View Full Forums : The Feral Druid in PvP combat
05-07-2005, 02:43 AM
I have seen a lot of posts where people ask about a feral build in pvp, but I havn't found one where anybody has really addressed this question, so I figure I'll give those who are interested my 2cp :D
The build I have right now at lvl 44 is 0/32/3 and when I hit 60, I plan to be at 0/35/16 or possibly 0/40/11. I have played with a heavy restoration build at 0/11/25 and found that, at least for my playstyle, the feral build is many times better for pvp. One of the biggest complaints I hear from people about the feral forms, is that they are like a weaker version of other classes. Which isn't neccisarily true. A druid's bearform isn't any weaker than a warrior, however, a warrior has much more versitility in his given area of expertise(melee combat). Where we lack that versitility in the bearform, it's made up for in our caster and cat forms. So in pvp with a heavy feral build(including lots of str/sta gear) I spend a lot of time shifting between the different forms as the situation demands. So far I have found it to be quite lethal. Feline swiftness is in my opinion one of the best skills a druid can get for pvp. Having the rogue form that runs fast all the time makes it really easy to catch people, and backstab them like nuts while they run. Having faerie fire in both cat and bear form makes it much easier for me to ensure rogues or other druids don't stealth away from me. at level 44 I'm seeing 700 point crits from ravage, and 300-400 point crits from backstab(which is easy to pull off mid fight when you can run around the enemy with feline swiftness). Also the cat form has track humanoids, making it very easy for me to stalk people. I've gotten many many honor kills from spotting people on track that I wouldn't have otherwise. A typical fight for me would vary depending on the situation. If I get the jump on someone I always lead with the cat form until I can get a 5 point rip to land, I'll then shift to druid, heal if needed, and tank out the person in bearform. If I don't have the jump I usually just start in bearform. I find I have too much hp for the casters to take before they go oom, and too much armor for most melees after I hit them with a demoralizing roar. Anyway, I'd like to hear some thoughts from you guys on the subject, and of course any questions you may or may not have. :D
05-07-2005, 06:38 PM
Greetings everyone, I'm new to these forums and just thought I would present myself before giving my opinion on anything. I just created a new Druid 2 weeks ago... So far Im level 21, but dont mind that because before I made my own Druid I learned alot from friends and guildies that are excellent Druid pvpers, I realized that when my 60 PvP-built warrior was constantly raped by Druids only!! But hey this is no place for warrior strats so just let me get to the point. A quick note... this guide is meant mostly for 1v1 pvp but also encompases many strats for group pvp.
Basically I've done my homework. I've studied and tested almost every single aspect of Druid combat and I've read almost every single Druid pvp strat guide on the web and I have come to this conclusion, IMO, for the most efficient talent-build for top PvP performance. I agree with most of what Kabaoum said. Only a few modifications and a deeper insight will complete my humble opinion. Here are some pointers.
First of all, the main thing that all PvP Druid should always keep in mind is the fact that the different forms ARE all exactly equivalent in POWER to theyre respectfull counterparts, the "only" difference is the versatilty, but remember these words: "A druid is not as versatile in their different forms as his counterparts, BUT, the Druid is the most generaly versatile class in the game, and make no mistake about it". So in order to win a battle, expect to shift a heck of alot of times and youll need to use all 3 combat forms all the time. The more the better, And I seriously mean shifting every 6-10 seconds or so, because changing your form not only gains you more skill combinations but it also confuses the heck out of your adversary. Never even consider remaining in one or two forms for a fight, it will only get you killed faster. Ill get more in depth further down concerning shifting and when to do it.
Second of all, a well-played pvp druid will make very little use of his healing abilities in battle, but of course he/she will use them if he/she needs to. I can tell you as a fact that I have seen many druids in a 1v1 fight use absolutely no healing spells (except frenzied regen). Basically your main focus as a pvper is quickness and shifting-efficiency.
Now for the raw material. Here is the talent point layout that I will use/have used. 0/33/18
...Now bear with me because I will explain my motives. The talents points up there will give you the following... very important abilities:
Feral Combat Talents (33 points)
Ferocity - 5/5 points
Reduces the cost of your Maul, Swipe, Claw, and Rake abilities by 5 Rage or Energy.
Sharpened Claws - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance while in Bear or Cat form by 5%.
Improved Bash - 2/2 points
Increases the stun duration of your Bash ability by 1 second.
Improved Prowl - 5/5 points
Reduces the chance enemies have to detect you while Prowling. More effective than Improved Prowl (Rank 4)..
Feral Charge - 1/1 point
Causes you to charge an enemy, stopping its movement and interrupting any spell being cast for 4 seconds.
Predatory Strikes - 5/5 points
Increases the Attack Power bonus from your Cat form ability by 20%.
Improved Shred - 2/2 points
Reduces the Energy cost of your Shred ability by 10.
Feline Swiftness - 1/1 point
Increases your movement speed by 30% while in Cat form. Only active outdoors.
Strength of the Wild - 4/4 points
Increases your Strength while in Bear or Cat form by 12%.
Primal Instinct - 1/1 point
Reduces the Mana cost of your shapeshifting abilities by 25%.
Improved Pounce - 2/2 points
Gives your Pounce ability a 100% chance to add an additional combo point to the target.
Restoration Talents (18 points)
Improved Mark of the Wild - 5/5 points
Increases the effects of your Mark of the Wild spell by 35%.
Furor - 5/5 points
Gives you a 100% chance to gain 10 Rage when you shapeshift into Bear form.
Improved Enrage - 2/2 points
Reduces the time required to generate Rage from your Enrage ability by 4 seconds and slightly reduces the Armor penalty.
Intensity - 5/5 points
Gives you a 100% chance to gain 40 Energy when you shapeshift into Cat form.
Gift of Nature - 1/1 point
Increases the effect of your Healing Touch, Rejuvenation, Regrowth, and Tranquility spells by 5%.
Now if you read what Kabaoum said about the different fighting situations, youll see some changes in what I have to say. Here are some basic strats for some situations. quick reminder, never forget to rebuff!!!
1. If you Attack first while prowling: 1st of all your feline swiftness will allow you to catch almost anybody even while stealthed. when you are in range use Imp Pounce and Imp Shred (your talents allow you to do so) Youll have very nice initial dmg, a nifty DOT and 3 combo point RIGHT off the bat, to boot. If your target is a cloth or leather wearer, accumulate one more combo point and get off your Rip A.S.A.P... If your target is not a healer and doesnt immobilize you then continue in Cat form if you have enough health (Keep in mind that if your up against a rogue or mage, then shift to Druid and use faerie fire after the pounce/shred to stop him/her from dissapearing, if this is the case then continue by Shifting to Bear). If your target is a healer or if he immoblizes you to run away, shift to bear form and use Feral Charge to catch up and interupt a spell cast (you will aready have 10 rage due to your Furor talent), then keep attacking him.... If you are halfway or less on health then use imp enrage and frenzied regen... if your HP is okay then use imp bash (to stun for 5 seconds) then shift back to Cat and go behind your target for another shred.... At this point all your key bear abilities are used up so focus mainly of finishing him/her off as quickly as possible in any way you see fit (but your opponent is as good as dead anyways if you pull all this off), I suggest staying in cat form for the speed boost. If your up against a plate wearer then do the same, Prowl, pounce/shred, shift to bear (do not heal with FR against Rogues/plate wearers) Bash, cat/shred... Since youll probably be needing to heal, stay in cat form and get a good distance away from your traget to cast regrowth (carefull with warriors Intercept though), since your in druid shape, remember always to take advantage of your instant spells such as MF and FF...
Note: Forget about Wrath or Starfire... you might as well remove them from your action bar. I very rarely seen a pvp druid use these in battle.
2. If you get ambushed or attack second: My advice is stay in whatever form you were in when you got attacked. If you were bear, then use bash A.S.A.P and shift to cat/shred, if you were a cat (then you can just run away if you dont wanna fight) then fight until your halfway on health then run to a safe distance and heal, shift to bear, feral charge (this is the only time I suggest using Demoralizing roar, since all other options are pretty much closed to you, unless you have the classic Bash/cat/shred available. Most of the time a druid will be able to win a fight if he is ambushed, it all depends on the skill of the other player and yours. But I suggest staying in cat form most of the time to avoid being ambushed in the first place.
3. Starting a fight in Druid Form: Cast all your instants (Moonfire, Faerie Fire and Rejuv), yes you heard me... Rejuvination, even if you took no damage at all... its worth it... once this is done, then start off in bear form. If you opponent is far (hunter, warlock) then charge, if not then save your charge and bash/cat/shred. The rest is pretty much up to you.... Just remember that being in cat form will allow you to heal more efficiently by getting a safe distance from your enemy.
Note: When fighting a Pally, stay bear form, fight and preserve all your rage, then use Frenzied regen to heal, and save your bash for after he uses his divine shield, hell regret using it so early. When fighting a preist, shift to cat when he uses power word: shield and run away, shift to druid and heal yourself if you have to, then bear form, charge/attack until his sheild is out, then bash/cat/shred, continue in cat form, hes pretty much dead. When fighting a Warlock or priest I suggest keeping yourself in cat form, with your movement speed his fear will be useless cuz youll be out of range in a matter of a second. (its funny to see really)
So this pretty much sums up my Opinion of a great pvp druid. Just remember to shift like mad, and use your advantage of speed and different forms to confuse your enemy and make quick work out of him/her. Thanks for reading this far. Feel free to comment.
05-07-2005, 09:20 PM
Several things I have to say about this build:
1. I agree with both posters Feral druid are the most fun in PvP, though you'll never get a restore specced druid to admit ANYTHING is worth sacrificing Innervate for.
2. I'm planning a 21/22/8 restore, feral, balance build (currently I'm lvl 26), because I think nature's swiftness is great for pvp, and you also get Furor and Intensity in that tree- getting off an instant heal is very useful.
3. I agree that changing forms is VERY important in PvP, so I am curious why you wouldn't get swiftshifting, like I plan to, it saves alot of mana, particularly if that is your playstyle, plus to get it you grab Nature's Grasp, instant cast root (against melees) is also good for pvp.
4. I really wanted to get Strength of the Wild and the increased dps for cat form, but I've read a few posts on some other forums that the dps increase isn't worth the talent points that far down a tree. I think the best Feral talents are Improved bash, Feral Charge, Feline Swiftness, and I can pick up Improved shred, and the fairy fire for the forms, on my way to Feline Swiftness.
So basically my build centers around around getting Nature's Swiftness, Swiftshifting, and Feline Swiftness- so I think it should be called the Swift Build.
05-07-2005, 09:53 PM
Swiftshifting is nice, however I don't think it's worth having to put 5 points into the first tier of the balance tree, and is better suited spending points into the restoration side of things. I personally don't think the improved pounce is worth it, as I use ravage more often than not. the 700 point crits are too much to give up :D another note on the strength of the wild, it builds off of your stats, so the more str you have the better it'll do for you. Another reason not to buy to much agi gear. :D also I think furor is a must have, but intensity is a wasted on the fact that you'll spend most of the time shifting OUT of catform in combat, rather than shifting in while your in the heat of battle. Energy comes much faster/easier than rage :D those are the only real spots I see myself differing.
p.s. It's nice to see that I'm not alone in favoring the feral tree for pvp :D
05-08-2005, 12:20 AM
If I wanted to go deeper in Feral I would probably give up swiftshifting first, but the 5 points for the tier 1 balance aren't exactly a waste, many druids use nature's grasp to great effect in pvp.
05-08-2005, 12:23 AM
very true, but I just can't see myself actually using it :/ though maybe it is something I should give a shot just to see how it works out.
05-09-2005, 12:16 PM
Nature's Grasp is very helpful when you need to put distance between yourself and a melee class initially and don't want to risk dmg while casting Roots.
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