View Full Forums : good bye EQ! i'm off to the races...


harvey the dog
01-21-2004, 11:56 AM
Dear Everquest:

I started playing shortly after beta, about 2-3 days after the whole shebang went live and everything was good. I loved romping through the world and marveled at the size of those big hill giants compared to my little halfling druid’s diminutive stature. The awe of that first run from Rivervale to Freeport will likely be the one point in gaming that will always be with me. The world really was amazing...

When fun things were happening in the world, like the corruption of the Karanas, and when Kithicor suddenly went evil at night, it was all good. Even the few GM events that would crop up from time to time made it worth logging in after work or school just to see if anything fun was going on.

And then, the expansion...Kunark was the point that I began to realize that things weren't going in exactly the direction that I had hoped. The first raid sized encounters began to REALLY show up, not including Naggy and Vox from the old world, and the size of your GUILD began to matter. The pick up raids on those old world dragons were no longer going to be the way of things to come. The chaos of a zerg squad rushing a flame and fear breathing dragon became a thing of the past. And that rare in-game rush of adrenalin went the way of the dodo, as people began to form guilds with the express intent of taking down raid targets for more than just the rush of it, but for "uber lootz" and bragging rights.

And when Velious came out, the transformation was complete. The UBER guild was born, and the non-raid players like me found out that even though the virtual continent of Velious was covered with ice and snow, the cold we were all left out in was a LOT more real. Suddenly after well over a year of playing in groups with a few friends, or taking down a mob solo using tactics developed over the previous years game play, those of us that chose the casual guild route found that there was little to be had, other than a mediocre improvement in gear. The writing was on the wall and we were suddenly faced with the option of either joining a raiding guild, or having little left in this new world worth conquering.

Of course, Luclin and the Planes of Power just cemented the deal and created a bigger and bigger gulf between those that chose to raid and those that chose not to. It wasn't about play time or commitment anymore, as even though I never got involved in a raid oriented guild, I still played a LOT. I knew my class better than MANY I had seen running around with the biggest and best gear. But alas, the quest in Everquest was no longer alive. Suddenly the game had become EverRaid.

and even those that claim that there was content for those that didn't wish to spend their time raiding, that content was still trivial to those that did, allowing raiders the ability to cruise through content in record time, while the non-raiders found themselves just plugging away and hoping that a future expansion would come out that would allow them some way to remain competitive with raiders, despite their different playing styles.

So now, I am leaving the world of EQ forever. After over 4 years of playing, my little halfling feet are sore and this dusty tome of my spell book will be put on the shelf forever. Never again will I open my trusty spell book to memorize a line of buffs or dots. nor will I be shrugging into the familiar chestguard of woven grass, and instead, it will be stored away with the rest of my gear to collect dust while I spend the twilight of my little halfling life smoking, drinking, and fondly remembering the days gone by when the world had seemed so big, and the possibilities endless.

Fare thee well, my fellow druids!

- Halfling Druid of Karana who wishes to retire in anonymity.

Jinjre
01-21-2004, 12:20 PM
Well put.

I, too, am a casual style player. I too have recently decided that the game is no longer designed or meant for the small family guild who simply wants to go have some fun.

Jinjre will retire at the end of this month, to the aviak isle in OOT, where one of her best friends is also sitting atop a rock, watching the sun rise and set in his retirement.

Panamah
01-21-2004, 12:29 PM
Nicely said!

Araxx Darkroot
01-21-2004, 02:48 PM
/salute
Welcome to the Real World :)

Panamah
01-21-2004, 03:35 PM
We should have little buttons to wear on our lapels. Maybe a circle with a red X going through our character's picture.

harvey the dog
01-21-2004, 03:53 PM
or even if Sony introducted a graveyard zone where you could have a tombstone placed with your alts name, dates played, and level and stuff like that...although i would imagine that the LAST thing Sony would want is a way for everyone still playing the game to realize how many people have quit. i just wish i had made this decision a couple years ago...but for some stupid reason, expansion after expansion, i just kept slamming my head against the wall and buying the crapola about how THIS expansions would make things different for the non-raiding players.

now i am just looking forward to World of Warcraft. One thing for sure about Blizzard, they have a proven track record for keeping things fun for a LONG time. plus, after Everquest, Blizzard can use the Sony Customer Service model on what NOT to do with support for a MMORPG.

well, anywho...you all take it easy and hope to see (some of) you in WOW.

- now retired halfling druid.

LauranCoromell
01-21-2004, 06:13 PM
Best wishes for a happy retirement! Enjoy all of that extra time :).

Panamah
01-21-2004, 08:00 PM
Hmmm... maybe we should have EQ memorial web site where everyone lists their main character who has quit the game. And you look out and see rows and rows of gravestones...

Cloudien
01-22-2004, 02:23 PM
Yes... a good rant, and right on the money.

I've witnessed a few guilds dying through huge arguments and good friends split up as enemies... sure enough, each one of them was about differences in opinion regarding raiding commitments.

Aly
01-24-2004, 12:55 PM
If that's the case I will laugh and bid you farewell. If not then I would like to hear suggestions to make this game more casual friendly.

Take your lame arse trolling elsewhere Autumn. The game should be fun for everyone. Creating such a distinct and near impervious wall between two groups in the game is wrong. I only hope you stay in EQ and never set foot in EQ2. I don't want to listen to your pathetic mewling about that game either.

Harvey: Good luck and I'll see you in WoW for at least the first month. Hope you find the content you're looking for.

Kopper
01-24-2004, 03:38 PM
The game should be fun for everyone.

You mean the game should be fun for you?

Don't worry, EQ2 will have its ubers and people who commit more time and effort to the game than you will. So, I doubt we are done with this mindless drivel about distinctions. If it won't, then it won't have challenge and it will be pretty empty place to be. That most certainly is not what SOE wants.

Oh well, world would be such a dull place without jealousy.

harvey the dog
01-25-2004, 01:31 AM
well, as i have loved the game for years, i can't just cut it out cold turkey, so i still come here from time to time just to see what's going on.

autumn. i think you misunderstood the spirit of my original post. i am under no illusion that anyone should cater to just me. but the fact of the matter is, EQ kept me well engaged even though i WASN'T UBER. i was just you standard EQ dude, well known for being a VERY GOOD DRUID...but rather anti-boring. even though all these things were wrong with the game...


I can sympathize if it's due to being tired of the game. For example: the experience grind, the camping, the ks'ing and/or training from other people, the customer service, the horrible design decisions, the unbalance of classes, and so on...but what do you really expect as a casual player?


i still very much enjoyed the heck out of it for a long time. but, then a lot of things changed, and as Aly said...


Creating such a distinct and near impervious wall between two groups in the game is wrong


Autumn, you enjoyed the game one way, as did many others, but there were a surprising number of people who believe as Aly and I do...that the direction the game went drove a spike right through the middle of the community. /shrug. worked for some, but for others, no dice.

for you Autumn, perhaps the list of issues you laid down might be important to someone on a schedule, but i wasn't on a schedule. i signed up for everQUEST. i was just there to have fun and the end game, for people like me, wasn't that much fun.

i will probably keep coming to the grove for years to come, but i am most definitely done with Norrath.

peace out...

- Halfling Druid of Karana who wishes to retire in anonymity.

Aly
01-25-2004, 10:59 AM
If it won't, then it won't have challenge and it will be pretty empty place to be. That most certainly is not what SOE wants. Oh well, world would be such a dull place without jealousy.

I'm not jealous of their gear. I could care less about it. The only reason I give a damn about gear is when it's required for encounters. I guess you could say I'm jealous about the attention given to the goobers. The pretty much exclusive rights to the storyline. You can design a game that's challenging and accessible to everyone. Personally, I don't consider timesinks challenging. That's pretty much all that seperates the goobers from everyone else. That and the motivation to grind through those time sinks.

I came back to EQ, but I was still bored with my rogue. And decided to see what I could do with my cleric. I'm currently having a blast playing my cleric thanks to some twinked gear and a determination to do anything but sit on my arse and heal. I get up and melee, pull, tank, crowd control, and nuke. It's fun and it's been challenging at times. I'm sure however, that as the levels increase and it gets to be a grind again... I'll quit. Especially since at the end game, there's nothing accessible to me, that will propel the storyline.

If you're going to make an RPG, make the storyline accessible to everyone in the game. Not just a small percentage of the population and everyone else has to read about it on some curse filled website.

well, as i have loved the game for years, i can't just cut it out cold turkey, so i still come here from time to time just to see what's going on.

Same here. I've taken a couple five month breaks from EQ to try out other games, but I just can't get into them like I did EQ. Even despite better gameplay on some of the other games.

Scirocco
01-25-2004, 11:16 AM
Chill, people. If you want to engage in the umpteenth-million debate over this particular dead horse, go right ahead, but keep it clean.

Panamah
01-25-2004, 02:21 PM
You're in good company, Harvey. Coray, the writer for MobHunter, just announced his retirement from EQ.

Darlyn
01-25-2004, 04:25 PM
Good luck Harvey!!

Jinjre
01-25-2004, 05:31 PM
Today marked my final day in EQ as well. It was a good run.

Aly
01-25-2004, 10:42 PM
I believe you are indeed jealous of the gear Aly that the so-called 'ubers' have and you constantly attack anyone that you view as being such just because they actually put forth more effort than you to get that gear. You want everything handed to you, period.

Again, Autumn, you really need to find that program called Hooked on Phonics. You obviously have a severe lack of reading comprehension. I don't give a damn about gear except where it's required for the content. My rogue was happily puttering away in tae ew armor with rage and naraithus for weapons. The problem I have is the way the end game and storyline is designed. The storyline should be accessible to everyone in the game. Not just a small portion of the population of the game that have far too much time on their hands. Let those people who have that time on their hands finish the content too. They'll just finish it much faster than everyone else. The way it's currently designed, there are things you just cannot do without a massive amount of time wasted on the game. It's not fair to the people that enjoy the other aspects of the game, but can't put that kind of time into it in one sitting. It's not fair to create parts of the game that are inaccessible to everyone.

People like Harvey are perfect examples of what's wrong with the game. There gets to be a point where there's just nothing left for you to do. You never get to feel like you're really a part of the world. You never get to experience the major storyline, except secondhand. That kind of game design is wrong and you're blatantly ignorant yourself if you keep professing that there's nothing wrong with.

Because of the way they designed EQ you get stupid arguments like this. The problem is people like you just accept what's given to you. You roll over like a coward and then run with your tail between your legs. EQ could have been better than this, but goobers and pacifistic players turned it into a steaming pile of crap. The players had their chance once Kunark came out, to show the developers they didn't want an end game like what it is now, but the silent majority let the greedy goobers forge ahead and well, this is how EQ came to be.

You should really stop putting your foot into your mouth Autumn. And stop putting words into my mouth. I have never, ever said I wanted gear / xp handed to me. Never. You will never find that on any message board anywhere. Never. Got that finally? You seem to have a problem understanding that.

I have said multiple times I do not agree with the timesinks and the stratification of the players. That is what I do not like in the game. That is what I have said many, many times. And you continue to try and twist it to your own pathetic end. The game could have been designed to be accessible for everyone and not just the people that have tons of time to play. If you can't log on for a couple hours a night, a few nights a week, and get something meaningful done aside from grinding out some xp, there's something wrong with the game.

Too many people just ignore that fact and you are one of them. LDoN has helped a lot in that regard, but the points you get per adventure are ridiculous compared to the amount you need to get comparable gear and the effort it often takes in putting together a group for LDoN. LDoN also proves you can create challenging content that doesn't take forever and a day to complete. There should never be zones that require more than four hours to clear. PoSky is a perfect example of the absolute worst zone/encounter design.

Vex Thal is another great exmaple of horrible, absoballylutely horrific zone/encounter design. Can you really say you had fun mashing the same buttons over and over on the same mob for 15, 20, 25, or even 30 minutes or longer? The outcome of a battle should be decided within the first 30 seconds and require excellent teamwork and effort from everyone present. Xegony is a 40 minute fight. That's boring. Regardless of any adds, killing the same mob for 40 minutes is BORING. I can think of plenty of other ways to make a 40 minute encounter that's fun for everyone. Not just a 40 minute mindless cheal chain. The 15 minute Coirnav encounter sounds fun. 75 mobs, 3 named, and finally Coirnav. That is a good encounter from what I've heard. Now if they could just get rid of the zone lag cheat to get around the 15 minute limit.

It's going to be different for each person Autumn. I just want to feel like I am taking part in a story. That's the reason I play roleplaying games. Reading about some other guilds accomplishments doesn't do crap for me. However, I don't think being forced to raid almost every night for hours at a time, giving up account info so your character can be botted, or giving up real life info so you can be called into a raid, etc. is not worth the storyline. I want to be able to gather friends and guildmates and go kill stuff in a reasonable amount of time with a reasonable amount of people that propels the storyline for the game. There's plenty of things in EQ that I'd love to change, but most people in the game are too cowardly, near-sighted and selfish to accept those changes. Maybe someday I'll win the lottery and prove you wrong. Especially you Autumn.

Today marked my final day in EQ as well. It was a good run.

Hope you enjoyed your time in Norrath.

Feldaran
01-25-2004, 10:59 PM
As every MMORPG has proven so far, you can't write big tales of adventure for part time adventures while at the same time doing the same for people who devote a lot more time to the game. Not everyone can be the "hero" in these games.

Its just one of those things.

Panamah
01-25-2004, 11:22 PM
Don't be a stranger, Jinjre. Stay and play "wait for something better to come along" with the rest of us. :p

Jinjre
01-26-2004, 12:27 AM
I plan on hanging around these boards. For the most part, the people here are intelligent and have interesting conversations. For the few who aren't or don't, well, that's what that lovely ignore feature is for!

Love ya Rahjer (et al) :cheers:

Aly
01-26-2004, 01:36 AM
Not everyone can be the "hero" in these games. Its just one of those things.

To use one of Autumn's favorite smilies... :bs:

You can design the game so everyone gets to be the hero. Just someone gets to be the hero first and fastest. *shrugs* Does it really matter to you that much if you're the only people that get to do the storyline? Are all the goobers that selfish, that they want all that great text and such all to themselves?

I bet a lot more people would continue to play EQ if they could experience the whole game, and not just part of it.

Kopper
01-26-2004, 02:30 AM
AC2 tried to be casual-friendly.

Didn't work too well.

Aly
01-26-2004, 10:22 AM
From what I hear, it was a lack of content that killed AC2. Wasn't it supposed to try and push players into making their own quests/content or something? I never tried AC or AC2. Just heard about them from friends.

Regnon
01-26-2004, 10:29 AM
If you're going to make an RPG, make the storyline accessible to everyone in the game. Not just a small percentage of the population and everyone else has to read about it on some curse filled website.

.

I dont know how many RPG's you ever played, and I am really not trying to flame here. But in ANY RPG you have progression.

DnD 1, 2, 3 , Nobody started out slaying the dragon at lvl 1.

Final Fantasy 1-11 You couldnt kill Seperoth at lvl 1.

Dragon Warrior, you needed the Crystal Sword Baby...


Basicly what it seems to me what you want, is that everyone can do everyting in the game without any progression. Wich is bull.

Even in Mythology you see Hero's going through great quest and hard Tasks to slay their enemy or find the Treasure. NObody goes, Hey conan, let me give you this awesome sword and armor so you can kill Thulsa Doom.

Jinjre
01-26-2004, 11:03 AM
Basicly what it seems to me what you want, is that everyone can do everyting in the game without any progression. Wich is bull.

This is not what I want, and of course I can only speak for myself. It is also not about gear, as others have suggested. It is about opportunity.

In EQ, I am not given the opportunity to go try these things, simply because I don't have the hours upon hours to put into the time sink to get the keys/flags whatevers. Yet I pay the same as everyone else.

I have left EQ because sony has told me that unless I spend obscene quantities of time in their time sinks, I will not be able to see parts of the game I paid for and continuing paying for. I paid for the maintenance of the VP, VT, elemental, time zones. I have not ever seen the inside of them. I will not ever see the inside of them. I paid for the expansion, I paid for continual maintance to them. I paid the devs to fix bugs in zones I could not access. Of course, they have not fixed the bug that made my poor ogress warrior wear her helmet as a bp on her shoulder, which I had been petitioning for roughly 2 years now.

I'd like the opportunity to zone into VT with a group of my friends and have my butt handed to me on a platter if that's the case. Or possibly, quite possibly given our track record of taking out mobs "you don't have enough people for", we would be successful. I'm not looking for things to be handed to me. I want to receive what I paid for. Plain and simple. I wouldn't buy a car where the AC/heater only worked if I logged 100k miles a year or more, especially if you couldn't get the car without the AC/heater and you still had to pay for it even if you couldn't use it. I'd go look for a different car.

So to those of you who believe that the casuals who have left the game over these issues: if you want to continue to believe that we all secretly want to be just like you and have gear envy, you can continue to do that since it makes you feel so superior. You are wrong in believing that, but if you view it any other way, then you can't feel superior, so what's the point.

And now a reminder from your local station: this is a thread about Harvey the Dog leaving EQ. I'm taking a wild guess that having yet one more uber vs casual screaming match isn't going to make him miss the game more. I know it sure isn't making me miss it more.

Say good bye to Harvey and whoever else you might want to say good bye to here. And if you can't say something nice to him when he's leaving, don't say anything at all.

harvey the dog
01-26-2004, 11:14 AM
I am not sure how this happened, but somewhere along the line here, my fare-thee-well to everquest turned into a raid vs. non-raid thread. This was not my intention. All I wanted to do was to wish all a goodbye.

For those of you that are or were raiders, congratulations! Much like our cleric and enchanter brothers, YOU ARE THE WINNER! They picked the right classes, and you picked the right (only) play style that allowed you enjoyable content once you had dinged 65! WOOT TO YOU!!!

Please stop turning this into a debate. I left because the game for me had turned into no fun and no progress for my toon. This isn't debatable. It's a FACT. You don't agree with my reasons for leaving? Then how about you just don't read the post.

But just cause it made me laugh...


Basicly what it seems to me what you want, is that everyone can do everyting in the game without any progression. Wich is bull.

Even in Mythology you see Hero's going through great quest and hard Tasks to slay their enemy or find the Treasure. NObody goes, Hey conan, let me give you this awesome sword and armor so you can kill Thulsa Doom.


I must have missed the part in the Conan "mythology" where an army of 71 other people said, "Hey Conan! Come with us and we will go kill a GOD!!! All you have to do is start swinging that sword of yours and we'll wake you up in an hour after we finally kill it. oh, and UberGoober#17 has more raid points than you, so you're just going to have to wait to replace your "Leather Shirt of Muscle Flexing" till you have helped us kill that SAME FRIGGIN GOD 40 MORE TIMES."

Oh, and spell check is your FRIEND. A grammar lesson wouldn't hurt either. And Conan doesn’t show up in any mythology that I have ever heard of…last I checked, Conan was created in FICTION novels and comic books. But don't worry Regnon...your post indicates that you don't bother (know how?!?!) to read, so I guess it's not really a suprise that you assumed that Conan the Comic Book Hero and Movie Star came from Mythology somewhere.

I have no problem with working for something. Or Questing for it (hence the name everQUEST). I have a problem with a game that is one thing for the first half of its lifetime, then turning into something that was neither expected nor advertised for the second half of its life. A game like this should offer progression to EVERYONE and not create a select group of players that end up with all the loot, all the plat, and all the fun.

raiders - have fun with the game and keep up the grind and PLEASE STAY AWAY FROM WOW. Everquest is ALL YOURS!

Kopper
01-26-2004, 11:25 AM
Problem with people is that they think simply because they pay same as everyone else, they deserve everything in the game regardless of how they choose to play the game. Then the game is badly designed because it doesn't cater to personal whims.

I wonder if they also call single-player game manufacturers how they need the game changed because they don't want to play it the way it was designed to be played.

Chenier
01-26-2004, 11:35 AM
Dammit children, shut the hell up, mmkay?

If you two wanna compare the size of your dicks, go do it somewhere else. We are tired of it (because hi, they're small and we don't care).

Best of luck to those of you retiring - you can retire from the game, just please stay here and entertain those of us still chained inside!