View Full Forums : NYT: The Class War Before Palin
Klath
10-11-2008, 07:43 AM
The op-ed piece below is mostly an abbreviated version of this video:
Part 1: David Brooks and Jeffrey Goldberg at the Atlantic Luncheon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnA7ce9Q7KA&feature=related)
Part 2: David Brooks and Jeffrey Goldberg, Atlantic Luncheon II (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvxQwNqZSOQ)
The second video contains the now infamous comment that Sarah Palin represents a "fatal cancer to the Republican party." I'm not sure what that metaphor implies about Bush but, hey, it's not my article...
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The Class War Before Palin (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/10/opinion/10brooks.html?_r=1&oref=slogin)
By DAVID BROOKS
Published: October 9, 2008
odern conservatism began as a movement of dissident intellectuals. Richard Weaver wrote a book called, “Ideas Have Consequences.” Russell Kirk placed Edmund Burke in an American context. William F. Buckley famously said he’d rather be governed by the first 2,000 names in the Boston phone book than by the faculty of Harvard. But he didn’t believe those were the only two options. His entire life was a celebration of urbane values, sophistication and the rigorous and constant application of intellect.
Driven by a need to engage elite opinion, conservatives tried to build an intellectual counterestablishment with think tanks and magazines. They disdained the ideas of the liberal professoriate, but they did not disdain the idea of a cultivated mind.
Ronald Reagan was no intellectual, but he had an earnest faith in ideas and he spent decades working through them. He was rooted in the Midwest, but he also loved Hollywood. And for a time, it seemed the Republican Party would be a broad coalition — small-town values with coastal reach.
[More... (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/10/opinion/10brooks.html?_r=1&oref=slogin)]
Panamah
10-11-2008, 10:20 AM
Man, parts of that clipped out things I wanted to hear!
I always liked David Brooks even though his Republicanism shines through at times, he does seem to give a really balanced viewed of stuff unlike most pundits. I actually agree with him at times.
I noticed that Republicans don't like intellectuals or people that challenge authority and try to shake up the status quo too much. They like tradition over thought, at least the social conservatives. That's something that I don't think is ever going to be resolved between Democrats and Republicans. Bush is a great example of what social conservatives want, they want to elect "Joe Six-Pack" because they believe he can represent their values better. Well, Joe Six-Pack has an IQ equal to the number of cans joined by a ring of plastic in his fridge and he's going to make dumb decisions. We need smart people leading the country, not village idiots. I know that this campaign didn't go into school records at all, but McCain is another one who didn't do well at school. Sarah Palin went to 5 or 6 colleges before graduating.
You know, the last few days I've been musing over GBW. He ran an oil company into bankruptcy. Now he's done it to the country. People got stop ignoring the records of the people they vote for. If someone is incompetent in their life before politics, they're probably going to be incompetent handling things after they get elected.
I hope this brand of conservatism dies out. I don't mind smart Republicans and wouldn't mind if they got smart Republicans elected but they seem to be pushing Joe Six-packs into office that they are unfit to govern.
Klath
10-13-2008, 11:35 AM
I hope this brand of conservatism dies out. I don't mind smart Republicans and wouldn't mind if they got smart Republicans elected but they seem to be pushing Joe Six-packs into office that they are unfit to govern.
Yeah, I agree. The Republicans have chosen as their base a group of people who are easy to motivate. Put on a lapel pin, mention God a lot, take a aggressive foreign policy stance, and wave the flag like crazy and you pretty much have their support. If you combine that with the sort of polarizing and incendiary rhetoric that Palin has been spewing at the rallies and you can guarantee they'll vote in droves. The problem is that, over the years, these folks start offering up their own candidates and you wind up losing the party to them.
Erianaiel
10-14-2008, 06:30 AM
Yeah, I agree. The Republicans have chosen as their base a group of people who are easy to motivate. Put on a lapel pin, mention God a lot, take a aggressive foreign policy stance, and wave the flag like crazy and you pretty much have their support. If you combine that with the sort of polarizing and incendiary rhetoric that Palin has been spewing at the rallies and you can guarantee they'll vote in droves. The problem is that, over the years, these folks start offering up their own candidates and you wind up losing the party to them.
They have already lost the party to them. The election of GBW was a signal that the republican leaders wanted a figurehead to appeal to the masses while behind the scenes they ran the show. His reelection confirmed that this strategy worked. To be elected you need to put on a show, and who better to put on a show than an actor? And if he is unqualified for the job he will both better appeal to the voters and (hopefully) be easier to control.
The danger to this strategy is that you need to emphasise the difference, especially as voter blocks are increasingly alienated from each other. The average republican voter does not care who 'their' candidate is, simply because they do not trust (nor even listen to) -anything- the candidate from the opposing party says. This enemy thinking has been kicked into high gear by Palin and her inflamatory rhetoric. The fact that the audience was aggresive enough to want to break out the pitchforks, pyres and lynching rope to go looking for Obama right there and then, underscores how dangerous this really is. His backtracking may indicate that McCain does not want to go quite that far (though this could easily also be intentional to show that -he- is moderate and thus a safer choice), but many in the republican party keep on the aggressive us versus the demonic-them approach. It seems that the democrat party still has not quite clued in on the fact that the current political climate and system encourages extremism over reason.
Demonising your opposition is the final step that needs to be taken before you can get your followers to start the fight. The fact even a small fraction of the more fanatical voters is truly believing that the other party must be killed should keep strategists in both camps awake at night with worry, but I am afraid they are just seeing it as proof that their strategy works to lock voters into their camp.
Eri
Klath
10-14-2008, 11:36 AM
Demonising your opposition is the final step that needs to be taken before you can get your followers to start the fight. The fact even a small fraction of the more fanatical voters is truly believing that the other party must be killed should keep strategists in both camps awake at night with worry, but I am afraid they are just seeing it as proof that their strategy works to lock voters into their camp.
Aye, it works well for locking up their base but, thankfully, it appears to do so at the cost of bringing new voters in. The recent reports and videos of angry McCain supporters seem to be driving independent voters toward Obama.
Given the current economic crisis and the two wars that are going badly, the stakes are exceptionally high in this election and the political environment is very tense. Given the over-the-top rhetoric from the McCain campaign portraying Obama as a secret Muslim terrorist (and a pedophile baby killer), it makes me wonder if their trying to get him killed.
Panamah
10-14-2008, 12:17 PM
Given the over-the-top rhetoric from the McCain campaign portraying Obama as a secret Muslim terrorist (and a pedophile baby killer), it makes me wonder if their trying to get him killed.
I am wondering the exact same thing. Stirring up right-wing Republicans like that, they tend to be well-armed. They don't mind shooting abortion doctors and blowing things up because "God" tells them to, or they're doing it for their country. Wow, scary stuff to see. I hope Obama doesn't get assassinated.
Klath
10-14-2008, 12:58 PM
Yeah, stuff like this really doesn't help:
John McCain rally in Iowa marked by partisan prayer (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/10/john-mccain-ral.html)
I hope the IRS gets all taxy on Rev. Conrad for endorsing from the pulpit.
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