View Full Forums : TBS Heal Thread (Split off from main TBS Topic)


Rajolae
02-12-2007, 06:27 PM
I hope that that is just a goddamn mistake on LL, if it isn't Incomming Moonshadow Bull**** Rk II.

Also, we did try to get Fernspur removed / turned into something useful, but no dice. At least we did get one Ice Atk Debuff :O/.

Rajolae
02-12-2007, 07:13 PM
Well, evidently it isnt a ****ing mistake. Ryta....Prathun just told us that yet a-goddamn-gain our heal is being balanced against a ****ing hybrid's spell. This is total bull****

Sorrian
02-12-2007, 09:08 PM
Way to go sony....more spells that make zero impact on gameplay. LL is yet another spell that will get used as much as moonshadow...never. Too expensive and too weak to be of any real use. I bet it's a real pain to even get this spell....

Rajolae
02-12-2007, 09:15 PM
Way to go sony....more spells that make zero impact on gameplay. LL is yet another spell that will get used as much as moonshadow...never. Too expensive and too weak to be of any real use. I bet it's a real pain to even get this spell....


Uhhhhh Im pretty sure every other druid in here uses Moonshadow a tonne, you are doing something wrong obviously.

Sorrian
02-12-2007, 09:43 PM
Uhhhhh Im pretty sure every other druid in here uses Moonshadow a tonne, you are doing something wrong obviously.

Uhhhhhh I'm pretty sure you don't know what I do. I use moonshadow when I am the only healer in my group on a raid. That's it. It costs too much mana for what it heals. I can use single heals and keep the group up just fine. When I use moonshadow I run out of mana too fast. If you can't use single heals and accomplish the same things I am, then you are doing something wrong obviously.

Don't act like you know everything about playing a druid and presume to tell me how I am wrong.

In case you are unable to see what is so blindingly obvious, my last post was sarcasm.

Mellen
02-12-2007, 10:22 PM
What really bugs me is that we're being told now, after our nukes got nerfed... after our dps has stagnated so much... after all the times ppl have said we can't get better nukes b/c of our healing, that we're not allowed to heal better than a ****ing hybrid.


Where the hell was this magical do not cross line when hybrids started out curing us, when ranger snare/roots started becoming innately better, when shm got sting, or pallies were givin ward of tunare.

Micahle
02-12-2007, 11:04 PM
edit: You know what, f***ed if i care really. If you wanna bitch and whinge about it, fine, don't use it.

Rajolae
02-12-2007, 11:10 PM
Having 6 people to heal is the exception. More often than not, you have 3 people or less to heal at any given time. So the healing is wasted on those that are at full hp. In the time it takes to cast moonshadow, you will likely fall behind on healing someone and end up casting a single heal on them anyway. It's all about the timing. Using moonshadow when you have 4 or more people missing some HP is certainly more efficient, but now you lose time healing the person in your group that will lose hp faster I.E. tank or under-geared toon. In a perfect uniform world, everybody will lose hp together and at the same rate, but that rarely happens. So your "real" numbers you posted mean nothing, because they only apply in a fictional world.

You ARE aware that it is more efficient to use Moonshadow when even just two people in your group need to be healed, right?

Sorrian
02-12-2007, 11:27 PM
You ARE aware that it is more efficient to use Moonshadow when even just two people in your group need to be healed, right?

Wrong. Using Purelife rk.I you get 4.28 hp/m. Using moonshadow to heal 2 people you get 2.727 hp/m. How is that more efficient?

edit: 1500hp X 2people / 1100mana for moonshadow. For Purelife rk.I 3176hp X 1 person / 742mana
Even with 3 people you get 4.091 hp/m for moonshadow.

Rajolae
02-12-2007, 11:47 PM
Wrong. Using Purelife rk.I you get 4.28 hp/m. Using moonshadow to heal 2 people you get 2.727 hp/m. How is that more efficient?

edit: 1500hp X 2people / 1100mana for moonshadow. For Purelife rk.I 3176hp X 1 person / 742mana
Even with 3 people you get 4.091 hp/m for moonshadow.

Uhhhh two people need healing, not one. GG.

Sorrian
02-12-2007, 11:52 PM
Anyway my point is, Lunar Light looked like it was going to be a great spell. Now it looks like the nominal crap they give us every expansion. I got my hopes up for nothing.

Sorrian
02-12-2007, 11:56 PM
Uhhhh two people need healing, not one. GG.
DUH! you still end up with the same answer.
2 casts heals 6352hp for a total cost of 1484m, which still comes to 4.28 hp/m.

I assumed you would understand that the ratio would not change so I simplified my math. "GG"

Aelfin
02-13-2007, 12:08 AM
screw this. i'm voting with my feet (and $$$).
pre-order cancelled. account cancelled.
to hell with prathun and sony. tired of devs that think making the game more of a frikken hassle equates to more fun. and seriously tired of druids getting the shaft.

Rajolae
02-13-2007, 01:09 AM
DUH! you still end up with the same answer.
2 casts heals 6352hp for a total cost of 1484m, which still comes to 4.28 hp/m.

I assumed you would understand that the ratio would not change so I simplified my math. "GG"

1484 mana vs 1100 mana....

Sorrian
02-13-2007, 01:12 AM
1484 mana vs 1100 mana....
6352hp vs. 3000hp....

Sorrian
02-13-2007, 01:37 AM
Let's just agree to disagree....I am sleepy.

Sanoliene
02-13-2007, 07:00 AM
bye Aelfin :(

Aelfin
02-13-2007, 12:13 PM
bye Aelfin :(
eh, the account is good til 4/12. i'll be around til then, maybe someone will wake the hell up. wishful thinking, i am sure, so i'll check out the competition and see if vanguard (or maybe wow again) is doing anything nifty.

serinity_inny
02-13-2007, 12:47 PM
Aelfin,

I play VG in my downtime when my friends aren't on eq or just have like short 1-3hours play time.....I love it. Of course I like my cleric there but my druid is coming around too just got to adjust to distance spells etc.

Lots of quest to keep you busy etc.

However, I do hope devs will revisit this and at slightly adjust it to make it more efficient.

Windfyre
02-13-2007, 06:00 PM
Here comes the whyne and cheese fest for this expansion.. Oh i cant wait...

elty
02-13-2007, 06:10 PM
Yea that will show them! not!

you know how many people cancel.. and they ALWAYS come back.. sony knows this... yes.. spend 9 years on a toon and cancel it because of a few spells from an expansion that didnt go your way.

I would agree with you it is not an easy decision, and Sony will absolutely not care about this. However, it is much more than a few spells. Druid has been screwed since OOW and it is just getting worse and worse.

Windfyre
02-13-2007, 06:21 PM
I would agree with you it is not an easy decision, and Sony will absolutely not care about this. However, it is much more than a few spells. Druid has been screwed since OOW and it is just getting worse and worse.

Beacuse we are spoiled. We want everything. We want to be just as good as every class with our ability - we keep forgetting those classes only have those abilities.

Im very happy in what we have. with 14k unbuffed druids running around that can main heal - dps and control mobs all at the same time is pretty damn close to perfection if you ask me.

Its like we want everything given, an effortless push of the button to fix everything - how spoiled have we really become?

Windfyre
02-13-2007, 06:28 PM
Bait and Switch ?!?!

Ohhhhh, noooooooo ... we wouldn't fall for that again! Not again and again!


Its high time druids were removed from the 'priest' category since its obvious we are intended to perform on a healing level similar to hybrids.

So glad I've got a TSS heal focus ... it means my Lunarlight efficiency will suck just a smidge less than monumentally.
I can so main heal any group situation put before me. I have no idea what your talking about. We got along without group heals - now its presented in a way we dont like (but we get one anyway) and the sky is FALLING! OH NO! Ahhh!! The pain! the horror!

...give me a break...

Frostcrypt is about the only place I can heal but don't like to heal.

Tobynn
02-13-2007, 11:23 PM
I have no idea what your talking about.

Just started playing EQ, did ya? Nah, there's never been any stealth nerf of specialty spells at two minutes to midnight before. Nope. I must have been hYpMoTiZeD ! o.O

Prathun just told us that yet a-goddamn-gain our heal is being balanced against a ****ing hybrid's spell

You can so reread any post put before you, Windy. You can so find that I never mentioned having any issues with my abilities to heal content. My comments were directed to Lunarlight being re-re-balanced against a hybrid spell instead of a priest spell. You can so continue to be so impressed with yourself, Windy. I can so care less.

Because your complaining about an expansion that ISNT a true expansion

New zones, items and spells, released in February, complete with progression towards end-game raid content ... same as Gates of Discord Feb 2004, same as Dragons of Norrath Feb 2005, same as Prophecy of Ro Feb 2006. Yeah you're right, Buried Sea isn't an expansion. Nope, defintely not an expansion. Wonder if SOE knows that.

You have so become better at Being Confused! (300)

Windfyre
02-13-2007, 11:42 PM
Just started playing EQ, did ya? Nah, there's never been any stealth nerf of specialty spells at two minutes to midnight before. Nope. I must have been hYpMoTiZeD ! o.O



You can so reread any post put before you, Windy. You can so find that I never mentioned having any issues with my abilities to heal content. My comments were directed to Lunarlight being re-re-balanced against a hybrid spell instead of a priest spell. You can so continue to be so impressed with yourself, Windy. I can so care less.



New zones, items and spells, released in February, complete with progression towards end-game raid content ... same as Gates of Discord Feb 2004, same as Dragons of Norrath Feb 2005, same as Prophecy of Ro Feb 2006. Yeah you're right, Buried Sea isn't an expansion. Nope, defintely not an expansion. Wonder if SOE knows that.

You have so become better at Being Confused! (300)


Enough already... I have been playing for almost 9 years and frankly I am just sick of whine and cheese party during ever expansion.

Sorrian
02-14-2007, 03:50 AM
You know what? Forget it. You're absolutely right Wind. The people who pay for their subscription have absolutely no right to complain when the see how they just got screwed, AGAIN. It shouldn't matter that it is increasingly difficult to get a group, or having every ability marginalized. No need to complain when your role in a raid becomes more difficult as it is becoming harder and harder to keep people healed. Shouldn't whine when it takes 7 minutes to solo a mob, while other solo classes do it in 2. Falling from the second best healer into a 3-way tie means nothing. Other classes now nuking better has no bearing on anything, no need to cry about it. They should all just start over with new characters and pay another $1000 to sony while gearing up their new toon. All this to avoid listening to someone complain. Yep....I'm making a Paladin so I can be a main-healer in Froscrypt...makes sense...I don't need my money anyway...makes PERFECT sense...

Where did you buy your rose-colored glasses? I need a pair so I can't see SOE sticking it to me...

Kensmith
02-14-2007, 10:33 AM
The nerf to LL is above and beyond anything that could ever be deemed reasonable. The hybrid reasoning behind it is an absolute disgrace and if the devs consider balancing a PRIEST SPELL in favour of the hybrid class then i seriously need a big bag of whatever it is they are smoking.


All in all another joke and its all on us.

Kenny

Rajolae
02-15-2007, 10:10 PM
Just started playing EQ, did ya? Nah, there's never been any stealth nerf of specialty spells at two minutes to midnight before. Nope. I must have been hYpMoTiZeD ! o.O



You can so reread any post put before you, Windy. You can so find that I never mentioned having any issues with my abilities to heal content. My comments were directed to Lunarlight being re-re-balanced against a hybrid spell instead of a priest spell. You can so continue to be so impressed with yourself, Windy. I can so care less.



New zones, items and spells, released in February, complete with progression towards end-game raid content ... same as Gates of Discord Feb 2004, same as Dragons of Norrath Feb 2005, same as Prophecy of Ro Feb 2006. Yeah you're right, Buried Sea isn't an expansion. Nope, defintely not an expansion. Wonder if SOE knows that.

You have so become better at Being Confused! (300)

Who the hell are you meaning to talk to when you quoted me?

Aelfin
02-16-2007, 01:10 PM
it's not worth it. look at wind's magelo. it's not like he's raiding anything modern. if all i had to worry about was handling group content i'd say i was sitting pretty well, too... good enough to not complain too much.

same for the bolo guy in the other thread who claims to be a raiding druid. AV just killed sendai and is raiding pre-dpob targets. don't take this badly, you simply aren't raiding at the same level as other druids. if i was raiding pre-dpob with an extra 5 levels and 2-3 extra expansions worth of spells i'd prolly think differently, too. as it is, i'm not end-game raiding myself, i have to assume it is even worse.

the last 3-4 expansions have not been nice to content-current druids. it is not that we haven't got anything overpowering, or even just kept even. we have lost ground, period.

it doesn't mean we totally suck or can't adapt. it just becomes more a pain in the ass. and deciding who in your group you will let die first. (and second... and third)

Rajolae
02-16-2007, 01:47 PM
it's not worth it. look at wind's magelo. it's not like he's raiding anything modern. if all i had to worry about was handling group content i'd say i was sitting pretty well, too... good enough to not complain too much.

same for the bolo guy in the other thread who claims to be a raiding druid. AV just killed sendai and is raiding pre-dpob targets. don't take this badly, you simply aren't raiding at the same level as other druids. if i was raiding pre-dpob with an extra 5 levels and 2-3 extra expansions worth of spells i'd prolly think differently, too. as it is, i'm not end-game raiding myself, i have to assume it is even worse.

the last 3-4 expansions have not been nice to content-current druids. it is not that we haven't got anything overpowering, or even just kept even. we have lost ground, period.

it doesn't mean we totally suck or can't adapt. it just becomes more a pain in the ass. and deciding who in your group you will let die first. (and second... and third)

Hell if I were raiding pre DPoB targets Id still be complaining, as the new spells from TSS arent really worth using over older spells still, and healing still isn't much easier (from the raid group/AE perspective).

serinity_inny
02-16-2007, 02:00 PM
AV is in DK now (1/4 events done maybe more) and your right Wind is a group druid......like myself....I can heal almost any group content ....but I can't speak for raid content and so I feel for the raiding druids but I am also one who makes the best of what I have......and don't have to worry about others picking a class over me because I am the one who makes the groups and always getting people asking to be in my group......not everyone has to have holy trinity to play EQ.

Cibby Nameless group druid and damn proud of it.

Bolodo
02-16-2007, 07:16 PM
Aelfin, I have been raiding for 4 years. Ashen Vendetta is currently raiding DPoB and PoR progression, not pre-DPoB. Our website is not current. I know you are in Euphoria, which is not all that far ahead of where AV is in progression. You guys just killed Mayong about a month ago. We are working on Tier 2 DPoB access. As far as pre-DPoB targets, we killed all but Queen Sendaii before the level increase, and would of killed the Queen at level 70 too.

Let me say this again. There is nothing wrong with the Druid class. Every new expansion, I come here and see people whining about how broke we are, how we can't do anything and how we got wronged yet again. Bleh.

When I first started raiding, we did not have anything close to the spells/AA we have now. Group heals? We didn't have them until recently. Heal aggro? A few years ago we most likely would die if we got aggro from healing. Now we have AAs and our epic to reduce that aggro. If we still get aggro, we have Dire Guard to help stay alive or Second Life for a chance to be invulnerable. These are just a couple of examples of tools/abilities we have been given. It was alot harder to keep groups alive before we got those tools/abilities, but it was doable. I guess I look at half a glass of water and say its "half full."

There has always been complaining on this board about how we got hosed somehow, how this class got this and we should of got that. Every expansion I got more tools/spells that helped me do the things I needed to do in groups or raids.

I see guilds all the time looking for Druids, as a high priority. There are many high end guilds specifically looking for Druids. This just wasn't the case a few years ago. Hell Aelfin, your own guild Euphoria asked me if I was happy where I was at in an attempt to recruit me. We can't be all that broke, there must be something of value these high end guilds see. I don't ever hear the top Druids on the server (Silent Resurgence) whining, and SR is as end game as you get. They get the job done.

I don't worry about all the nonsense you guys bring up about our class, because I have no problem keeping my groups alive in any setting. I make the most of what I do have and get along just fine.

Rajolae
02-16-2007, 10:21 PM
Let me say this again. There is nothing wrong with the Druid class. Every new expansion, I come here and see people whining about how broke we are, how we can't do anything and how we got wronged yet again. Bleh.

When I first started raiding, we did not have anything close to the spells/AA we have now. Group heals? We didn't have them until recently. Heal aggro? A few years ago we most likely would die if we got aggro from healing. Now we have AAs and our epic to reduce that aggro. If we still get aggro, we have Dire Guard to help stay alive or Second Life for a chance to be invulnerable. These are just a couple of examples of tools/abilities we have been given. It was alot harder to keep groups alive before we got those tools/abilities, but it was doable. I guess I look at half a glass of water and say its "half full."

And we needed group heals years ago, it took us that long to convince them we needed them.

Uhhhh if I get aggro while raiding there's still a good chance I can die unless a cleric gets to me from assisting the mob.

The AAs have been less effective each passing expansion since Luclin. ALL classes get them, not just us.

Our epic only reduces aggro by 4%, 6%, or 8% (unsure if its random or not, I remember being told back when OoW was still new that it was, and I have no means of actually confirming it) depending on which one you have which is not a lot at all. And we aren't the only class to get this.

Direwild Guard is highly problematic, as it takes up a spell slot and does not give nearly the protection it needs to. Shamans are lucky enough to get an AA that does the same time and has NO cast time, it just does not have the defensive proc that reduces aggro. Second Life is nice, but again, we aren't the only class to get it.

edit: and as for druids being a high priority, chances are that guild also has clerics at a high priority too. And Im certain the guild would take clerics over druids for group healing unless they have no druids that are active.

Micahle
02-17-2007, 12:32 AM
There are many high end guilds specifically looking for Druids. This just wasn't the case a few years ago

That wasn't the case because a lot of people were playing druids. The only reason they have a higher priority these days is because of the number of people, esp. druids, who have left the game for various reason. One of those reasons being major dissatisfaction with the Druid class.

Lujayne
02-17-2007, 02:26 AM
it's not worth it. look at wind's magelo. it's not like he's raiding anything modern. if all i had to worry about was handling group content i'd say i was sitting pretty well, too... good enough to not complain too much.

same for the bolo guy in the other thread who claims to be a raiding druid. AV just killed sendai and is raiding pre-dpob targets. don't take this badly, you simply aren't raiding at the same level as other druids. if i was raiding pre-dpob with an extra 5 levels and 2-3 extra expansions worth of spells i'd prolly think differently, too. as it is, i'm not end-game raiding myself, i have to assume it is even worse.

the last 3-4 expansions have not been nice to content-current druids. it is not that we haven't got anything overpowering, or even just kept even. we have lost ground, period.

it doesn't mean we totally suck or can't adapt. it just becomes more a pain in the ass. and deciding who in your group you will let die first. (and second... and third)
Wow your one f'ing arrogant prick, ever stop to wonder this thread is for all druids, not just uber_leet_druid_high_end_player021345? Just because a druid might not be well geared compared to someone at the high end does not mean they have any less of a right to an opinion then you do. Have people become so whiney that they forget the class druid is not their own personal class and it belongs to many many others?

As far as healing is concerned, a lot of druids can play main healer in all high end content, maybe some druids here have been spoilt having a cleric in their group all the time that they have become reliant on them (like hardcore drugs)?

I don't see how people that are so dissastified with their class have not gone and re-rolled. Druids have such amazing capabilities maybe some of you just need to utilize them more.

Alei
02-17-2007, 03:22 AM
I think that the Druids who are disappointed in Lunar Light feel this way, because we were going to get a better group heal, but instead at the last minute it gets nerfed. I don't know how anyone couldn't be at least a little disappointed about this.
And yeah, a lot of Druids can heal some difficult group content, but how many people invite Druids to that kind of content freely? How much do you guys actually think they trust the Druid to be able to keep them alive? I think that as long as people feel they can't trust or rely on Druids as main healers (for risky content), then Druids aren't going to be happy with how we heal.
I know I can heal fairly well and handle myself, but other people don't. So, my frustration about the Druid class doesn't stem from us, but from other people who think we can't do something that we are very capable of.
And personally, the reliance on Clerics is sad lol. I know I LFG in general chat from time to time and have not received tells from a group that "needs a Cleric to go" and after 15-20min of them not finding one, they finally send me a tell asking me if I want to go. Those kinds of people who just can't survive without a Cleric unless they really need to can find another Druid to be their last resort.

<3

Lujayne
02-17-2007, 04:55 AM
6352hp vs. 3000hp....

4.6 castime time for 2 x heal of Purelife assuming you have the focus & cleric spell haste ) for 6352 vs 2.8 cast time (assuming you have the focus & cleric spell haste ) group heal for 3k ( which tends to crit for 4-5k anyway ).

There are situations where you are hit by multiple AE's on which you will have to heal really quick to keep people alive ( Ever had situations where you had to choose which peron dies cause you cant heal both fast enough )?



I think that the Druids who are disappointed in Lunar Light feel this way, because we were going to get a better group heal, but instead at the last minute it gets nerfed. I don't know how anyone couldn't be at least a little disappointed about this.



Who wouldnt be disappointed when their spell gets nerfed? That's a separate issue. Telling people to piss off because they are,I quote "Pre-DPoB" is just someone with "large e-peen" syndrome.

I totally agree with you Alei that plenty of people who will never accept druids are capable healers. Thankfully members of the guild I'm in are for most part acknowledge that. I have nothing but absolute confidence in my fellow guild druids in healing. I wish nothing but a long time looking to those people who only want a cleric.

Rajolae
02-17-2007, 10:46 AM
Wow your one f'ing arrogant prick, ever stop to wonder this thread is for all druids, not just uber_leet_druid_high_end_player021345? Just because a druid might not be well geared compared to someone at the high end does not mean they have any less of a right to an opinion then you do. Have people become so whiney that they forget the class druid is not their own personal class and it belongs to many many others?

As far as healing is concerned, a lot of druids can play main healer in all high end content, maybe some druids here have been spoilt having a cleric in their group all the time that they have become reliant on them (like hardcore drugs)?

I don't see how people that are so dissastified with their class have not gone and re-rolled. Druids have such amazing capabilities maybe some of you just need to utilize them more.

Yes, but to sit back and act like druid healing is fine when you are a lower tierd druid is just as wrong. People are pissed off because we SHOULD have got LL like it was 48 hours before TBS launched.

Juniper
02-17-2007, 05:12 PM
Lujayne is pretty high end and doesn't think anything's wrong with Druid healing from what I can tell.

Some of you seems to be under the impression that the game, players, developers, beta testing, comprise some kind of democractic system. It isn't. This is a (benevolent?) dictatorship.

I people are upset, but is there a contract within the Beta that suggests what you are seeing will go live in that form? I know bait and switch is lame, but I wasn't suprised to see it happen, because Sony did this last time. This is why, while I like to participate in Betas and give my feedback, I do not put my faith in the content I see presented to me. I put my faith in the kind of work community members like Fenier did to restore full functionality to our epics and to the OoW tunic.

Sorrian
02-17-2007, 07:08 PM
4.6 castime time for 2 x heal of Purelife assuming you have the focus & cleric spell haste ) for 6352 vs 2.8 cast time (assuming you have the focus & cleric spell haste ) group heal for 3k ( which tends to crit for 4-5k anyway ).

There are situations where you are hit by multiple AE's on which you will have to heal really quick to keep people alive ( Ever had situations where you had to choose which peron dies cause you cant heal both fast enough )?

FAIL!!! If you had the focus and spell haste why didn't you apply it to Pure Life as well? Because it didn't serve your purpose? Try about 5k +/- and 3.8 seconds for Pure life with an average focus and spell haste. PL crits for around 10k +/-, that's a total of about 20k. If had you had bothered to be a little less ignorant or a little more observant, you would have noticed that I was referring to someone's comment about healing with moonshadow was more efficient when healing 2 people. Which it isn't. Good Job trying to put a spin on my comment and making it "almost" validate your argument.

While you are healing someone with your out-dated group heal the damage still continues to roll in. Now what do you do? You start casting single heals to catch up. You may even use AS to get it done faster.....there goes what little efficiency moonshadow had. Now you've healed twice to keep the same person at the same level hp in nearly the same amount of time. Yep....it works fine.

I do agree there are some situations when it is needed to cast the group heal, but they are few and far between. Use it when 4 or more people need to be healed. Anything other than that is a waste. This isn't an awesome, heal to end all heals, spell.

Sorrian
02-17-2007, 07:20 PM
No, there is no reason for people to complain. If you pay for a Cadillac, but get a Prius, you should be happy and go frolic, hand-in-hand with the salesman (i.e. Prathun), in a field of daisies. Right?

None of you people, happy with the status quo, can say it isn't different. None of you can say we haven't lost ground. The mobs damage and tanks HP has nearly doubled in the last 2 or 3 years. All the while our healing has risen less than 50%. Takes twice as long to kill comparable mobs as back then. In fact, the only thing you have said is "quit whining" or you offer some self-assuring, conceited, elitist comment like "I can heal just fine in all high-end content". Sure you can heal. Of course you can still solo. And that Prius will still crank up and go. Good job proving your point.

As Alei stated, if LL had been left alone it would have been a great spell and nobody would complained about anything else. We would have been happy with that. I would have been more than happy with that. But it was nerfed and now people are going to start complaining. People aren't mad that their vote wasn't counted, they are upset that they are not getting what they pay for. Why do you expect it to be different? They have every right to be upset, regardless of how happy YOU are.

I don't want to heal like a cleric, dot like a necro, or nuke like a wizard....I want to be just as effective as I was 4 or 5 expansions ago.

Rajolae
02-17-2007, 07:25 PM
FAIL!!! If you had the focus and spell haste why didn't you apply it to Pure Life as well? Because it didn't serve your purpose? Try about 5k +/- and 3.8 seconds for Pure life with an average focus and spell haste. PL crits for around 10k +/-, that's a total of about 20k. If had you had bothered to be a little less ignorant or a little more observant, you would have noticed that I was referring to someone's comment about healing with moonshadow was more efficient when healing 2 people. Which it isn't. Good Job trying to put a spin on my comment and making it "almost" validate your argument.

While you are healing someone with your out-dated group heal the damage still continues to roll in. Now what do you do? You start casting single heals to catch up. You may even use AS to get it done faster.....there goes what little efficiency moonshadow had. Now you've healed twice to keep the same person at the same level hp in nearly the same amount of time. Yep....it works fine.

I do agree there are some situations when it is needed to cast the group heal, but they are few and far between. Use it when 4 or more people need to be healed. Anything other than that is a waste. This isn't an awesome, heal to end all heals, spell.

PL III heals an average of 4.6k (with 65% focus) and has a cast of 2.3 (which would be 2.3 x 2). When two people are damaged enough to warrant healing, you are better off using MS.

Lujayne
02-17-2007, 09:31 PM
FAIL!!! If you had the focus and spell haste why didn't you apply it to Pure Life as well? Because it didn't serve your purpose? Try about 5k +/- and 3.8 seconds for Pure life with an average focus and spell haste. PL crits for around 10k +/-, that's a total of about 20k. If had you had bothered to be a little less ignorant or a little more observant, you would have noticed that I was referring to someone's comment about healing with moonshadow was more efficient when healing 2 people. Which it isn't. Good Job trying to put a spin on my comment and making it "almost" validate your argument.

While you are healing someone with your out-dated group heal the damage still continues to roll in. Now what do you do? You start casting single heals to catch up. You may even use AS to get it done faster.....there goes what little efficiency moonshadow had. Now you've healed twice to keep the same person at the same level hp in nearly the same amount of time. Yep....it works fine.

I do agree there are some situations when it is needed to cast the group heal, but they are few and far between. Use it when 4 or more people need to be healed. Anything other than that is a waste. This isn't an awesome, heal to end all heals, spell.
Because I was calculated your 2 x PL Heal at 2.3 cast times ( pay attention dumbass ). Alot of the time you have to determine how much your healing for, in cases of a 4-5k heals not 10k+ heals PL Crits do not factor in, there are also other factors such as Abudant Healing. Healing two people with Moonshadow can be more cost effective depending on the situation.

Again I state in the case your whole group is taking damage and someone is being continously attacked you are not going to go out of your way to cast an individual heal to each person in group as you would probably not have enough time to heal the person taking damage as well.

( Oh nos I've been hit by Lethar's Breath of Corruption and then Shadow of Lethar, lets individually heal each person ).



None of you people, happy with the status quo, can say it isn't different. None of you can say we haven't lost ground. The mobs damage and tanks HP has nearly doubled in the last 2 or 3 years. All the while our healing has risen less than 50%. Takes twice as long to kill comparable mobs as back then. In fact, the only thing you have said is "quit whining" or you offer some self-assuring, conceited, elitist comment like "I can heal just fine in all high-end content". Sure you can heal. Of course you can still solo. And that Prius will still crank up and go. Good job proving your point.

And I suppose mobs in TBS should have the hp of mobs from Kunark in your fantasy world. Yes I say quit whinging because that's what your doing. You've taken a legit complaint about a nerf to one of our spells and turned it into a OMGZ WE GOT NERFED SPELL IT'S THE END OF CLASS, SOE IS OUT TO SHAFT OUR CLASS, DRUID'S SUCK!!! Nothing is less impressive then a person whose been acting like they have been bitten by a rabid wolf. (You havent been to Qeynos Hills lately have you?). There's a major difference in Elitist and someone maximizing their potential at playing their class.

Sorrian
02-17-2007, 10:35 PM
Because I was calculated your 2 x PL Heal at 2.3 cast times ( pay attention dumbass ). Alot of the time you have to determine how much your healing for, in cases of a 4-5k heals not 10k+ heals PL Crits do not factor in, there are also other factors such as Abudant Healing. Healing two people with Moonshadow can be more cost effective depending on the situation.

Again I state in the case your whole group is taking damage and someone is being continously attacked you are not going to go out of your way to cast an individual heal to each person in group as you would probably not have enough time to heal the person taking damage as well.

( Oh nos I've been hit by Lethar's Breath of Corruption and then Shadow of Lethar, lets individually heal each person ).



And I suppose mobs in TBS should have the hp of mobs from Kunark in your fantasy world. Yes I say quit whinging because that's what your doing. You've taken a legit complaint about a nerf to one of our spells and turned it into a OMGZ WE GOT NERFED SPELL IT'S THE END OF CLASS, SOE IS OUT TO SHAFT OUR CLASS, DRUID'S SUCK!!! Nothing is less impressive then a person whose been acting like they have been bitten by a rabid wolf. (You havent been to Qeynos Hills lately have you?). There's a major difference in Elitist and someone maximizing their potential at playing their class.

That garbage is completely over the top. Have the HP of mobs from Kunark? You have no clue what I was even saying. You have done nothing but distort and corrupt posts meant for another subject to satisfy your ends. Twisted to conform to your side of an argument. You quoted my post, used to illustrate that healing 2 people with moonshadow was not more mana efficient,(Pay attention dumbass!!!) and started comparing cast times. Who the hell said anything about cast time? If you don't want someone to call you out on things then don't misquote them. It wasn't a conversation that even involved you but yet, you jumped right in.
The whole point was for you to compare what it was like back then to now ,and all you do is spout profanities. I tried to voice what so many believe but won't say because of people like you. You try to harass and intimidate, by immediately jumping all over someone who doesn't see it the same as you. You're readiness to try to insult someone over something you don't agree with shows your infantile attitude. GROW UP!

After all that, none of you have addressed it. Like I said, all I hear is "stop whining". Nobody offers evidence to the contrary. I wonder why that is.

Sorrian
02-17-2007, 11:17 PM
Doesn't matter anymore....it's a dead issue for me. I'm dropping it. Have fun. My subscription will not be renewed.
Please feel free to post more ad hominem.

Riverwinter
02-18-2007, 08:47 AM
Nobody offers evidence to the contrary. I wonder why that is.
The answer to that rhetorical question is that it's not worth the effort to argue with Druids about it. I've noticed that a lot of the old timers, (People who have been members since, oh, 2005. /chuckles) have for the most part stayed out of this discussion.

Every class board is going to have something that is the big issue of the day, and while this one is interesting, argument here is not going to accomplish anything. Some just like to argue for arguments sake, others just don't see the point that their fellows are trying to make. You all have good points sometimes, but overall, you're wasting your brainpower on something that you cannot change: Each Others Opinions.

I remind myself weekly that "EQ, the Board Game" sucks. People read what they want to read in your post, believe whole heartedly that their opinion is right and subconsciously spin what you say to meet their needs. Other people innocently write what they think and get blasted for having an opinion, because they didn't give the depth of thought that veterans give to their posts, or because they haven't been playing EQ for as long as the veteran.

Rarely do people see the other guys point of view, even more rarely do people say, "I didn't think of it that way." When's the last time someone has come out and said, "Wow, you're right, I was wrong"?

If you want to influence a person's opinion on the boards, you can't come off like "I'm right; everyone else is a moron and doesn't see it." Your attitude reflected in the tone your post influences others attitudes and the tone of their responses. Most people post as though they are the authority and everyone else should take notes; that's how we end up passionately defending our posts instead of discussing issues like grownups.

My take on the whole group heal issue is simply that while I have a group heal in my lineup, it's not something I use unless the fit has hit the shan. Rarely do I have more than two people who actually need the heal when I cast it, so calculating hitpoints and mana is useless to me. It's usefulness is simply that I can patch heal two or more people with one cast. I'll probably not swap them out until I see myself in a situation that warrants a bigger Group heal.

But that's my opinion, what the hell do I know?

Let's just agree to disagree....I am sleepy.
Sorrian had the right answer five days ago. We just missed it.

Xarra
02-18-2007, 10:30 AM
It's sad all this bitching and complaining for something we should be happy about. Till PoR druids didnt even have a group heal, till DoD we didnt have reptile. Before all that for those druids around that remember back that far healing was much more limited. We had 2 heals, CH/5990 as i called it, or a fast heal. At a time around GoD era the CH became all but worthless for druids because its not our role to drop a lot of healing, our role is to give a little healing to everyone when they need it. We have to be Johnny on the spot with the heals so to speak. Anyone that is complaining about this group heal simply doesnt understand how to utilize it effectively. It's intended to be casted after a proc of GoRM, they raised the level of the grp heal so that now it would also proc GoRM rather than just GoM. Keep the majority of your grp around 75% health tossing heals as they hit 60% then when GoRM fires drop in the grp heal to max some people out. It is true that as the game changes the classes and their roles will also change. Do you think necros enjoy being used as mana batterys more than dps now than when they were first made way back when. The game changes as result players must change and adapt to learn how to make their class function best with other classes. Either adapt or lose your edge. Quit complaining and learn how to make the best with what you are given.

Sorrian
02-18-2007, 01:01 PM
It's sad all this bitching and complaining for something we should be happy about. Till PoR druids didnt even have a group heal, till DoD we didnt have reptile. Before all that for those druids around that remember back that far healing was much more limited. We had 2 heals, CH/5990 as i called it, or a fast heal. At a time around GoD era the CH became all but worthless for druids because its not our role to drop a lot of healing, our role is to give a little healing to everyone when they need it. We have to be Johnny on the spot with the heals so to speak. Anyone that is complaining about this group heal simply doesnt understand how to utilize it effectively. It's intended to be casted after a proc of GoRM, they raised the level of the grp heal so that now it would also proc GoRM rather than just GoM. Keep the majority of your grp around 75% health tossing heals as they hit 60% then when GoRM fires drop in the grp heal to max some people out. It is true that as the game changes the classes and their roles will also change. Do you think necros enjoy being used as mana batterys more than dps now than when they were first made way back when. The game changes as result players must change and adapt to learn how to make their class function best with other classes. Either adapt or lose your edge. Quit complaining and learn how to make the best with what you are given.

I understand quite well how and when to use this heal. Now you are assuming too much. Get off your pedestal for a minute and try to understand that not everybody, while disagreeing with you, are stupid.

All in all, you repeated the same tired rhetoric....don't worry, be happy.

Just drop it already.

Riverwinter
02-18-2007, 02:06 PM
Doesn't matter anymore....it's a dead issue for me. I'm dropping it. Have fun. My subscription will not be renewed.
Please feel free to post more ad hominem.
Xarra was just doing what you said and you jumped back in to defend your POV. Thank you for proving my point.

Sorrian
02-18-2007, 02:58 PM
Xarra was just doing what you said and you jumped back in to defend your POV. Thank you for proving my point.

So what?! I am tired of people saying things like they are the great master of the druid class and they know everything. Like they know what everyone is doing or how they play. Assuming that others don't know to use a mana-hog spell after Go(R)M procs.....DUH! Everyone knows that and everyone does it.

The only point that has been proven was mine. Deal with it.

Riverwinter
02-18-2007, 03:01 PM
/chuckles

Sorrian
02-18-2007, 03:08 PM
/chuckles

MWAHAHA....thx for proving another of my points.....see if you can find it...:clap:

Alaene
02-18-2007, 03:19 PM
After all that, none of you have addressed it. Like I said, all I hear is "stop whining". Nobody offers evidence to the contrary. I wonder why that is.

I agree with Sorrian.

I don't think that a moderately geared lvl 75 ("grouping") druid is helpless, or crap. I don't think they can't heal. But I can very much see that they've lost a lot of relative ground to other classes.

The fact is that ANY class with decent gear and AA can contribute in the current grouping environment. Some just contribute a lot more than others - and this is the point. Not that druids are no use, but that they are relatively inferior.

Check out the thread at http://forums.station.sony.com/eq/posts/list.m?topic_id=106581 if you want real highend comment on the state of the raiding druid.

Sorrian
02-18-2007, 03:28 PM
I agree with Sorrian.

I don't think that a moderately geared lvl 75 ("grouping") druid is helpless, or crap. I don't think they can't heal. But I can very much see that they've lost a lot of relative ground to other classes.

The fact is that ANY class with decent gear and AA can contribute in the current grouping environment. Some just contribute a lot more than others - and this is the point. Not that druids are no use, but that they are relatively inferior.

Check out the thread at http://forums.station.sony.com/eq/posts/list.m?topic_id=106581 if you want real highend comment on the state of the raiding druid.

Thank you Alaene.

Riverwinter
02-18-2007, 06:04 PM
The funny thing is, Sorrian, I don't have an agenda. I didn't disagree with you or agree with you.

I didn't post anything remotely implying I was the All-Powerful-Oz of Druids. I fully admit that I read these threads to learn something, and sometimes I pass along things that I have learned so that other Druids don't have to learn this crap the hard way. I think I explained that the changes to Lunarlight really don't affect me.

I find it ironic that someone who has on two seperate instances called for us to drop the subject and threatened cancelling his subscription comes flying back into the discussion. You had it right the first time when you said we should agree to disagree. In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter.

The only reason I even comment on this thread now is because it amuses me. I hope that answers your question.

As far as being #16 on one Raid Leaders list of desirable classes, I'll live with it. The posts here Looking for Druids and the high priority that many guilds put on recruiting them let me know that some people find value in our class, despite our handicaps.

Lujayne
02-18-2007, 06:34 PM
So what?! I am tired of people saying things like they are the great master of the druid class and they know everything. Like they know what everyone is doing or how they play. Assuming that others don't know to use a mana-hog spell after Go(R)M procs.....DUH! Everyone knows that and everyone does it.

The only point that has been proven was mine. Deal with it.

I guess your the only one "entitled" to be the great master of the druid class and know everything.

Take your own advice.

Sorrian
02-18-2007, 10:26 PM
I didn't post anything remotely implying I was the All-Powerful-Oz of Druids. I fully admit that I read these threads to learn something, and sometimes I pass along things that I have learned so that other Druids don't have to learn this crap the hard way. I think I explained that the changes to Lunarlight really don't affect me.

I find it ironic that someone who has on two seperate instances called for us to drop the subject and threatened cancelling his subscription comes flying back into the discussion. You had it right the first time when you said we should agree to disagree. In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter.

I never said you did. I said I was tired of the select few that were assuming how others were playing the class. Professing to know what they were doing wrong, without ever grouping, raiding, or talking to them. I'm sorry you misundertood my post, or I wasn't clear enough on it. While it was a response to you, the content was not directed at you, except for the part about who's point was proven. I was angry, and I still am, about people who refuse to acknowledge what is right in front of them, and the first thing out of their mouth is an insult to some other poster in here, who they disagreed with.

It isn't ironic at all. It has now morphed into something totally new. It is no longer about which heal does what, it is now a new topic. What do you expect me to do, when someone clearly has misquoted me, then uses that as a platform for insults? If I am put on the defensive, then I have no right to retaliate? Sorry, but that isn't in my nature. If I am insulted, I will throw a few back. I will get just as nasty as the next guy. If for nothing more, than to show them what it looks like. I dunno....was I supposed to run after that happened? I find that difficult to do.

...and the twisted misquoting happened again...

EDIT: My mistake was posting a sarcastic remark about the spells we were getting, because I was met with an immediate assumption on what I was doing wrong . Or maybe it was just having an opinion. Maybe it was offering evidence that couldn't be refuted. Could have been the fact that I won't sugar-coat my response to what I see as an attack on me or others. Maybe they are all mistakes. You are right about about me beating a dead horse....but I still don't like the way that horse looks...

Necrokilla
02-19-2007, 04:16 PM
If you want to influence a person's opinion on the boards, you can't come off like "I'm right; everyone else is a moron and doesn't see it." Your attitude reflected in the tone your post influences others attitudes and the tone of their responses. Most people post as though they are the authority and everyone else should take notes; that's how we end up passionately defending our posts instead of discussing issues like grownups.

I never post because of threads like these, on any site, always find a way to awry. I came in here because I wanted to start a druid on my second account and I wanted some info on how I should try to gear my toon up. Instead, I found this....train-wreck of misinterpretation. It irks me and I have to respond now.

As for your post Riverwinter, that is ablsolutely NOT what I got from Sorrian's posts. You say it was Sorrian's posts that influenced the attitudes and tones of their responses. I call shenanigans on that. It was the other way around. From his first post, which was poorly worded but that's beside the point, Sorrian was told how he was doing something wrong. THAT IS AN INSULT. It is meant to be a smartass comment. It was the others posts that influenced Sorrian's tone. So, Sorrian went on a campaign of nay-sayer bashing.

After reading their posts I can see exactly what Sorrian was talking about. It IS an arrogant assumption to say you know how someone plays from a few posts. To then say, "you're doing something wrong obviously" or "you're coming of as a know-it-all yourself" would piss anyone off. I can see where Sorrian thought they were jabs. They definately seem to be. If they were not intended to be, it seems they would have been worded differently. Your post falls into this category.

You say you don't have an agenda. Maybe not for the issue of druids, as a class, but you do have one against Sorrian or his posts, or that paragraph, I quoted, wouldn't have made it's way into your post. Although, I do agree with the rest of it.

From reading the last by Sorrian, I think that is as close to an apology as you will get, River.

Lujayne, you come off as a forum bully. That's as nice as I can make it sound and I am not trying to be your enemy here. Maybe this wasn't your intent, but try to proof-read your posts before you click "Submit Reply", try to not leave it open to interpretation.

Sorrian, quit taking so much to heart. Like Riverwinter pointed out, you had it right when you said "let's just agree to disagree". I don't think you came "flying back in", it was more like you were drug back in by your hair. That doesn't excuse some of your actions. Unfortunately, you misinterpreted a few things people said and doesn't make you look so good either. You also left your posts open to interpretation and that was just the fuel some needed to fire back. If you want to drop a subject then just drop it. It makes you look just as childish as those you accuse of being.

Every single person involved in this arguement acted like a child and, at some point, misinterpreted what the other was saying. A chronic problem in all forums, it seems. :eusa_booh

Riverwinter
02-19-2007, 05:39 PM
If you want to influence a person's opinion on the boards, you can't come off like "I'm right; everyone else is a moron and doesn't see it." Your attitude reflected in the tone your post influences others attitudes and the tone of their responses. Most people post as though they are the authority and everyone else should take notes; that's how we end up passionately defending our posts instead of discussing issues like grownups.
The "you" I was referring to was the plural you of the community. My audience was all Druids, I did not mean to single out Sorrian. I normally do not quote people for this specific reason. I do not like to single out people, or misinterpret what they say. In another thread I have specifically asked if what a person implied was what they meant.

My apologies to Sorrian and to you all if you felt I was singling him out, it was not my intent. I was not insulted, nor did I expect or desire an apology from him.

And the above quote applies to me as well. I hope that I live up to my own standards.

Lujayne
02-20-2007, 12:53 AM
Lujayne, you come off as a forum bully. That's as nice as I can make it sound and I am not trying to be your enemy here. Maybe this wasn't your intent, but try to proof-read your posts before you click "Submit Reply", try to not leave it open to interpretation.


How so? Wait I guess I should go tell people to f off, they have no right to an opinion because they aren't raiding anything modern! Like that other guy!!

Have you read the forum name? I'm pretty sure it reads Unkempt Druids, there are a dozen other forums that I can be nice and should be nice in so quite frankly if I feel like being an ass the low-moderated forum would be a good place to do it don't you think? Judging by your post count I'm sure you are more then aware people are going to argue with each other. Should people take these arguements personally? Probably not but IF they do and I'm very sorry for that.

I like how you can make a complete assumption about a person in this part of the forum! Oh no 3 posts in a thread and your suddenly completely defined!! By the way if I were really bullying, in this case I think you mean Sorrian, that would mean that you thought he was weak. which he obviously isn't.

Alei
02-20-2007, 03:14 AM
This might be Unkempt forum, but didn't you notice that neither Wind nor Bolo got as insulted by Sorrian's post as you did? Lol :p Not to mention how close you seem to be to having a heartattack about the whole thing.
I certainly didn't read as much hostility in Sorrian's post as you do.

I know you probably don't agree with me, but please... Be gentle. I bruise easily.
:newburn:

tieniman
02-20-2007, 10:49 AM
Ever stop to think if ya'll just stopped whining and cussing at eachother and actually DISCUSSED the usefullness or lack thereof in the new spells and content the druid class would be in a better spot right now?

The problem I see to be honest is that the human mind is a machine of radicals. It's the dawn of a new age or fires of armageddon. Keep in mind that in essence there are two games that must be balanced in EQ grouping and raiding. I think thats where alot of the problems come from.

High end raiders will say "you should be able to handle this in a group or you suck" ...all the while not keeping in mind of the drastic difference in capabilities between a raid geared char and a grouping char. Likewise people that dont raid really cant comprehend the needs of a druids in a raid force.

Are there problems with the current druid spell line up? Personally I definately say yes. However by no means have druids been rendered useless. Many of the newer spells people will rant and rave about being totally useless really arent. They're just quite situational it seems.

One of my biggest concerns and what I beleive to be the real root of the issue is the whole all classes get the same amount of spells deal. I think this is making it very difficult to shall we say round off the needs of the druid class because of its very nature.

Basically I look at it this way. The druid class was supposedly intended to have a much wider range of capabilities in turn for sacrificing the possibility of being the best at any of them. (This is why our spells will never be what the other classes have even sadly the group heal of pallies) It's a pretty fair trade as far as I'm concerned but as a caster class of this type it would inheritantly be neccesary for it to therefor have more spells then the other classes.

What and how ? wellt hats for the devs to decide but they just might listen to the class itself a little bit more if we werent so busy slinging insults at eachother and demanding impossibilities.

devaras
02-20-2007, 11:39 AM
Heres the deal-I can heal damn good, I raid in high level content, but I still go LFG for hours at a time, until finally I got sick of it and made a new ranger, who is already level 60 in the time it took my druid to get 40 AA's. Sorry, but this is a group centric game. If I can't find a group EVEN THROUGH MY OWN GUILD, there is something wrong. I am in the same guild as Alei, and I feel her pain.

http://everquest.station.sony.com/
Click on classes, and look what they have as for the Druid Definition. They need to tune us appropriately. It is sad when a tank can heal a group better than us and a DPS can cure better than us when we are a PRIEST class.

Currently on raids I cast 1 buff, 2 if we need resist buffs. All my buffs are trumped by other classes, and I cant even use my skin like reptile on pallies. So to say that we bring buffs to the table is kind of misleading too, rangers get more useful buffs than we do.

Fenier
02-20-2007, 12:25 PM
I just want to state that I have rarely seen the druid class more united then during the last Beta process.

It wsa that unified front which got us Hoar Frost, and which pushed for better verisons of Fernspur, ATU and Vinelash when replacing them obviously wasn't happening.

-Fenier

tieniman
02-20-2007, 12:32 PM
I just want to state that I have rarely seen the druid class more united then during the last Beta process.

It wsa that unified front which got us Hoar Frost, and which pushed for better verisons of Fernspur, ATU and Vinelash when replacing them obviously wasn't happening.

-Fenier

That very well may be true Fenier and I appreciate that though from what it seems the case there was pretty radical considering how bad these spells are but the temporary unity of the few beta druids doesnt say to much for the class on the whole as can be seen on these boards as well as the SOE boards.

Granted I will cede the point that the emotional and obnoxious do tend be the most heard simply due to the fact that they are usually the most outspoken and loud more so then because they are the majority.

However those are what is seen and heard nevertheless.

Erikochan
02-21-2007, 12:05 PM
Lujayne , saying Sorrian expects mobs to be equal in HP compared to Kunark mobs gets you the "most stupid comment of the year" award. He was ofcourse speaking in .. *tah tah dah tahhhh*


RELATIVE


terms.

Grow some brains, ffs.

Lujayne
02-21-2007, 11:18 PM
Lujayne , saying Sorrian expects mobs to be equal in HP compared to Kunark mobs gets you the "most stupid comment of the year" award. He was ofcourse speaking in .. *tah tah dah tahhhh*


RELATIVE


terms.

Grow some brains, ffs.

Awsome, I guess i should have added behind that comment - (This was a sarcastic addition).

Should I also add "Relative" to that too?

Mebunyip
03-16-2007, 04:55 AM
Try being a non raiding Druid.The best you can hope to do is be a mule for chasing Tradeskill supplies....... .After over 5 years , hundreds upon hundreds of zones there is nothing left for this Druid :( .

Erianaiel
03-16-2007, 07:40 AM
Try being a non raiding Druid.The best you can hope to do is be a mule for chasing Tradeskill supplies....... .After over 5 years , hundreds upon hundreds of zones there is nothing left for this Druid :( .

In all honesty, being a non-raider severely limits the playability of more classes than the druid, and we at least get to forage ...

Oh wait. I forgot that for the good of the game everybody gets to forage too.


Eri

serinity_inny
03-16-2007, 11:23 AM
Sorry you feel that way Mebyunip.....I have a great time in game and have something going on every single night and have other people asking to get into my groups (I am usually main healer but sometimes let the cleric come instead of her enchanter).......this game is what you make it folks .....stop having pitty party and have fun or move on.

Am I the strongest dps class heck no but my wizard friend loves having me along for heals, instant invis, back up exodus and when we do crit its not bad dps.....also he wouldn't dream of going with out Direskin! so yes wizards have it good but not everyone is all about you can't dps like the wizard or heal like the cleric so we don't want you.

When you main heal the Locating Statue namer fight for the first time and get that rush from knowing you pushed your limits a little further it makes the game that much more fun.

Cibby

Fenier
03-16-2007, 07:02 PM
Try being a non raiding Druid.The best you can hope to do is be a mule for chasing Tradeskill supplies.......
I find this statement highly dubious at best.

Assuming you are able to stay roughly up to date with the casual player power curve, there are very few spots you shouldn't be able to handle as a non-raiding druid.

I believe Chibby doesn't raid, and so likely could have decent advice on that.

Chilkoot
03-17-2007, 02:08 AM
You can buy better than Time gear in the bazaar now so you cant be bitching about being a no raider and not having great gear. And if you want to complain about not having any new zones to play in or see become a raider and go see the new areas or stfu. If you think it really sucks that bad cancel your account noone is forcing you to pay for this thing that is causing you such "grief", but be warned there isnt anything out there better. I beta tested carpe diem, vangaurd, and LOTR online, they all suck, the only thing im remotely looking forward to is Assasins Creed.

Erianaiel
03-17-2007, 02:11 PM
Dismissing somebody's complaints with a 'go play another game' is bad form at best.

It also is rather silly in this case as the choice between raiding or not is far from trivial. Raiding implies a serious time commitment that the person you so rudely dismissed may not be able to make. That does not mean he has no right to play the game to a reasonable degree of fun.

Finally, what is the point you are trying to make?


Eri

Woodelfous
03-19-2007, 09:41 PM
Meh it sucks getting the shaft from Sony on spells. Honestly though you guys should be used to it. Just automaticlly assume the position each expansion release, and if we get the plesant suprise of getting cuddled with after getting screwed(IE usefull spells). Then HEY!! all the better!

The good news is, we aren't beastlords.

Kitano
03-19-2007, 11:24 PM
there was a pure TSS/DoD group geared Druid in my group today, and the difference between him and me (Top Guild Stromm) was barely noticeable (in group function mind you) he healed just fine, had decent dps, snared everything ... so the gap isnt as big as some of you may think

Erianaiel
03-20-2007, 03:27 AM
The good news is, we aren't beastlords.

Yet ...

I admit being a bit worried about all those people that keep asking for a pet


Eri

Noken
03-22-2007, 04:53 PM
thought it'd be worth mentioning..

I have ally faction to Katta and around 5000 orux sitting doing absolutely nothing, yet havn't bought LL. It's just that bad.

Riverwinter
03-22-2007, 05:29 PM
I think we can safely call Lunarlight (post beta nerfed) a marginal upgrade for those of us who have Moonshadow.

Those that do not have Moonshadow and are running around doing quests in the new expansion, it's worth the Orux to get.