (i.e. Druid Shield Wall).

I think that was only one trinket - I believe Moroes' Watch and the Badge have shared cd's, the same way you can't pop two ap trinkets simeltaneously (but you can back to back). Not sure though about that 100%.

Rage generation isn't much of a problem. That was taken while tanking SSC, and the miscelaneous magic damage that is thrown around in that place helps with that (I believe this was during lurker, and the water was helping him get hit). Also his crit is over 50% as well when he pops his trinkets.

What would you suggest gemming over agi?

Kauroth
02-15-2008, 09:27 PM
I think that was only one trinket - I believe Moroes' Watch and the Badge have shared cd's, the same way you can't pop two ap trinkets simeltaneously (but you can back to back). Not sure though about that 100%.

Nope, both.

Check my macro thread in the Emerald Dream forum.

Anyway...

What would you suggest gemming over agi?

Stamina stamina stamina.

But then again, my playstyle is to outlast the Crushing Blows themselves.

I'm not near to him in gear however so I don't know if I'll continue this way through SSC/TK and beyond, but from what I've found, my healers prefer healing me to a Similarly geared Warrior as they know I can take those couple extra hits that would dent a Plate Wearer.

To each their own though. Those are some seriously impressive stats.

AppleJax
02-16-2008, 01:23 AM
Crushing blows are never off the table afaik for druids. The reason for this is because there is a certain amount of avoidance (dodge, parry, block too, as blocked attacks can neither crit nor crush) required to be "uncrushable." The reason bears do not typically reach this threshold is the complete lack of parry and block mechanics for us. In theory, if you had access to itemization that just does not exist in-game at the moment, sure, druids could be uncrushable through avoidance from dodge alone. I'm just not sure about highest-level tank gear; as you can see, having +100% dodge is possible with epic lewtz.

Cuba
02-20-2008, 04:19 AM
My problem is kinda that i use the whole clefthoof set when tanking. Its good def/stamina but lacks str/agi. Right now i have low resilience but working on it. How much resilience should i get before i can get rid of my clefthoof? Just the 103 then?

Right now if i dont wear my clefthoof i have 396 def. And 28 resilience. Is that enough to be uncrittable? =P

Repelsteel
02-20-2008, 07:14 AM
Like what has been said in this topic, to see if you have 2.6% crit reduction (/w 3/3 Survival of the Fittest), mouse over your defense and resilience in your character tab and add up the numbers where it says 'decrease chance to be crit', it should be 2.6% or up.

A calculation you can use to work out what % reduction your +def & +res is shown below:

Crit reduction = (Item Def rating/2.4)*0.04 + (Item Resilience rating / 39.4)

For example if your defense rating = 105 with a resilience rating of 36 you get:

(105/2.4)*0.04 + (36/39.4)
(43.75)*0.04 + 0.86
1.75 + 0.86
= 2.61% reduction

I can't see what my def rating is atm at armory since I have my dps gear on, so can't use myself as an example but if you have 415 or more def and zero res and you would check your def rating you would see that with this formula you can see you are uncrittable. (Btw I have 424 def in my tanking gear so no need for res for me :))

So if we say that 415 def = 2.6% and you have 396 def that would equil 2.48% + (28/39.4) = 3.19% so I should say yes Cuba.

A way to check ingame if you are uncrittable is to use the following command (druid only), if the result is minus zero you are uncrittable:

/script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(2.6-(GetCombatRatingBonus(CR_DEFENSE_SKILL)*.04+GetCom batRatingBonus(CR_CRIT_TAKEN_MELEE)),1,0.5,0)Sourc e (http://www.wowwiki.com/Defense)

Cuba
02-20-2008, 09:47 AM
Thanks alot for the answer :) Ill start changing around some slots then to gain some more armor / stam / Agi / str :)

windsaber/windriss
02-20-2008, 09:50 AM
This is my toon, I wish I could get a new chest piece but do I need to improve anything, Dodge, HP....?

Thanks
Windsaber
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malygos&n=Windsaber

Repelsteel
02-20-2008, 10:51 AM
lol, I have almost the same tank gear as you, I only use the cloak from illhoof and the neckless from maiden instead of the badge items. For trinkets I use the 40 sta trinket from ssc trash (Spyglass of the hidden feet) and the moroes trinket, don't you have those yet? So you can replace the Mark of Tyranny? I had the badge of tenacity before but i exchanged it for that ssc trinket.

Looking at your hp now in tank gear in caster form I would say get some more hp, I have around 11.4 hp selfbuffed in my tank gear in caster form.

Maybe change a +8def gem for a 12 sta gem since you have enough defense? And/or use combined def/sta gems for a little more hp. Also you still have some 9sta gems instead of the 12sta ones. And maybe farm the mats for the 40sta/12agi enchant for your pants and let someone make it then. Also try working on getting exalted with Aldor so you can get the exalted shoulder enchant.

edit, new gear: FYI: with my gear I have self buffed 42% dodge and around 19-21k hp raid buffed in bear.

Btw I still have the clefthoof chest. And I use the T4 shoulders for dps and T5 for tanking.

windsaber/windriss
02-20-2008, 11:18 AM
Thanks
I had to take some stam gems out and get defense gems to make 415 defense, I passed on the SSC trinkets alot of times because I thought I needed the armor so I stay at 75% damage reduction max, should I get the trinkets from SSC?

I had alot more hit points but when I got the T4 I had to dump the stam gems for defense.
Anything I could do to get more hit points but stay at 415 defense and 75% damage reduction with armor?
Also improve dodge?

You will find omce you get the T4 or T5 pants and chest, your defense will be screwed bad, the clefhoof pants and chest give you so much defense it's hard to make it up without loosing hit points!

Thanks for the help!!!!
Windsaber

Repelsteel
02-20-2008, 11:27 AM
You can exchange the tenacity for spyglass, you loose around 1200 armor, but gain 400sta and a nice +use heal item (which i use constantly), personally I don't care much about armor, we usually have a round 29-31k anyway depending on what we have equipped or even more with the 4 pieces T4 set bonus.

Also if you want more dodge get the trinket from Moroes which gives 2% more dodge. And +12agi on boots gives even more dodge but you loose hp. And like I said get exalted with Aldor, that way you get even more dodge with that enchant.

Repelsteel
02-20-2008, 05:27 PM
Just to clarify, the following code still works, I just tested it, if the result is minus zero you are uncrittable:

/script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage(2.6-(GetCombatRatingBonus(CR_DEFENSE_SKILL)*.04+GetCom batRatingBonus(CR_CRIT_TAKEN_MELEE)),1,0.5,0)Sourc e (http://www.wowwiki.com/Defense)

tlbj6142
02-20-2008, 06:21 PM
But when I try it, I'm told I'm uncritable (-0.32423434) and I only have 405 defense.

s3Rgio
02-21-2008, 01:52 AM
maybe u got some resilence on your gear!

tlbj6142
02-21-2008, 09:02 AM
maybe u got some resilence on your gear!Nope. Not a drop.

Repelsteel
02-21-2008, 08:21 PM
Got T5 pants today and changed some gems and made a new bracers enchant, I have exactly 415 defense now. I used that ingame command and it reports as -0,0343 something so it still works for me :)

tlbj6142
02-21-2008, 09:55 PM
I think I figured out why it doesn't work for me. My base defense has not reached 350 yet (it takes so damn long to go up!). I think the above macro assumes you already have 350 def, which is why I get a negative number yet I only have +412 def (with 158 DR and 0 res).

FWIW, I was at 339 when I hit lvl 70. You'd think all of that kitty melee combat would give me plenty of chances to increase my +def, but it hasn't yet.

Repelsteel
02-22-2008, 04:46 AM
You will find omce you get the T4 or T5 pants and chest, your defense will be screwed bad, the clefhoof pants and chest give you so much defense it's hard to make it up without loosing hit points!

Well whaddaya know, I got the T5 pants last night :dance:

Funny enough I had been farming the +12 defense rating enchant in my spare hours, and it finally dropped two days ago after 12+(!) hours of farming for it. So the timing couldn't have bee better :) I enchanted my bracers with it asap which brings me back to exactly 415 def lol.

Have been changing some gems around btw and I now have 42% dodge selfbuffed in bear :D

s3Rgio
02-22-2008, 05:35 AM
@Repelsteel: u should really look for a change on your chest.
if u have access to pvp the S3 chest is the best thing to go if u have problems keeping the UNCRIT-part up.
and gives more armor, dodge, ap + crit & hit.
if u dont have armor issuess the S3 chest is far better than T5.

Repelsteel
02-22-2008, 06:42 AM
yeah thnx I know but I don't do bg/arena, don't have time for that :S Work over the day, raiding in the evening. Maybe I can farm honor for the S1 chest in the weekend. But Gladiator's Dragonhide Tunic (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28130) sux compared to Vengeful Gladiator's Dragonhide Tunic (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=33675) :S

Cuba
02-27-2008, 03:44 PM
Mine says -2.something >_>