View Full Forums : Enchanter Letter 11 OCT!! NEW!!


Nanyea The Wayward
10-16-2003, 06:40 PM
CLICK HERE! (http://www.therunes.net/forums/viewtopic.php?p=7755#7755)

Alot of good stuff in here, castersrealm is having a database error, so linked it to the other enchanter boards, please feel free to comment here or via pms or serverwide.enchanter... In most examples I used enchanters but feel free to translate that to druids and you will see the issues.

Noliniel
10-16-2003, 07:26 PM
No more levels thx. 65 levels is already enough. More levels and we will go solo zone bosses !!

Scirocco
10-16-2003, 07:53 PM
More levels and we will go solo zone bosses !!


Been there, done that.

Wyte
10-16-2003, 08:25 PM
Religion! - (whats the point?)

From a Karana following Druid point of view, I was seriously miffed at all the Tunare-Only quests in PoG. I then got my hopes up for PoP, thinking Karana's domain would give me some quests to even things out. But nooooo... he's trapped in some uber reverse dark mind meld. Zero Karana quests.

I didn't see that as being fair. In fact, I still don't. Best to just leave items as ALL/ALL vs. the disparity in expansions, IMO.

Wyte

Mappy Sassenfrass
10-16-2003, 11:34 PM
Please no more new levels. And, ABSOLUTELY no unique spell effects that are time or whatever restricted...ubers already have a huge edge on gear as it is.

I'm not crazy about the concept of elite classes, mostly because of the huge balance problems it would create. There already is specialization, and AA's allow players to customize their classes quite a bit (until they max out of course).

Hirelings...I dunno. Rent-a-tanks would be real bad for melee.

Enchanters don't really need any help at all in the pet department. We sure shouldn't have focus effects to give pets...that is what mages do. We don't have pet specific buffs, but then again, we can buff our pets pretty nicely just using our normal stuff. Charming in LDON is very do-able. Rarely do I have to wait too long to get a charmable mob, and in the meantime, I can just nuke and relax a bit. Direcharm? I dunno...adding mobs to a dungeon just so enchanters can direcharm them always seemed a bit cheesy to me. Anyone who ever put points into dire charm certainly has already reaped an appropriate benefit from it.

One thing I WOULD like to see...more types of instanced dungeon missions. More variety. Just off the top of my head, how about one involving a running battle, where you assist one side?

And something I would really, really agree with...yes. Allow us to SELECT the mission we want. Right away. Don't make someone sit there for 20 minutes declining random missions. My solution is simple: give the most adventure points for the mission types people pick the least.

I'm not sure about creating new zones...yah, it's fun to explore...but it splits up server populations more and more. Certainly, any new zones should be strictly level 65ish. I'd really be more in favor of revamping old, unutilized zones (not the cool ones-leave classic dungeons alone!)

Nanyea The Wayward
10-17-2003, 12:06 AM
mappy, about the direcharm... look at miraguls when you zone in... you see the green con spiders? animals? im saying there should be direcharm bait in each dungeon.

more of rent dps then rent a tank, would allow alot more flexibility in groups, and probly be really good for solo classes

as far as new levels... its going to happen, yeah leveling sucks, but you do it and then its done till a few expansions down the road

as far as the *edge that ubers have over casuals, besides manapool and a clicky dot, there really isnt a difference between a time enabled druid and a elemental druid, whereas the difference between a time warrior and a elemental warrior is glaringly obvious

Mappy Sassenfrass
10-17-2003, 12:32 AM
Those green cons are real weak...are those even worth dc'ing?

If the rented pets are for dps, and not as a tank...then it just flips it around. Now the wizards/rogues etc start hurting for groups. Not to mention all the "65 cleric lfg...have dps pet!" crap that you'd see. Dps is something that specific classes bring. It should more or less stay that way.

I'm not convinced that new levels are going to happen. And if we both agree that levelling sucks, then why add new levels at all?

Uber casters have many more advantages vs casuals. They have more flowing thought, better resists, are certain to have all their spells (not everyone else does!), better ac and hp, typically more aa, and focus items.

Take a 65 druid with FT 15, all the focus effects, a coupla thousand more hp and mana, a few hundred more ac, resists that are 100 higher base in everything, and 300 aa, and some clicky effects. Now take a 65 druid with FT 4, few or no focus effects, less hp ac mana and resists, perhaps 20 aa, and no clicky effects. You are going to find a WORLD of difference.

I dont think raiders/non-raiders need to be segregated any further in terms of effectiveness.

*edit* saw you were referring to time vs. elemental druids, as opposed to raider vs. non raider. I personally don't have an opinion on the difference in power of time vs. elemental casters. However, anything you add to a time enabled caster is gonna segregate THAT player further from a non-raider of course, so my point above remains the same.

gimli fan
10-17-2003, 12:56 PM
letter 10 was OK but this letter is very poorly concieved.

Your sympathy for melee has apparently broken down into a line of text, followed by you storing them in a bottle you can buy for a few K plat that you make from selling KEI to fellow mana users. (btw that you are already a pet class so you must know that this is in the game for zero pp already) Thanks, feels real great. Not to mention the real ideas for melee balance including the ideas you mention came from Monkly and no doubt Safe & Steel. (The Grove link is OK, but really just a small re-hashing, a link to the "who is most out of balance poll" is a better contribution from the Grove. Granted Monkly is a fairly weak board, but when they finally got a few threads going there were over a 100 posts of ideas including the "Final solution" aka giving up and just giving mana to pure melee.)

As for melee balance it is finally being generally adopted that the foolishness we are in is caused by selling out the power of folks that can only perform with their one trick pony in melee range via every mana class that can inflict and influence out of range. Right down to tanking and taking a break with root to heal up. Toss in BL which are being advertised as melee who want to be able to solo by Sony...WTF is up with that. I have no desire to hear anyone rant about that gotta be done for balance, turn the table tommorow and give solo ability and power to pure melee and relegate casters unable to function w/o pure melee and walk in those shoes first. Ala how about all mobs 51 and over summon people they should really hate and pet owners.


The other ideas are moderatly enveloped in crack smoke as well.

I do not mean to curb your enthusiasim (sp), please make # 12 a better letter.


(edit - some spelling)

gimli fan
10-17-2003, 12:58 PM
"Pedro is not that tired" --- that guy who used to manage for the Sox

Murias
10-17-2003, 01:08 PM
Please no more levels, please. More aa options, of course. But not real levels. The jump in power from 60 ro 65 was just insane, imo. To go even higher would just be unimaginable. I'd like to see some neato new spells added, but ya don't need to add levels to do that.


Dps is something that specific classes bring. It should more or less stay that way.

Wholeheartedly agree on this one.

Stormlin
10-17-2003, 02:03 PM
Can we not start the GD uber vs. casual crap here again? Please? For the love of the game or God or whatever?

Noliniel
10-17-2003, 03:49 PM
Just pointing out a few things. How can you be so sure that there will be more levels? SOE didn't say anything about it, we don't know it. So, we should hope for the best ! More levels will make alot of things unblanced, I am sure SOE is smart enough to see that. A rent dps/tank is not possible imo. SOE has been trying all along ( well least in the last few patches) to nerf soloing and duoing. We got the POP soloing xp nerf, the charm nerf, grouping xp goes up, no solo area in LDON etc... I could list many. Giving chanters or whatever class a rent dps/tank is really doing opposite of what SOE been doing for the past few months. I don't see it coming soon.

Stewwy
10-17-2003, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by Noliniel How can you be so sure that there will be more levels? SOE didn't say anything about it, we don't know it.

Nanyea knows things. Special secret things. She is an enchantress of many gifts. ;)

Kahlia
10-17-2003, 04:07 PM
I also vote for no more levels.

I cry inside everytime I think of how my beloved Emp Ssra has become weaker in comparison to the leveling of players from 60 to 65.

Vindler
10-19-2003, 03:23 PM
I'm not sure how I feel about new levels as I am still working towards 65 myself. I do however like the idea of elite class chars this would be similar to what they do with classes in AD&D (but there you pick your kit when the char is created). I'm pretty sure that it can be done by AA's and not new levels.


Vindler Stormraven
Lvl 62 Hierophant of Tunare
Realm of Valor
Mith Marr

Kulothar
10-20-2003, 10:02 AM
I agree with the NO MORE LEVELS but I really like the Idea of diety based quest as an alterative for role players.

I do think EVERY diety should have a set of quest like the Tunare quests out of Felwith plus higher level ones like the PoG ones. Even though I worship Tunare, I was overjoyed to see that they started to put Karana quest in Surefire.. but they didn't do low level ones or high level ones.. They did the lv 47+ (PoH) one for each class which gives a good item but all dieties should offer comprable quests and items for the entire progression of the character from lv 1 - lv 65. All dieties should have quest or there should be no dieties established since you can just modify your factions.

Sorry but as a long time quester (4+ yrs) they still make me mad with broken quest and a lack of integration of quests and rewards into the game. Otherwise just take them out and call it EverCamp.

The augments are a step in customizing as were the AA but the impementation always leaves something to be desired. I prefer the AA and Augments to additonal levels and if they added PoP augments and augmentable items off mobs it would probably make more sence to be Time or Elemental raid level.

They can improve the specialization of each class without generalizing them all or nerfing them. I just get tired of having nerfs called balancing.

Cantatus
10-20-2003, 10:26 AM
More Levels: While I'm fearful that the addition of any levels or AAs might throw classes out of balance even further, I see the necessity in doing so. Right now I'm 65 and have nearly all the AAs I want. It's getting to the point where I have nothing to earn exp anymore. While I'm sure I'm not an example of the norm, this will become more and more common overtime.

Multistep Instancing - I'd really love something like this. It would be neat to get an adventure that spans several zones and has several different goals. I'd like it where it gets progressively harder as you go on so you won't be able to complete the multiple zone instances. They could even have it span over multiple themes if they wanted.

Religion: I could be surprised, but I doubt religions is anything that'll be touched anytime soon unless they add a way to change religions. Religions have never had much of a use in the game and more than 50% of people are Agnostic for obvious reasons. It would be unfair to add benefits after the fact in my opinion.

Hirelings: This would trivialize a lot of content and provide further unbalance in my opinion.

Yakk
10-20-2003, 01:56 PM
Subzone instancing.

A large dungeon, which is shared (or psuedo-shared, ie a max pop of 24-60), which you fight through in order to get to your instance.

To put it forward as a grand vision:
Imagine if they added a large underworld benieth norrath, with dozens of zones of twisted corridors. Deep in these zones are doors to dungeon instances. Toss in a (real life) timer preventing you from using the same instance twice in a day, and we'd have shared paths between private adventure instances.

Nanyea The Wayward
10-20-2003, 03:25 PM
In reference to hirelings..

I play SWG alot now it seems, and Im a rebel so finally decided to hire some troops.

I hired a heavy weapons expert has about 4 times the health of me and deals out about the same level of damage (he shoots faster i hit a lil harder). It took me about 4 hours to save up the faction points to buy this hireling.

I understand this would trivialize alot of content, and the rogues got a lil jumpy because i suggested a DPS hiring, vs one that heals or whatnot; but it is an interesting idea nonetheless, and that is the point of this letter, to bring up new ideas and provide a place for people to discuss those ideas or bring up others. (no unlike what sko thinks its not just a flame fest, but they wont read anything there unless they can flame)

I really do like the idea of elite classes, but maybe take that a step further.

I assume EQ2 will use a skill/class tree similar to swg (from what ive read of it) but perhaps you could set a new set of general AAs but limit how many you could buy from that particular tab, this would give everyone equal access to it, but allow customization within a limit so people would have to make good choices to create the unique character that they want.