View Full Forums : PVP - Druids murdering Rangers


SexyPortal
07-07-2003, 07:01 PM
I need some help with good strats to take out a Ranger. Both 65, he has about 40 AA over me. He's mastered his Archery, and has the best bow in the game. He can crit for nearly 4k, which makes him rather hard to duel. Any ideas?

Seriena
07-07-2003, 07:08 PM
Write a will :)

Mullen Skywatcher
07-07-2003, 07:25 PM
When the going gets tough, the tough cheat :P

Woodix
07-07-2003, 11:18 PM
If it's in an arena bah .... see ya :p

If you can choose the zone, you can take advantage using Walls / Tree etc ... In a such zone as EJ for example you can even charm with tunare request to bother him while your casting ( I Would use DoTs in order to lower his life when he's running after you...that's lame ?!! nahh :p )
But above all, depends a lot of the stuff you have...and how both of you are playing yours charcaters.

Jarilon
07-08-2003, 04:48 AM
Try to get him rooted and then remain close enough to him that he can't use his bow but far enough away that he can't melee you.

malibu1966
07-08-2003, 02:59 PM
Well, its pretty clear if he uses his bow - you are toast. So I'd try to find a place to hide behind. You may also be able to just push yourself against a wall and render his bow useless (works for MoBs ...). Even in an Arena, pushing hard into a wall may protect you - but I don't know.

If you can find a way to neutralize the bow, root and dot if you can - and keep chain rooting. If he gets on you, heal/Spirit of Wood/Regen and hope the DS will do the job - plus any nukes you can get off. Avoid the urge to try kiting - as soon as you move, he'll perforate you with the bow ...

Other than that /shrug ...

Tuppen FV
07-08-2003, 04:56 PM
I find the AOE blind to be a great spell for use in PvP...can't shoot or cast if he can't see. Of course...at 65, he probably has very good MR and will resist the spell.

Good luck.

AmonraSet
07-09-2003, 05:03 AM
It very much depends how well equipped he is and particularly how good his resists are.

If his equipment is on a similar level to yours then you stand a good chance of being able to land roots/dots and fighting him that way, while finding something to hide behind to try and negate his bow (Ive found that standing next to a wall doesn’t seem to work very well in PvP).

If he is very well equipped with very high resistances (200’s or better) then the best advice is that posted above and writing a will. You will have next to no chance of landing any dots, roots, snares or debuffs on him and all you can do is use nukes which again are likely to be partially or fully resisted. Trying to melee him and hoping he dies to your DS might be your best bet, but I don’t really rate your chances very highly.

Palarran
07-09-2003, 05:09 AM
Well, dots should still be able to land, particularly immolation of ro after hand of ro. It would be very difficult to get unbuffed resists high enough to resist these with any regularity. Our magic based dots are pretty hard to resist too.
Immolation of Ro has the added benefit of having a very short cast time, especially with affliction haste.

Of course if he's smart he'll dispel the dots, and have buffs arranged so that the dots are the first things removed by dispel...he might use instaclickies to help prevent chain dispels from removing important buffs too.

sudawilde
07-09-2003, 06:27 AM
Make the fight as short as possible. The longer the ranger has to plink you with the bow the less chance you have to survive the situation. Use the debuff that is apropriate to your best DD and let loose with the wrath. Pray for a Crit nuke, it just might rattle the ranger long enough for you to finish the job.

Moving will cause a rangers bow damage to drop significantly (although i would try to resist the urge to kite) Perhaps limited movement depending on where the action takes place.

Get SotW lvl 1 very soon, the extra 1k heal can be so helpful.

Innate cammo is very nice to complicate a bow ranger if they dont have a see invis item equiped. Having your <targ> drop every 7 or 8 seconds is very frustrating.

It can be done, but you need lots of luck, plenty of skill and a decent amount of preparation.

iegil
07-09-2003, 08:40 AM
All out melee is the only way to go imo. Max out your damage shield and close to melee range with him
your hp should be within a thousand of his.

If he's got good resist gear, you'll be hard pressed to land anything painful on him. So do your best to melee, and heal yourself or dot him depending on your health when he stops to heal.

I dueled a level 65 warrior this way, he was using two scepters of destruction and he lost 6 times out of 6. I NEVER got a spell off due to the stun's/interrupts.

Unfortunately rangers and bards are very deadly in arena combat, I just don't bother when ones of similar power are in there.

gamilenka
07-09-2003, 02:03 PM
The space you have that is inside ranged weapon, but outside of melee is not very much...good luck with that if you are not used to pvp.

If you know he doesn't have high magic resist, then load the storm line, so you can stun him long enough to do anything. If you can dot him, then he can dot you and follow with a bow shot or two. I don't know about right now on all pvp servers, but you sure used to be able to do everything while blind. You could cast, melee, range, whatever. If you already have them targeted then it didn't matter. You just don't know if they are right in front of you or not. If you can land blind (think it's sunbeam), you strafe and stay behind them. Run behind a tree and hit hide.

Best bet is to stack whatever dot's you can on him. Keep a heal up for yourself, keep junk buffs on etc.

BricSummerthorne
07-18-2003, 02:33 PM
I hate dueling Rangers, I'd rather duel an SK. They are like Wizards who can melee. I agree with the poster that advised going to melee range.

The rangers I've dueled tend to have very fast weapons, like 18 or 22 delay. Damage shields rip them up badly, an epic ranger with a toxx axe in offhand is watching his health drop faster than yours. Of course he has more.

Your only hope is that after seeing the DS in action, the Ranger will try to get range and bow you. If he does, chase him. When you get in melee range, cast on him (fire dots are fast) to make him melee. Try to make him focus on meleeing you to death, by denying him bowshots.

You have two goals. One is to frustrate him when he tries to bow, make him think "grrr, stupid druid. I will just beat him down". Your second goal is to stay alive long enough to wedge yourself into a corner.

You can start casting a CH in a corner, run round for a bit, and the CH will land if you're back in the corner 10 seconds later.

Ideally, you want him chasing you during those 10 seconds, not bowing you. What has worked for me is to curse, like I'm about to go down. It's a head game, he has to believe he's closing in for the kill.

If you can get the CH off, you've probably beaten him. He will go into defense mode, avoiding your DS, and trying to bow you again. Chase him, cast a fast spell, keep chasing him, etc.

That strat has worked for me 3 times, but the people I fight don't crit for 4k 8o . Good luck to you.

SexyPortal
07-20-2003, 08:19 PM
I have two main problems fighting this particular Ranger. He has that crit ability & bow, and therefore will be VERY hard to beat if he gets far away from me.

Second, he knows me extremely well. We've teamed for over 4 years. He also knows my char. So tricks & headgames won't work on him. He's a very calm, and calculating player. Probably one of the best Rangers I've met. I doubt I could get him frustrated.

On the other hand, I do have some tools against him. There's the DS thing of course. When we fight together, nothing annoys him more than a mob with a DS. So getting in close and casting quick stun or root spells could work.

We would most likely fight in a zone like West Commons, where there is plenty of room for both of us to move, so that it's fun an challening for both. People may think that's a bad idea, considering such a large zone would give him advantages, BUT he can't shoot up hills, or around trees ;) I was thinking that I could bind on top of a hill, so that I can gate away from him if I'm in trouble. Then when he comes chasing me, he can't shoot me on the hill, while I can still cast on him. Once he gets to a level where he can use the bow, he'll be too close, and in melee range instead.

The DS and height restrictions for bows are the two things I know frustrate him the most. So I plan to use those against him.

Kenny Smith
07-22-2003, 11:57 PM
Another tip for ya is to mem SoCheetah. If yer fighting in a big zone like the commons then SoC might just buy you the time to get out of his way and get a heal in......if the ranger has a horse forget it, unless you have a horse too.

Stinging wort potions are allways a winner too for PvP ...some say its cheating but on a Zek server they are a way of life ;-)

<img src="http://www.btinternet.com/~woffski/sig1.gif" style="border:0;"/>

iegil
07-25-2003, 03:34 AM
He won't like you, but I stand with my original pincushion comments. I tore up an 8khp Warrior with dual Sceptres of Destruction 6 for 6 in the arena by standing there and letting him beat me.

I run 5khp self buffed which is where I was at. The last few times he ran in to the arena, he was hasted, with virtue and more. I never got a single spell off due to the bash, and stun proc's.

Spirit of the Wood 3, OWNS btw. Thats the only tactic that will beat the ranger in question. If its long range shooting like it is with a caster, the ranger will own you.

Eoghan007
07-29-2003, 01:15 AM
Anyone who dual weilds against a DS class deserves to die. Wait till that Windblade starts thumping you for 500 a wack and tell me you can outmelee a melee class.

For the real skinny, pile on the dots, and keep running.

And remember Bow Range > Spell Range.

Apocalypse Criterion
07-29-2003, 03:47 AM
Well you're pretty much screwed, in the time it will take you to get a nuke off he'll have fired 2 shots at you, using his Disc you're already dead at this point ;)

iegil
07-29-2003, 03:49 AM
Hoghan,
Use a windblade, I can cast. No stunning Proc on it. The poor melee dies faster as I can get any spell I want to off be it a heal or a nuke. And yes, the very pissed off melee with two SoD's went 2hs on me afterwards and lost 3 more times.

Melee's best bet is get one of them dispell lanterns that proc's pillage enchantment and give that 2-3 clicks to strip yah. Then melee. Most don't plan that far ahead and go. "I am Uber Melee. I can thump you leather classes bad." (Only when they have the advantage in gear)

vowelumos
07-29-2003, 10:39 AM
Just stay close to him for at least the first minute (Unless he does nto disc right away). After his disc goes without even being able to fire a single shot, he will get frustrated and switch to melee and he will die. If he goes 2hs you may have to heal a little. if pops on two swords you can just go make a sandwich, mabye come back before you get your chips and hit sotw.

If he pvps a lot, he might not fall into this trap, bust most will. Rangers can beat you if they are patient and well played.

If you ever lose to a Monk, Warrior, or Rogue.. You should hang up your pvp hat.


The funniest is getting a monk to chase you around and throw stuff at you, what is up with that.

CountessKrak
08-06-2003, 05:29 AM
Bow crit of 4K? Oh please. I have a 65 Druid and a 65 Ranger. The 65 Ranger has Archery Mastery 3 so you cant get any better than that. The biggest crit I have ever gotten is 1035 with no trueshot up and 1457 with Trueshot. I have been on raids in Plane of Time and never seen ANY ranger hit for more than 2K and these guys are the most uber in the game.

Alyster Weedgrowwer
08-15-2003, 10:42 AM
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>I have been on raids in Plane of Time and never seen ANY ranger hit for more than 2K and these guys are the most uber in the game.[/quote]

LIES!! :P

Rangers crit for over 2k+. Go to Rangers Glade and ask for highest crits..you'd be surprised what you saw.

Toe to Toe Melee is your best chance against a ranger. If they're dumb enough to use their fast 1hs weapons against you you'll own em. If they switch to 2h then you can use your spells to help. Ro's Illumination is a beautiful spell as it lowers atk (rangers/rogues hate that) plus I believe it also removes haste. I'm not absolutly positive on this but I'm pretty sure it does against PC's. I'll test tonight just to verify.

Palarran
08-15-2003, 11:13 AM
It looks like Ro's Illumination actually removes the Skin/Valor line of spells (but not the virtue line) due to the AC component. (It also removes a number of pet haste buffs due to the atk component...)

Hand of Ro should remove Visions of Grandeur, Vallon's Quickening, and Speed of Vallon but only because of the atk component. It also appears to remove Protection of the Wild because of the AC component, along with some other things specific to other classes. Lucy's stacking info is interesting. :)

BricSummerthorne
08-15-2003, 01:48 PM
is if they can pumice away our new curse-based DOTs.

Since Remove Curse exists, I'm thinking not.

Palarran
08-15-2003, 02:11 PM
On the other hand, unlike our other dots there's no resist advantage to that over using a fire based nuke, especially since the nuke can still partially land, I think. (In general all-or-nothing spells are fully resisted more often than spells that can be partially resisted, right? On an all-or-nothing spell, a partial resist becomes a full resist, not a full hit?)

Abru
08-18-2003, 08:26 PM
Rangers aren't as hard to beat as many say if your mana and hp regen are good. My guild's senior ranger attacked me when I was sitting around in the arena a little while ago, and I managed to beat him after 15 minutes or so. He has very good resists, so snare and root were out, however.

I couple times I dodged behind other players to avoid arrows, but mostly it was me chasing him, with him walking backwards trying to get more distance to shoot me; I'd only back off very briefly to reapply some spell. While I was on top of him, I hit 'a' since I was right there by him anyway most of the time. The damage I did with mele wasn't all that great, but every little bit helps.

I put free dots on him and tried to keep them on as much as possible, and my hohb scimtar really helped there since it has such a nice short cast time. I also tried to keep him somewhat fire debuffed for nuking, but made the mistake of almost nuking away too much mana right before he got lucky with some shots, and just barely had enough for healing.

What eventually won the match was when he got restless and meled me a little too much. I'd kept up a really high damage shield the whole time, and hoped he'd do just that. After that I got one good nuke off and he was toast.

If he hadn't gotten impatient, the duel might have gone on for an extremely long time, but I could see myself winning just on perseverance with the overall strat -- a good druid is very patient, yes? :p

Pherrot69
08-20-2003, 01:47 AM
well i play on TZ, so I pvp rangers all the time, and they are one of the most difficult classes to defeat, if they are using a 2h weapon. Even if they have a great bow, and are dual wielding, you can take them out NP... firstly, buff top 2 slots with insta clickies, JBoots, AoN, whatever, and refresh these if opponent tries to dispell...then buff to hell and put on a huge DS, shield of bracken, bracken coat, 10 ring, CDok ring clicky, and when your getting hit, SoTW...making a huge DS...well your probably saying...DS doesnt help if he is using his bow! well duh smarty boots, keep yourself inside bow range at all times, except when you stop to heal. IF he is using a 2h, your @#%$ outta luck, i say find a corner and cast out of it, and pray.

Pherrot

Kahlia Girlie
08-29-2003, 05:54 AM
I'm not sure how it works on the Zeks, but in /duel or in arena, the magic based druid dots used to be unresistable. Meaning you would 100% land drones of doom and swarm.

I haven't dueled since luclin though, so this may have changed, but it's worth checking. Most people at the time who I dueled didn't even know we could do that.

The Nerf
08-30-2003, 12:09 PM
Easy...

To kill a ranger just hug a wall. Arrows cant hit you when you stand next to a wall. Dont believe me try it out.

When you are pushing against a wall and moving arrows dont hit. Same thing on mobs for rangers too. Ever seen a ranger complain they cant hit a mob when it is pushed against a wall.

Dashiki Blackenbark
09-10-2003, 01:46 PM
Heres some advice from someone who plays PvP. I have over 200 days played on my druid on sullon and an epic ranger as well. 65 Ranger vs 65 Druid is all about who can outskill the other.

Use wrath of the wild a few minutes before the fight starts, the buff will last 30 minutes or so and has a 4 minute refresh. When you start the duel try to be in as close as possible so he starts off meleeing you. His first hit he will take 700ish damage (you should be fully buffed with po9 and sheild of bracken the bottom of your buffs). Imediately recast Wotw on yourself (make sure you target yourself!) and his second hit he will take another 700 plus damage. 1400 damage to begin the fight, plus if he is meleeing you it might be a good time to hit Sotw. With sotw3 and brackencoat/shield of bracken your DS should be 108 dmg per hit. Unless he turns of auto attack right away he will be sucking a lot of damage fast (if he is duel weilding) The best part is, the whole time you can be casting on him and getting him set up for the kill.

Start off with hand of ro. If he's smart and stacks his buffs he will leave the top slot open to dispell your WD/SD. Hand will take up that first slot and you can start in with SD/WD. The swarm series is hard to resist in PvP, I land on EP geared people with regularity. Having haste of mith item or mage ring plus a ceramic skull of decay or another affliction haste item will make your swarms cast in about 3 seconds. You filled his first slot with hand of ro so now you can bury your dots on him and start nuking. Use summers flame, you have already debuffed his Fire resist and druid nukes are highly resisted in PvP. Try to channel natures infusion and heal yourself if you get to 50%ish life.

If the fight has lasted this far you are in a good position to finish him off. He may be casting chloro on himself at this point to heal up some damage taken, just chain nuke with SF. Do not waste your time with Ro series DoTs, they are nearly always resisted even debuffed. Don't waste your time trying to cast magic based stuns on him either, same story. if this guy has nicest bow in the game Im sure his resists are all at least 200.

Good luck =)

Pherrot69
09-13-2003, 11:30 PM
cant cast hand of ro on a buffed 65 ranger, their lvl 65 self buff makes it so hand of ro doesnt stick, and if its burried gluck dispelling to get a hand of ro on....if you have a solution for this, other then dispell and pray id love to hear it.


And on PvP servers WD sticks about 75% of the time down to 50% against the higher lvl guild people who have 400+ MR (MR huge deal on TZ), SD is a tad better but not much.


Pherrot

Palarran
09-13-2003, 11:35 PM
Huh, you're right, it seems to be bugged in the same way that the 10th coldain ring blocks druid dots (and Manaetic Behemoth dots among other things).

A detrimental spell is always supposed to overwrite a beneficial one if there's a conflict.

CluelessDruid
09-15-2003, 01:02 PM
Hand of Ro is blocked by Warder's Protection, Protection of the Wild, and Cloak of the Akheva unfortunately due to some poor design. All three of these buffs have rules in there to block spells that effect AC on slot3. Unfortunately this is blocking our fire debuff (Ro's Fiery Sundering and Hand of Ro) line because it hits AC on slot3. (All per lucy)

Frankly I lost track how long this bug has been in there. A year or more? I used to feedback and bug this on nearly a daily basis and eventually just gave up. It's too much to ask that they would take feedback/bug seriously when there is intellegible information in there.

As far as smoking a 65 ranger goes. Hard to say really. It of course all depends on the individual. For every attack there is a counter and so on. Like was mentioned before . . if the person stacks and protects buffs reasonably then you are just not gonna get that buff.

Try chaining Nullify and Annul on the person. If they aren't quick you can slowly work into their buff order if they don't have enough clickables. Or you can get a hold of a couple golem wands and do the same. Still though any prudent ranger jumps on their horse and runs for it at that point in the hopes of losing you and rebuffing. If they like to dispel dots then you can try landing a cheapish dot then land dispel at the same time as they dispel themself. You can get into a good ole dispel/duck dance if they try to counter by ducking out the dispel at the last second.

If the person chooses to try and bow kite you nonstop then there are a few options. One is make them come to you. Go stuff your feet into a wall and see if you can block the arrows with that "feature." Another fun one is . . go stand on something to make the z-axis be too extreme for arrows . . like buildings or say a tree. Or go stand IN something. Little buildings or tents work well. If you're just being the aggressive druid and the ranger keeps running away bow kiting . . then you can use your horse particularly well if you have an amulet of necropotence. Just ride up to him or just past, stop autorun with your horse, then click your amulet and you've just stopped instantly. Cast immediately and you can get them most times.

If you have things like the MM sword then just make them live with that dot on. You can revolve your entire strategy around this dot for any battle that will last over 60 seconds. I’m guessing the Swarming Death orb would be similar, but I don’t have access to that just yet.

Rangers of course don’t have a lot going for them in the reverse section if the druid fights them effectively. Bows do hardly any real damage unless you both just stand still except with trueshot and even then I just ignore it unless they land a string of good hits. I.E. 400+ hits. Direct Damage spells are never as efficient manawise as heals and their manapool will be less effective. Their main form of damage can be blocked simply be using the terrain advantageously.

As with most classes though . . . how well they deal with their buff line and how good their resists are play a large factor into how tough an adversary they will be for druids.