Where's our rezzes? ;p

If you mean the new feature in PoP, then all classes got ports now in PoP. You should also ask for slow, mezzes, HT, LH ........

KEI!

and please throw in harmony while your at it *snicker*

Acctually, there appears to be a thread on the cleric boards asking for reses to be given to druids.

Druids also got ports, city ones.

Convenience for non porters is accelerated, for porters its insane ;)

I know Tet has written this post tongue-in-cheek. I caution against any serious post that may have requests like this.

With PoK portals every class now has the mobility that Wizards and Druids enjoyed. This is clearly a 'nerf' to what was once a Wizard and Druid only class defining skill.

That said, I'm curious why Clerics should be singled out because they can now travel freely, just like other classes? The Cleric and Druid communities already have a strained relationship. What good would come out of a thread like this? Not alot unfortunately. Alot of Clerics are rabid and just waiting to pounce on "greedy dr00d$" and write off our whole class.

There's a difference between class balance and class envy. There's a difference between wanting to be a class that constructively plays alongside other classes, and a class that wants to be a god class (i.e.: a class that is absolutely critical to progress in the game).


Personally, I think the outstanding issues for the Druid class are:
1. Harmony. The removal of Harmony at levels 40+ effectively removed a skill from the Druid and Ranger class. As we're all aware, Verant are currently testing Harmony of Nature.
2. Healing from levels levels 40-58. From various other threads already posted on DG, suggested changes: Superior to 44 (from 51), Chloroblast to 51 (from 55), Nature's Touch to 55 (from 60).

We only need to look back a month to see how unbalanced Druids were with regards to healing. With Tunare's Renewal and the spells and skills in PoP, I don't think life as a Druid in EQ has looked this good. When I finally get PoP, I know I'll be enjoying the hard work done by Verant and the hard work done by the Druids here at the Grove.

--
Kenuon Windrunner

Honestly I think the reason behind it is simple. Every time the Druid class is improved in ANY way several Clerics from the Cleric Message board come over here and start chanting about gloom and doom and how the game is being destroyed (And they always toss in quad kiting about this point) and then tell us how they are all going to quit , blah blah blah. They could come out and say such and such druid armor will now be tinted blue instead of green and the clerics would fly off the handle (Not all Clerics,l but a significant portion of the vocal cleric community).

Aren't we lucky that druids all behave so much better when the cleric class is improved ? :D

I think he Tetrian probably got lost, found himself at the cleric forum, and got chased away by a mob with torches and pitchforks shouting "Dr00d! Dr00d!"

I would add a dramatic raise in the doge skill, which is comes in quite handy already.

aybe a buff to reduce times people are stunned by 50% as well.

The top buff, what is it Po9 needs to have 4 hp regen added. (So our best skin has mana and hp regen.)

Oh and one cold DOT at lvl 65.

I dont want rez, I enjoy groveling to clerics or paladins. Note there is no roleplay reason not to have rez...just balance.

Thank god for all the ports in PoK, the less i have to be a port bitch the better.

Exactly Hobbo.

Claps for Hobbo,

Although there will still be those guildies who don't park themselves by or in the zone early so that they don't have to worry about a port.

-bartleby windtalker

Interesting... Very interesting. You completely missed the point of PoP Portals but interesting none the less.

To get you to buy the expansion. Blatant marketing. At least I see it that way.


Belkram Marrwolf

Nobody can deny though that porting stood in the way of our class balance.

R.I.P port-whoring, you won't be missed.

Yeah, the more you fall the nicer the view once you've climbed back up.

but a bit serious also.

Druids loosing ground in the port area doesnt matter much to me personally, im tired of getting begged - and it doesnt really help me for anything but personal transport - others getting that also is all good in my book =)

However With the ability we seem to be taken with doing solo groups more, i think a component 49 rez with a high mana cost might be a fun thing to discuss - it steps a bit on clerics(everything seems to do), but generally all the priest having access to even minor forms of rezzes would be a big help to everyone - both on raids and in groups.


-Tet

i'm glad we don't have to port as much too.

but the issue is, druids get ports, but for that they don't get something else. ports are a part of the class power and we were denied certain skills because of it. i chose the druid because of it's mobility.
i still love playing a druid, but quite frankly, being a shamy or chanter etc doesn't bring any mobility problems with the class anymore, therefore significantly strengthening them. the gain without loss. we were "left behind".
don't forget though, the game's meant to be fun. f*ck it, lol.

As I see it, there are two varieties of teleporting.


1. <strong>Active porting</strong>

oving your group to a dungeon, moving your group out of a dungeon, evacuating, and so on. These centre around the druid's and wizard's ability to get the group to the fighting location, whisk them out of trouble if things get bad, or simply for the fact that without taking a bone fide teleporter with you, you're forced to fight out to the zone in, which is an enormous chore.

Taking a teleporter with you allows you to fight deep into dangerous zones for the maximum amount of risk - and thus the maximum amount of reward, in terms of experience and items.

This is the variety of teleporting which I think makes wizards and druids valuable, and it is the variety of teleporting which makes me feel even more useful to a group, when I'm playing Lotusfly.


2. <strong>Taxi'ing</strong>

This is the ability to log on a taxi and simply ship some characters from A to B. It's tedious, and results in character names like "Taxii".

Generally, the porters hate it: I can't even begin to count how many times I've read complaints about people getting plagued with teleport requests.

Also, the non-porting classes hate it: they have to bug a druid or wizard to get anywhere, and impose upon someone else's time. There's character inter-dependancy, which provides excellent reasons to mix and match people in groups, and then there's meaningless and obstructive time-sinks, and this second variety of teleporting is definitely the latter.

Adding portal stones to major cities alleviates, though not totally, this second, obstructive, meaningless variety of teleporting.

The druids and wizards no longer get harassed for taxi services, whilst retaining the most attractive aspect of their teleporting ability: the active teleporting, mentioned previously. It retains the desire to have them in a group (especially in incredibly dangerous PoP zones), whilst removing the tedious, frustrating and infinitely obstructive taxi aspect.

Calling this "a direct nerf to druids and wizards" is bandwagon-jumping, showboating, and entirely baseless.

Unless you're a lower level druid making a (meagre) quantity of money from taxi'ing people around, I fail to see how in the name of holy cake this could be seen as a nerf. I'm all for removing tedious aspects of play whilst retaining my group desirability.


Toodlepip,

Rebecca

@ the Dev team:-

I'm a cleric; kindly give druids a component-free low mana cost 96% xp rez at once. Same for shamans, paladins, necros and anyone else who can come up with the loosest roleplaying justification for it, and I'd also be grateful if you'd install NPC epic clerics in graveyards who will rez corpses for a 1cp fee. Thanks.

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>@ the Dev team:-

I'm a cleric; kindly give druids a component-free low mana cost 96% xp rez at once. Same for shamans, paladins, necros and anyone else who can come up with the loosest roleplaying justification for it, and I'd also be grateful if you'd install NPC epic clerics in graveyards who will rez corpses for a 1cp fee. Thanks. [/quote]

Cool thanks!

What Lotusfly said.

I don't know about you, but for me the primary selling points of playing a druid was the self mobility and being able to heal. Now there is less advantage of playing a druid or wizard because the self mobility that was once druids and wizards only, is now accessible to all classes. In this respect, the advantage of self mobility has been 'nerfed'. If a friend of mine expressed interest in playing EQ and said how cool it is to be a druid because he saw I could self port. And say, he then asked if he should create a druid or not. I'd probably tell him, at level 46 he would almost have the same mobility that I would because of the portal system and PoK and that the disadvantage of self mobility of other classes isn't much of an issue at levels 46+.

When evaluating and labelling changes to EQ as a nerf, it's a good idea to consider how and to what degree the change affects the class in question. In the case of PoK portals, the classes in question are wizards and druids. First question, what was changed? All classes now have self mobility through PoK and the portal system. One of the original advantages of playing a wizard and druid has diminished. The advantage of self mobility has been nerfed. Second question, to what degree does the change affect wizards and druids? It doesn't really impact much, infact it removes burden of mobility on wizards and druids from other classes.

So, is it really a nerf? Yes it is if we consider self mobility a selling point to creating a druid or wizard. But on the otherhand, no it's not if we consider the burden of mobilizing other classes with our group ports. To this, a chorus of druids have already agreed. So the final answer is: yes and no.

In my previous post, I wrote that it was a 'nerf' to sympathise with Tetrian. I used small inverted commas writing it as 'nerf' to express a double meaning for the term nerf. Unfortunately the subtleties of expression don't carry that well over the internet or I am just a dullard who can't express double meanings very well in writing form.

If I was quoted with the two sentences together as I intended, I'm sure it would sound less of an attempt to launch my sinking showboat while jumping into my 'little bandwagon of nerf calling'.

Now that my usage of 'nerf' has been established, moving to the topic at hand.

There is an advantage for PoK and portals for other classes and only sentimental disadvantage for us level 46+ druids. Is this sentimental disadvantage a good basis on which to argue for druids getting rezes? I would say it's a shakey one at best. Wizards were also affected by this change and it wasn't only clerics who benefitted. Oddly enough, as Kylnn Thyme pointed out, clerics are discussing amongst themselves whether to give full rezes to other classes such as druids. Of course this decision rests in the hands of Verant, but if druids got rez, wouldn't it be the same burden that we love to loath when it comes to port beggers?

As I've already mentioned. I'm quite happy with the way druid spells and skills have been assigned with PoP.

--
Kenuon Windrunner
Showboating for 60 years. A mere tugboat before lofty oceanliners.

You don't want a rez. You will find that you will lose port whore, but gain rez whore.

On the other extreme, when you try to be nice and offer your lower level rez because there isn't another rezzer for 3 zones to either side, they will refuse you, but not till after you spend the 55% mana to cast it.

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>You don't want a rez. You will find that you will lose port whore, but gain rez whore.[/quote] Allow me to elaborate on this because this is dead on. From what I've seen, the majority of people who ever ever said "I wish I had rez" have said so for selfish reasons. Doesn't matter which class the person plays, it basically comes down to the person wanting to be able to erase thier own death penalty. The ability to rez other people is nice but, primarily, people don't care if they can rez someone else or not just so long as they can rez themselves. In fact, a self only rez is many times preferable to that of a rez that works on everyone since you can the ability to erase your own death penalty and you don't have to put up with other people begging for your rez ability. Notice that I didn't say all people because I'm not naive enough to believe that all people want the ability to res for selfish reasons. However, I do believe that this is the reason that most people want the ability to rez.

If I go around without /anon or /role on, I can fully expect to be bombarded with desperate pleas from poor people who died in a manner that was completely not thier fault but resulted in a horrible death. Oh they start off polite, believe me the tells are so coated in sugar it can rot teeth. But woe to the Cleric who says "No, I'm busy" because unless you have experienced it firsthand, you cannot imagine the wrath from the fallen who has been denied that precious "rez." I have been had people send me tells for 15 minutes straight begging, pleading and threatening me for a rez when I am quite legitimately busy with a raid, group or something else. And if I am able to do the rez, half the time I get nothing. No thank you and no payment. Rarely I'll get thanks and it's even more rare for that person to offer a donation for my time. Now many Clerics will refuse payment. Personally for me, it depends on the mood I'm in. However, I want to have the OPTION of hitting cancel trade so at least put something in that trade window and let me decide if I want to hit cancel or accept.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. For most people there is a feeling that a Port is a convenience. It's really nice to have and not too hard to come by if you're willing to pay for it and look around. However, the feeling is that a Rez is a necessity and people treat it as such.

First off, I like the change to travel, I think it's good for the game. But I also think it's bad for the class. In the past, guilds needed X amount of porters to mobilize in a reasonable amount of time, and both guildies and strangers needed to talk to druids and wizards, and establish relationships with them, in order to get ports.

THAT is why this IS a direct nerf to us and wizards. It not only reduces one of our biggest roles in guilds, but also reduces the amount of new people we meet which directly impacts how often we're able to find groups, because since we're meeting less new people, we are making fewer new friends and thus fewer new grouping connections. Notice that when you a druid says they have no problem getting groups, that 99 % of thetime they also say that that group almost exclusively with friends. Well personally I have made many friends over the years by offering a ride to a desperate traveller... and that is all but gone now.

Edit: And as to why it is legitimate to see this as a cleric upgrade more than other classes. The reason is Faithstones which allow the cleric a mana free self port near to a PoK port book. (and shamans with spiritstones as well).

Bah, not to me. I don't meet new people who need ports...I just tell them to go find a Druid.

Shizz

/agree

For the midlevels, rezzing was a convenience. You could easily make those blues back in about an hour.

For higher levels though, rez IS is a necessity. Many people even act as if they are entitled to it.

I've long thought that the current set up of death and rezzing is pretty flawed; at the levels 50+, unless you were unfortunate enough to have your corpse rot, loot everything on it by accident, or die in an out of the way place before a cleric can help you, you're almost guaranteed to get 90% (or more) of your experience back, because you're going to do everything in your power in order to get that rez in that 3 hour window. So in esssence, clerics are the "middlemen", and some say might even say "hostages", of this whole system.

y suggestions would be to stop tying experience to death; it just causes a whole lot of heartache. Since everyone is going to sell their firstborn in order to get 96% of their experience back, make the exp loss a flat percentage according to level and cut out the middlemen. For example, for 49+ you'd lose 10% of what you'd normally lose after a lvl 49 rez, and for 56+ you'd lose 4%.

Death should work differently. You should maybe suffer the rez effects as they are now, albeit for 3 or more hours until it wears off or a cleric can cleanse you of the stink of death. Corpses should maybe have an item in your inventory decay every 3 hours, so that corpse runs will still be necessary.

Rezzes shouldn't be farmed out to the other priest classes, because the real problem is with the set up of the death system itself.

Personally, I have learned a lot from several deaths that Teri has had, and I think we should start a petition to make it so death ADDS exp. After all, dying can be quite an experience.

lol TeriMoon,

if you only knew my reputation on Ayonae Ro, you would understand why i got a kick out of it...people on this board has some cool titles, on A.Ro 'death magnet' is mine :)

pub140.ezboard.com/fgraff...1681.topic (http://pub140.ezboard.com/fgraffeswizardcompilationfrm4.showMessage?topicID= 1681.topic)

:p

Since they whored out another of our abilities maybe they should start doing that with other classes. Place an NPC in Nexus and PoK that casts KEI on you when you hail. Place NPCs in every zone that casts a 96% rez on any corpse you bring in front of him/her. Spread the love VI!

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Place an NPC in Nexus and PoK that casts KEI on you when you hail. Place NPCs in every zone that casts a 96% rez on any corpse you bring in front of him/her.[/quote] It's statements like this which completely prove my point. People want these abilities but they don't want the headaches that go along with them. Druids, seriously, want resses? Sure, have them. And then, welcome to my world. You'll find that the "greener grass" is actually a fetid mold.

Here's a funny idea...

Give druids a reincarnation line that provides, level for level, the exact same amount of experience provided by the cleric rez. But includes as its "rez effect" a 72 hour (72 hours of game time) of being transformed into some random animal/sylvan creature. (EDIT: it would be a "negative" buff and thus not clickable, although dying again would cure it...)

Blarg the Troll Warrior dies, poor guy. No cleric available, but the local Heirophant calls upon the powers of nature to quickly restore his soul to life...in the body of a badger.

Even better, make it so NO confirmation box pops up, thus encouraging people to stop littering the GY with naked corpses.

Seriously though, unless you had the 96 rez, people aren't going to want it except the twinks who realize you can easily port to their location, rez, and gate back. Believe me, rezzing is neither the moneymaker some seem to think, or all that likely to get you a group (if it were, Paladins would be the **** for groups with their rezzes.)

ROTFLMAO!!!

I LIKE This idea!

/ooc any clerics about?
*time passes*
/ooc *SIGH* looking for a badger rez!

/party members shout "Badgers? we dont need no stinking badgers!"

All the hassle would be worth it Jarre just to hear those lines in game :)

hehe there would be a ton of lines to use on that.

I just noticed that it was Zarros that I replied to on that =)

I think it was for his epic that I stared a run of being the "expert" puller of ixblat (pulled him like 5 times in the next 2 days or so)

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Place an NPC in Nexus and PoK that casts KEI on you when you hail. Place NPCs in every zone that casts a 96% rez on any corpse you bring in front of him/her.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It's statements like this which completely prove my point. People want these abilities but they don't want the headaches that go along with them. Druids, seriously, want resses? Sure, have them. And then, welcome to my world. You'll find that the "greener grass" is actually a fetid mold. [/quote]

Fist of all, where the hell did I say anything about druids wanting rezes? Please lean how to read and <strong>comprehend</strong>. The point of my post, which you missed completely, was to prove that other classes would get upset if their abilities were given out to every class just by clicking on some graphic. Any gating class has close to the mobility of a druid or wizard now.

"Give druids a reincarnation line that provides"

Ok, now that's just friggin funny. You think that some of the screenshots of chanters playing with their new project illusion ability now are funny...

I'm finding myself wishing they *would* do this.

Shizz

hehe it really is an appealing idea.

shoot I want it even if it doesnt give back exp after thinking about it =)

/wave Jarre

Thanks again for the help. Still need to do Chardok though.

Imagine a suicidally brave halfling druid running for dear life to the zone with a building-sized fire elemental breathing down his neck.

Jarre tells the raid "I'm training the zone, don't bother trying to heal me..."

I still chuckle over that.

Actually if they made the rezzes only available in zones with the major cities as they did with the POP ports that would be fine. Just as POP doesnt allow everyone to port to CS, EJ, SKyfire, western commonlands etc but only in the cities then so should the NPC rez guy only be available in those places. Have him stand right next to the book. Need a port to CS or EJ, you still have to get a wiz or druid. Need a rez in hole or CT, you would still need a cleric, pally or necro.

*chuckle* I was glad to help you out on that. when you hit chardok give me a shout, If im on Ill be more than happy to help out =)

like he said I AM suicidally brave, so I die alot. I like there being alot of click sticks in the world!