Ya, I know it's been talked about but now that I have been touched on the shoulder shown what can happen, I've changed my mind about mana burn.

I don't think it should work on Ragefire or Kunark Dragons. Six mana burning wizards scared the Hell out of my guild raid of 28 odd peeps buffing to do our 1st Ragefire. We rushed it and barely got it done, but the uneasy feeling of sharks in the water that you know would eat RF for lunch didn't go lost any of us. No offense to hard working Wizards that put in the time but there is no way 1 wizard should equal 7 or 8 Druids.

Where was the thought of carefully testing caster balance when that when in? Yea, 5 Wizards can kill 1 Kunark dragon - that sounds about right. Nobody can convince me otherwise - too many peeps at VI had to look the otherway to miss this gaff.

Remember back in the day when the big dog on the block was Vox, and it was equal for Druids and Wizards since Ice Comet wouldn't stick?

Lotharun

Since, according to a druid, 1 wizard seems to equal 7 or 8 druids, this is a pretty strong argument to never again team up with a druid. Thanks for the info

doh!

/bonk Lotharun

Should Mana Burn be mmmm changed?


Probably not. Don't have much of a problem with it.

Etelka,

In defense of the original poster,,,there are squads(one/two guilds inparticular) on the server that are making a habit of this practice.

It is frustrating and irritating.

Changed my mind, nerf the fuqing pointy hats.

I don't need to be popular or hold back on this. That's why I posted this in rant. rtfm knows what I'm talking about and is dead on about why I posted this.

bonk all you want and yeah, it likely won't be fixed. Doesn't mean that it's balanced...cuz it isn't. It was a short sighted implementation. I still wonder what was going through their minds...

Hey, I was one of those who cheered our wizard friends for getting such a cool ability until I saw it's dark side. Make no mistake -- it unbalances encounters and nearly screwed my everybitashardworking guildmates along the way.

dems da facts

Lotharun

CH is just as unblancing in many ways. But in your favour. Manaburn isn't. You chose to rant Manaburn.

Hmm....

Manaburn is ridiculous and AE groups are riduculous. I was only happy to see they ended the AE exploit in acrylia.

"CH is just as unblancing in many ways. But in your favour. "


How's that? I hate CH and think it's a joke too. I think it never should have been a full heal. Bah. You know not of what I think. You can but guess or assume.

Lotharun

people who say AE groups are ridiculous either:

1. have never done one, and dont know the dangers involved, or
2. agree with verant that melee zerging is 'tactic' and anything else is 'exploit'.

narrowminded, either way. AE nerf is bad bad bad bad bad.

Xican,

Maybe you did not understand his post, though his title may have misled you.

He was 'ranting' the fuqing roaming bands of hooligan MB wizards that KS already spoken-for Epic mobs and dragons. He was just too reserved to actually say so.

Maybe on your server, 6 Clerics can KS Rage, on ours, they can't. Or at least I have never heard of such a thing.



There is a vendor in EC, she's an Erudite, sells batwings and *clues*. Suggest you go buy one.

I know what you mean and agree that it's BS..but most likely Verant won't do crap. We had 2 or 3 MB wizzies try to gimp Gore from my guild as we engaged her but luckily she killed them before they could kill her. One of the wizards involved WAS my friend until then. He got mad that they didn't KS us and sent harassing tells to me and most of my guild..it was pretty damn funny...had they managed to KS it wouldn't be so funny...and RF? That comes down to who has the better KS group/most MB wizzies..unfair? yes IMO..Verant to do anything? Doubt it. :\

I hate when I make statements so god damn vague, and even a tad misleading, and I end up defending myself. But, damned if I don't love making them!

"You know not of what I think. You can but guess or assume."

- I never did. I simply provided a little aid for others to do so. I'm too lazy to assume about things I couldn't care less for. Fact is I felt like picking a fight, since I can only bash PoTC so many times, on so many boards.

"He was 'ranting' the fuqing roaming bands of hooligan MB wizards that KS already spoken-for Epic mobs and dragons. He was just too reserved to actually say so."

- Two instant thoughts, here. First: Why not just come out and say so? In fact, why not bust their chops' on your server boards, if you have them, if not, create one for the sole purpose of busting MB wizzie's chops'. Second: spoken-for Epic mobs!? Since when is anything in EQ spoken-for? I understand many servers have reservations and such, but even then, it's not like they're doing anything wrong, unless they MB during a raid, not while the raid preps, not while they gather forces, but during the fight...And how "bands" of MB capable wizzies got 60 and god knows how many AA points with that level of intellect is beyond me...

I'm an advocate of the "Kill it if it's there, and nobody else is." theory. I hate reservations, ('cept planes) and I hate people that think because they sat around for 20 hours waiting for something, they have the right to sit around for another 4 hours, gathering, prepping, and killing something. So, when I hear "Band of hooligans" it translates to: They beat us to the punch, they're assholes. I don't think it's very commendable, but that's life.

"Maybe on your server, 6 Clerics can KS Rage, on ours, they can't. Or at least I have never heard of such a thing."

- Hehe, on my current server...6 cleric's just might be able to. Cleric's are a dime a dozen, and everyone loves them. 6 Cleric's on my server could have 40 people in SF simply from a /who 55 60 all. Everyone would drop their new born baby to help a rez bitch.

"There is a vendor in EC, she's an Erudite, sells batwings and *clues*. Suggest you go buy one."

- I need a clue? For pointing out 2 facts? I need a clue because I don't care to know the ins-and-outs of your server, nor care to investigate the @#%$-footing of the original ranter, who couldn't step up and point out the people he was mad at? I need a clue because I made a minor implication, which in no way neccessarily represented my thoughts, views, or opinions on the matter?

I made that post for one reason. I felt like picking a fight I couldn't possibly lose. I simply hinted at something, and you jumped up to defence. I gave you a reason to do so, and like a little lap dog without a mind of your own you went at me head on.

In hindsight, I appologise. I was in a bad mood, and pretty bored. I got banned from my server's rant board for letting someone bait me in to a simlar situation, so this was the place to take out aggression. My appologies, and for the record, I think your rant on @#%$ MB capable Wizzie's is totally justified, but beating around the bush is no way to go about it.

Oh, and that Erude chick is on Freeport Militia faction, she hates my @#%$. You'll have to buy that clue for me RTFM.

I've done AE groups too and they are safe and they are an exploit. Don't give me that crap about how they are dangerous LOL. So you die a few times. You still got 1 full AXP point in an evening and 5kpp.

What your 6 clerics gonna do, click Rage to death?

Oh btw, Weeeee boy, RE: Loth
Believe me, he does not need me to be his lap dog nor come to his defense. He had "kid-gloves" on, was my only point.

After today, mine are not, unless/until I get punnished(sic) with bannishment(sic) from the mods.

The old rtfm is back.

To the original question...manaburn is stupidly overpowered. Each encounter now all depends on how many manaburn wizards you have. You can kill Kunark dragons with 6 wizards. That's overpowered any way you look at it.

If wizzies are KS'ing rage, I have to say I got a problem. Only doing it for the loot? Gotta be. Maybe there was a cleric of theirs lurking but it is pretty @#%$. I think the MB as it currently stands is a sploit, but I am hoping that the outcome is that other classes get powered UP rather than wizzies get powered down. THEN what happens is the mobs get more HP, and the days of Wizard hooligans are in the past.

Fine wizzies are the most powerful nukers. They should not be 8 to 12 times more powerful than any other nuker. If you add up the damage melee are doing MB can put a wizzie more in the ballpark of melee in terms of doing damage, and taking that away means ALL the casters continue to be t*ts on the bull at a raid.

It is a bit of a shell game tho. If they make all the nukers stronger nukers, then adjust the mobs so they are harder to kill, suddenly we are right back where we started. I am sure VI knows this but having a single caster class so vastly more powerful than the other nuking classes ... it ain't right.

And no I am not whining to nuke like a wizard. I think this situation must be far more frustrating for Necros and Mages than it is for us.

I DO believe this will be fixed ... somehow... in caster balance.

I think Manaburn is right on par with where Wizzie's should be... They never really were "Damage Dealers" Pre-Luclin their best nuke was what? 1600 dmg? Well, Druid best nuke was 1024? Wizzie's are meant to be insane direct damage casters, it's all they bring to a raid/group. I personally think they should get some bigger nukes, maybe with ancient spells. But frankly, I LOVE the way manaburn works. Sure there is "hooligans" running around killing stuff, but ask yourself this: If you had a MB capable Wizard, and 5 friends all MB capable, and saw Gore up, nobody attempting her, would you drop some dragon @#%$? I know I would, and frankly, I doubt anyone has the conviction to say they wouldn't.

I'd like to see Manaburn restricted to certain ways so that it couldn't be used in such a manner. Perhaps...Hmm...Removing the 32k limit on K-Dragons? That was possibly the stupidest idea in the first place. Although, if they didn't change it...Who cares? There's surprising risk in MB killing a dwagon....Well, unless one of da Wizzie's has Exodus. ;)

Yea yeah! and nerf quadkiting too!
-Sylvanos

I hardly think wizards were not bringing anything to the party pre luclin. The kunark solution to the old problem was that wizards were the only ones with lures. Most frustrating stage verant went through cuz instead of having little contribution there are places where Necros, Druids and Mages have none...or have to fall back on secondary skills.

Next they added the bigger lures for dragons and giants with Vel...that made sense in that line. Much much buffer than druids but honestly I don't htink that 1600 to 1000 is a bad ratio to ahve favored wizzies with.

Wizzies also have the better port skills by far. They were always the ones to get you to Hate and PoA, but then TL came along and the utility role shifted entirely to them (be honest none of us really miss the ports after raids).

Did the wizzy anti gate spells ever get implemented? That was another Verant idea to beef up the wizzie. They also got a great snare so they then became just about as powerful as druids solowise (well more powerful, but less ability to protect and heal themselves).

Don't get me wrong. I don't have aproblem with wizzies having manaburn or any of these other skills. I look at this all as a guild member and what they contribute to my guilds raids is all to the collective good. I just don't think they can be THAT much more powerful than everyone else.

Fact: Six mana burning Wizards can defete EVERY Kunark Dragon they can get to and that's unbalanced.

This post wassn't about the emotion of the Wizard class being wronged through the ages so now they deserve a "make it right" spell. --- It's about what has happened to the dymanics of the game with 6 Wizards being able to handle any 32K Kunark Dragon as a trivial encounter.

Before someone talks about how hard it is to get L60 and MB realize that SoL has been out for about 6 months and it would only take a little over two AAXP dings a month get Mana burn by now --- Not exactly a difficult task.

Let me leave you with this rant.

Manaburn Imbalance > Indoor Harmony
Manaburn Imbalance > Indoor SoW

MB devalues the game calling into question integrety as a result. VI works so hard at fixing every little gaff from pathing bugs to faction exploits, yet they lets this one go. That's wrong. It should be changed.

Lotharun

I have no doubt in my mind that a single well balanced group (of uber proportions) could kill 90% if not all K-Dwagons.

I would need to see that to believe it. The dmg rates on those mobs is just too great. A single cleric could not keep the tank (tanks) alive in a single group and themselves too.

Killing Gore is all about killing it fast. That is why MB works...all at once 32k of dmg ...dragon dies.

One group can't approach the dmg output to achieve this.

Maybe possible on the Fire dragons .... maybe...but that dot of Tal's kills more people than his melee and breath does. I don't htink a group coudl survive that.

Maybe if the toons were all 60, all in FOH or Afterlife or whatever (so had the uberest gear) and all had lots of aaxp. But until I hear about this being done by any other combo but wizzies I refuse to believe it is possible.

"Oh, and that Erude chick is on Freeport Militia faction, she hates my @#%$."

She is? My faction with the Freeport Militia cannot possibly get any worse, and she still sells to me. /shrug

On topic, there's not much that feels worse than having 40 people from your guild in SF waiting for Ragefire to spawn, then seeing first one, then two, then three, then four manaburn wizards from another guild show up in the zone, and being lurking around the spawn point. Sharks in the water was an apt description.

Murias Leafstorm
55th Preserver
Officer of Strange Brew
Druzzil Ro

The erudite vendor is on highpass merchant faction.

Eitherway, the bitch hates me. =/