What a wonderful culture.

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Fyyr
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What a wonderful culture.

Post by Fyyr » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:27 am


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Tudamorf
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Tudamorf » Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:40 pm

As opposed to our culture, where families don't care about their mentally ill offspring and let them roam the streets (to be picked up periodically at huge taxpayer expense and pumped up with drugs).
The annual cost of care for the Dawabsha sisters alone is expected to amount to over $20,000.
Imagine that, a mentally ill person in a third world disputed territory can get 24/7 care for $10,000 per year. Here it costs more than that for an ambulance to pick up some drunk off the street.

Fyyr
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Fyyr » Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:29 am

You could not take care of a slave's basic needs for $10,000, to take care of your retarded kid 24/7.

When I did home health, essentially baby sitting, cooking, and cleaning, for developmentally disabled adults, I was making $10 per hour, 8 hour shift. To which your first sentence is generally wrong, our culture does take care of people like these girls. You just don't see it, or how it works. It's an almost invisible sector. And I guarantee you that their lifestyle, in many cases, is better than a care worker's making $10 per hour.

And an ambulance ride is about 1,000, not 10,000. It is $1,000 only because a majority of it's passengers never pay for the ride. No one is getting rich off the business of ambulances; besides lawyers chasing them.

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Tudamorf
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Tudamorf » Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:24 am

Fyyr wrote:To which your first sentence is generally wrong, our culture does take care of people like these girls. You just don't see it, or how it works.
In San Francisco, a large percentage of the homeless are mentally ill and/or drug addicts. Their families told them to piss off long ago, and no one really takes care of them, except for short term stuff that I pay a fortune for. So yes, I do see it, every day, and pay for it.
Fyyr wrote:And an ambulance ride is about 1,000, not 10,000. It is $1,000 only because a majority of it's passengers never pay for the ride. No one is getting rich off the business of ambulances; besides lawyers chasing them.
Actually, $10,000 was an understatement. In one study, San Francisco spent more than $20 million on emergency medical services for 477 homeless people in one year, with just 10 people costing $2.3 million.

So, which culture is worse? The one where the extended family maintains responsibility for their mentally ill offspring (albeit in a crude fashion), and can get 24/7 care for $10K per year, or the one where the families have no responsibility, and society has to spend enormous resources moving these people in and out of ERs, accomplishing nothing?

And I'm not even going into the economic differences, as their GDP per capita is about 5% of ours. You can't seriously expect one of the poorest areas in the world to offer the same level of care as you'd find in one of the richest areas.

Fyyr
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Fyyr » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:41 pm

Anyway.

If you think that chaining up your daughters in the house, specifically so they don't get raped, and then your family has to kill them when they do get raped,,, is sign of a superior culture. Have at it.

Fyyr
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Fyyr » Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:30 am

Oh, one other thing. Don't judge the rest of the country, or even state, by how SF treats its homeless.

Every trip to The City reminds me why I would never live there. The experience always leaves me with the impression that the people and city of SF actively want the homeless and beggars wandering around as some kind of cultural or tourist attraction. That it is some part of your culture, like the Presideo, the GG, Pier 39, or Coit Tower that you cherish and foster.

It's some kind of city Vision statement, I suppose. "Look at our City, and how permissive we are, we even let the mentally ill and homeless accost our visitors with total and complete abandon and freedom, with their smells, their begging, their rudeness, and even their body fluids. Come experience, smell, taste, and feel the real San Francisco".

I already posted on this site, over 10 years ago, that a good solution would be for SF to buy the Cow Palace. And turn it into a mini homeless city, with BART and buses only going one way from the City to it. It sure would cost you a lot less than what you are spending on keeping them as a tourist attraction. Put up a few hundred of 10x20 domiciles, with sanitation, bed, and cookplate, where the parking lot is. It's already fenced. Put a little medical clinic out in front, and a grocery, build a 215 dispensary on site. And have some form of active security throughout. It is a no brainer solution, but you SFriscans don't want to do something like that, because you care about the homeless and mentally ill.
Last edited by Fyyr on Tue Sep 06, 2011 2:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

Fyyr
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Fyyr » Tue Sep 06, 2011 2:15 am

The company I worked for was a local provider of services to this non-local organization...

http://www.vmrc.net/

The developmentally disabled/mentally ill clients I took care of had 24/7 onsite and offsite care. Cooking, laundry, cleaning, bathing, bowel care, bed transfers, total feeding care, all ADLS, health care, schooling were all taken care of. They lived in their own apartments or homes. In the case of my clients, two lived in a really nice shared apartment. One lived in a small apartment singularly. And three lived in a shared single family home.

Some, the higher functioning, of them would go to 'program' during the day, which was sort of like adult pre-school or kindergarten. They would make cut out pictures of flowers, glue string to bottles, and other such projects. Or go out on field day trips with counselors.

This level of service does take from your tax dollars. I was making $10 per hour, my employer had to be making triple that to cover my cost and their overhead, VMRC had to have some take away with their service provided. All of those people in the chain have to be paid for their services, of course(unless like you suggested we should have slaves to take care of them).

When I worked in hospital, I had a patient, a young man though even in his 20s he appeared to be a boy, who was being cared for by his two higher functioning mentally disabled parents. He was severely mentally disabled and deformed. The parents were paid by the state the take care of him at home when he was "healthy". The sad thing is that when the patient passed away secondary to his severe deformities, they were left without that income. I wonder what ever happened to them. I kinda miss him still, he would look over at me with a twinkle in his eye when I suctioned his EndoTracheal Tube. He would kind of smile and bite the tube, preventing the catheter from going down. I know that he knew what he was doing, and that smile told me he knew it.

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Tudamorf
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Tudamorf » Fri Sep 09, 2011 4:11 am

Fyyr wrote:I already posted on this site, over 10 years ago, that a good solution would be for SF to buy the Cow Palace. And turn it into a mini homeless city, with BART and buses only going one way from the City to it. It sure would cost you a lot less than what you are spending on keeping them as a tourist attraction. Put up a few hundred of 10x20 domiciles, with sanitation, bed, and cookplate, where the parking lot is. It's already fenced. Put a little medical clinic out in front, and a grocery, build a 215 dispensary on site. And have some form of active security throughout. It is a no brainer solution, but you SFriscans don't want to do something like that, because you care about the homeless and mentally ill.
We're already getting them into housing. The problem is, the hardcore ones you talk about refuse it, and forcible relocation to concentration camps is so 1940s.

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Tudamorf
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Tudamorf » Fri Sep 09, 2011 4:16 am

Fyyr wrote:The developmentally disabled/mentally ill clients I took care of had 24/7 onsite and offsite care. Cooking, laundry, cleaning, bathing, bowel care, bed transfers, total feeding care, all ADLS, health care, schooling were all taken care of. They lived in their own apartments or homes. In the case of my clients, two lived in a really nice shared apartment. One lived in a small apartment singularly. And three lived in a shared single family home.

Some, the higher functioning, of them would go to 'program' during the day, which was sort of like adult pre-school or kindergarten. They would make cut out pictures of flowers, glue string to bottles, and other such projects. Or go out on field day trips with counselors.

This level of service does take from your tax dollars.
That's my point. Of all those people, in how many cases did their families pay for it (0%?) and in how many cases did I pay for it (100%?).

If you breed defective children, the primary responsibility for caring for them should be yours, not mine. No one put a gun to your head and forced you to breed. That's something their culture seems to get, and ours doesn't.

As for you, you seem to be a libertarian when you have to pay for something, but a Marxist when you get paid for something. Typical hypocrisy.

Fyyr
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Re: What a wonderful culture.

Post by Fyyr » Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:26 am

Post synopsis.

F: Muslim culture is barbaric and inferior. Here is an example.

T: Muslims take care of their invalids for $10,000 for 365/24/7 care. An ambulance ride here is $10,000. Their culture is superior to ours.

F: You could not take care of a person in the US for that, unless the caregiver were a slave(upkeep on having the slave would cost more than the $10,000). An unskilled caregiver makes $10 per hour. You don't have any knowledge of this sector of our society, obviously. A typical ambulance ride is $1,000, not $10,000.

T: Our culture is worse. SF spent $20,000,000 on homeless and mentally ill healthcare. Muslim culture is superior because they can take care of an invalid for only $10,000 per year.

F: They chain up their invalid daughters so they don't get raped by other Muslims. If they go outside, other Muslims will rape them, their own family has to kill them per their Muslim cultural. Islam is an inferior culture.

F: SF is a horrible example for how to treat the homeless and mentally ill. SF treats them as if they are a freak tourist attraction. Set up a large communal shelter for them, and save money. It beats a cardboard box on Jones St. And it will get rid of assaulting beggars.

F: We spend a lot more than $10,000 per year to take care of an invalid 24hours a day. A bottom tiered unskilled worker makes $10 per hour, which is just above minimum wage. Our society spends money on residences for the invalids which surpasses those affordable of the unskilled worker making $10 per hour. (24hour care at $10 per hour base is $88,000, at the minimum, costs of the upper tiers is obviously passed along as well). In some cases family members are paid to be caregivers, by the State, for their invalid family members.

T: Your SF communal shelter solution is a concentration camp, you are a NAZI.

T: The invalids' families should pay for the care, not society. Our society should not have to pay for invalid care. You're a Commie and a hypocrite.

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