The Republican philosophy in action

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erianaiel
Posts: 66
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2010 2:33 am

Re: The Republican philosophy in action

Post by erianaiel »

Fyyr wrote:
erianaiel wrote:What is at issue is the assumption that making rich people even richer automatically translates into them hiring -more- employees.
You don't make them richer. That's stupid.
*shrugs* I think this is a case of you reading into what you want to be there into what I wrote instead of what is actually there.
But you certainly don't stymie productive people from becoming rich. People deserving of being rich will just do it themselves.
If you can't see the difference(and many politicians can't) then you are a fucking retard.
Hmm. I can not see that I suggested otherwise. And I also do not think anything I wrote called for this level of insult aimed at me.
I don't need the government to be successful. To produce a product or service and be successful. I don't need a bailout or a handout. I am fine with them just staying out of by rectum, on the deal. If you can make a dollar without stealing or fraud, it is yours.
Congratulations to you. Lots of people are not so lucky these days. A lot of them probably thought just like you until they lost their job, their house and their future in quick succession.
You are right though that the goverment is not in it to be succesful. They are in it to ensure that everybody has the same chance at success and to protect those who can not otherwise protect themselves. Read up on your Dickens for a first hand account of what happens if government does not put limits in place on capitalism. Or read about life under the American 'robber barons'. Or for that matter, go take a look in the Foxconn factories where you can see the joys of unrestricted capitalism for the powerless for yourself.
When people from low economic class in the country can not become the best, brightest, and richest...then come back to me. Steve Jobs was an adopted bastard kid raised lower middle class who flunked out of college, look what happened there. When that stops, come back to me, ok.
Guess what. I am coming back to you. Because unless something changes and does so rapidly, the poor can not become best, brightest or rich. Already the odds that are stacked against them are almost insurmountable, and it will ony get worse in a hurry. You keep pointing towards Jobs (and Gates) as shining examples of what is possible, but they are the very rare exceptions. They also lifted on a period of rapid technological change that was extremely unusual in human history. Almost always change requires huge investments, which is controlled by, and profits only the people who already are rich. And for those who are not rich already, access to good quality schooling (considered a universal human right!) segragrates rapidly between the haves and the have nots. Access to funding your business? Getting harder every day. Justice is increasingly becoming a tool by the rich for the rich. Government then? Well, unless you get somebody to fork over about a billion dollar your chances of being elected president are zero, other jobs are cheaper to buy but still require a lot of money.
Rags to riches make a good fairy tale, but chances of that happening are very slim. Riches to rags on the other hand is a story that is depressingly common. Not surprisingly though, considering how the middle classes are quickly evaporating with a few migrating upwards to the upper (and soon to be heridatery) classes and the rest migrating into the masses of the poor.

But ... you go right on believing in fairy tales. They are around, after all, because it is more comforting to hear that things can get better.


Eri
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Tudamorf
Posts: 369
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:45 am
Location: San Francisco

Re: The Republican philosophy in action

Post by Tudamorf »

erianaiel wrote:
Tudamorf wrote:
Fyyr wrote:That is what the government did with these bailouts. The government gave them money.
You mean, loaned them money.
No, they gave them money. They called it a loan and it was paid back, but if you look at the terms and the way they paid it back you see that it was a cleverly disguised gift.

The government keeps lending money at a much lower interest rates than they are paying for their bonds so the money pumping machinery is still running full tilt, transfering money from government (i.e. the tax money everybody is paying) directly into the for profit accounts of the banks themselves.
A gift of the interest perhaps, but it's still a loan.

Compare that to the 2009 ARRA stimulus, which is an outright gift from the richest 1% to the "other 99%" (mostly the poorest).

I don't see any OWS protesters thanking the rich people for handing them over $700 billion. No, just biting the hand that feeds them, as usual.
erianaiel wrote:What is needed is not a one time amount of money but stable jobs that pay enough to support a family.
Who's going to offer those jobs, and why?
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