View Full Forums : moonkin + ret pally in 2x2?

12-12-2007, 10:28 PM
Hi all, I have just started a 2x2 team with my moonkin and a ret pally. This is a bit of an unusual combo because both specs are not considered great for that bracket, but so far it looks really promising. The reason I am posting is 1) to see if anyone else has tried this combo, and 2) to gather tactics against different teams.

We played our 10 games for the week but only won against the following combos: priest/rogue, warlock/rogue, hunter/hunter. The rest of the games were pretty close except a warlock/sPriest and we identified most of our loses as errors in communication rather than anything else (plus the fact that all but 3 teams had warlocks in them). It is an interesting result because my friend has half holy/half ret gear atm, some of it green, but I am doing ok with all PvP epics except 4 slots.

From what i can see the pros of this combo are:
- paladin survivability is high making healing easier
- paladins gain mana when healed and your heals become a mana battery for them.
- shadow resist aura (works better than i expected)
- blessing of wisdom to help deal with 'outlasting' teams
- cleanse + abolish poison + remove curse covers pretty much every type of magic effect.
- blessing of protection makes rogues a walk in the park
- people think that the pally is holy and get confused when he attacks (probably won't last though).

The cons:
- both classes are fairly vulnerable to spell damage
- paladins are easily kited
- DPS is low especially if the druid has to heal
- vulnerable to mana drain teams

I would appreciate your thoughts on this.

12-13-2007, 06:12 AM
What's that paladin judgement, the one that stops people from running away? That can be really handy if you find you need to kite someone.. :>


Raging Epistaxis
12-13-2007, 12:17 PM
Seal Of Justice

Fills the Paladin with the spirit of justice for 30 seconds, giving each melee attack a chance to stun for 2 seconds. Only one Seal can be active on the Paladin at any one time. Unleashing this Seal's energy will judge an enemy for 20 seconds, preventing them from fleeing. Your melee strikes will refresh the spell's duration. Only one Judgement per Paladin can be active at any one time.

12-13-2007, 10:52 PM
Judgement of Justice, haven't had a chance to try this out against druids yet but if the druid is a healer, chances are they are not running with a dispel class and it would be a good way to stop the druid running and hiding/drinking. I don't know if we would have the DPS to kill a resto druid quickly though, I think against the druid/DPS combos we will just attack both and try to make the druid heal two people instead of one (pally on warrior/lock, me on druid kind of thing). A druid can't run from me anyway so JoJ would only come into play when the pally wants to attack the druid.

12-14-2007, 04:41 AM
JoJ is _extremely_ annoying for druids - it's the only movement impairing effect that shapeshifting doesn't break.
Blizzard will probably nerf it soon, though. And give it to druids instead.


12-26-2007, 11:09 PM
Are you sure that Judgement of justice actuallly works on players in pvp/duels? i have a level 40 pala and i haven't tried it.

12-27-2007, 02:05 AM
Are you sure that Judgement of justice actuallly works on players in pvp/duels? i have a level 40 pala and i haven't tried it. The effect of JoJ on players is a cap on their speed. The cap is 100% run speed. So if you're feral and can do 130% run speed in kitty form you're stuck at 100%. If a rogue tries to sprint they'll find themselves only doing normal run speed.

JoJ is further annoying if the paladin is Prot-specced. They have a talent called Stoicism that gives their spells - included the debuffs like JoJ they put on you - a 30% dispel resistance.

JoJ has been this way since 2.0 iirc. It's not a root or movement impairing effect; it's simply a cap on speed, in that it prevents people from moving faster than normal. It doesn't reduce your speed to less than normal, nor does it freeze you in place. It just pretty much guarantees that you or the paladin will die.

As such the likelihood of JoJ being nerfed is pretty much zero. Another reason is the opportunity-cost problem of using JoJ: pallys can only place one debuff on a target. Using JoJ means they can't use Judgement of the Crusader, or Wisdom, or Light. While they can still use Judgement of Righteousness/Command/Blood, those are pure damage Judgements (hence not debuffs) and more importantly the cooldown on Judgement is 10 seconds. IE, they're giving up the DPS of another JoR, or the DPS debuff of Crusader, to use JoJ.