Hi Guys,

I am now about half way through Northend (1 bar from 75) and I have noticed a scary trend in loot. All "rogue" gear seems to have a lot of haste on it. As a kitty this is a useless stat...isn't it?

As for Bear gear, well lets say its safe to say, there is no bear gear. Every "Tanking" item that drops seems to be over itemized with Block, Parry and Defense. Grr, give me Agi/Stam/Expertise!

The good news is we can easily tank dungeons in pure DPS gear, with a mostly DPS spec (dungeons are a joke) I have not hit a single level in WotLK, where I didn't have at least two gear upgrades from dungeon drops just waiting for me to be high enough to use them. This is a bit of a concern for me, only because I fear they over simplified WoW. I have run probably in the neighborhood of 25-35 dungeons in Northrend and not once used CC (highest dungeon run is VH).

Any reccomendations on where to find some good bear gear?

Please check out Feral gear here:
wow-loot.com

All "rogue" gear seems to have a lot of haste on it. As a kitty this is a useless stat...isn't it?Correct. It isn't too bad for bears, but nearly useless for cats.Every "Tanking" item that drops seems to be over itemized with Block, Parry and Defense. Grr, give me Agi/Stam/Expertise!Expect that to continue. Our non-set items slots will often be filled with gear that has +def on it and we really don't need it.I have run probably in the neighborhood of 25-35 dungeons in Northrend and not once used CC (highest dungeon run is VH).While I like not depending on CC, I do wish we needed it from time-to-time. I wonder what heroics will be like???

There are several blogs that contain gear lists...

http://wowthinktank.blogspot.com/ (about a month back)
http://www.unbearably.net/ ( a couple weeks ago??!?!)

and a list on the wow boards...

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/2/6791099676-wotlk-tank-gear-list--hcnormalreputation.html

Note: The above link points to a thread that has been moved. Just follow the links.

I wonder what heroics will be like???

My best guess is they will be similar to BC Heroics in that they are more or less the exact same mobs/builds just hitting much harder, dieing slower, with better loot tables. The big thing to notice here is that CC will likely be dependent on your healer. Your very mana efficient healers will likely be able to keep the tank up with all the mobs beating on them, but your less than excellent healers ::cough, PUG:: will most likely need a few mobs CC'd.

In a couple of my runs I helped off heal 5 man as feral (because our tank was so low he was taking crushing blows) and we managed to run without CC. So perhaps off heals will be the new substitute for CC since tanks can build such crazy aggro with ease???

I'm lvl 73 now and I haven't received any new gear for bear or cat, I hope this changes soon!

Windsaber
Malygos server

Anyone see any gear better then T5 or badge yet?

Windsaber
Malygos server

I have replaced a few items and I definatley have a few 75+ level req items that will be replacing my T5/badge content.

It seems 75 blues are >= T5/Badge gear. Its very hard to compare the two because of crazy different stats. For example the Tier Feral peices from BC are very well rounded with a good Str/Agi/Stam/Int/crit/hit...etc. The dungeon blues seem to have only 2-3 stats, but have them uber stacked. The new pants I will be replaceing my T5 with for example only have Agi/Stam/Crit. So I will lose Int, & hit, but gain 10-15 on each of the other stats (+ more armor)

Another thing to keep in mind is you DONT need to be hit capped. I have so many guildies passing up nice upgrades because they are worried about being hit capped. Old "hit cap" was calc'd figuring you are fighting elites 3 levels above you. That simply isn't the case for most people in WotLK. To be honest, I have certainly done just that, but its the exception, and not the norm. My advice, ignore hit until you are 78+ and entering raiding situations. If you have hit, great, if not...meh.

The new sweet staff is on a simple 2 man quest in Zul Drak. Its stupidlly easy to get and I'd encourage anyone level 74-75 just grab a friend, run to Zul Drak, find that quest and do it. its to kill and elite that's a cake walk and the staff is decently better than the one from badges.

I find dungeon blues are better. Greens are a struggle to find something better than Kara gear.

I'm only lvl 73 and I have replaced my bear boots (was clefhoof), cat boots (kara drop), cat back (some blue), a cat trinket and both cat rings just from doing quests in BT and quest rewards from a single Nexus. I have replaced several items in my healing kit from 2 UK and the one Nexus run. I have one quest left in BT and then I'm going to go to HF even though I know I could skip it.

Any one notice the lack of kill quests? I'm amazed at how many quests I can complete can barely kill a single mob. Sort of makes having rest XP worthless. I miss the days of kill 10 monkeys and 10 monkey shammies, followed by 10 uber monkeys and 10 uber monkey shammies.

The new sweet staff is on a simple 2 man quest in Zul Drak.

Also, as far as staves, I am not familiar with which staff you are talking about, however http://wowhead.com/?item=35649 is from run Violet Hold. This is a nice upgrade that can easily be obtained at 73-74.

Here it is: Staff of the Sorrowful Chieftan

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41987

That staff kicks the crap out of the Badge gear staff and its stupidly easy to get. At least it was for me on the Alliance side.

The quest is easy to find and with a feral druid really only requires two people. If you are level 74 give serious consideration to running over and picking this up with the help of a good friend.

I'm into heroics and i can say u WILL get alot of damage and at start a good healer will have to mana-reg every 2-4 mobgroups. when i first went into utgarde keep my healer had a really hard time.(he is not the most skilled one but it seemed difficult) he even pulled heal aggro sometimes cause of the massive damage from the start of the pull. (druid healer)

So lets start some nice gear-showing which i obtained so far:
My current-tanking-staff: Enraged Feral Staff (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37190) (heroic utgarde keep)
dps-staff: staff of trickery (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37883) (heroic violet hold)
My tanking/dps waist: Sharp-Barbed Leather Belt (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37194) (heroic utgarde keep)
tank/dps-chest: exotic leather tunic (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44405) (quest-reward from utgarde pinnacle)
tank-gloves: handwraps of preserved history (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44397)(quest in stratholme)
tank/dps-wrist: Advanced Tooled-Leather Bands (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37853) (heroic halls of lightning)
tank-ring: keystone great-ring (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37784) (drak'taron heroic)
dps-ring: bjarngrim family signet (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=36979) halls of lightning non-hero

these are my current item worth meantioning and really good feral items. the expertise helps big times with tanking as u will notice.
I'm at 27k hp selfbuffed in bear and have 24k armor with 33% dodge (yeah dodge sux right now but it will be getting better) and i can tank heroics fine right now (not easy but thats the good part)

So I am at 75 right now and the first chest upgrade I can see is from a lvl 77 quest. Doesn't it seem weird that a T4 chest would hold up so long? Did I miss an obvious upgrade along the way?

@Solar: yep there are not many:

chest from utgarde keep (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=35575) (better for threat generation and higher armor than T4)

quest in storm peak (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43207)

the only 2 until lvl 80 instances.

I've dinged 73, and I've replaced by Bloodlust Brooch with a green quest reward from BT... can't remember the name of it off the bat, and on my dps set, i've replaced my blue rogue shoulders with a blue quest reward in Coldarra... I'm still running around in my PvP gear burtsing stuff down though... AP, Crit rating, and Agility are what I'm concerned with, and I haven't seen anythinng better than my S2/S3/S4 gear

i'm happy to see this list, ty S3rgio.

i can link more 4 itens, two JC itens and two LW itens.

JC:
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=56497
not use def. but nice pre ring

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42646
with def., but defense keep giving dodge. &* )

LW:
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=60758
very nice shoulder! ; )

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43565
nice inicial back!

i'm glad to try a little conversation, and help!

@Naipaul:
the back is really nice. mass stam,str, dodge and exp.
the most important stats right now (except armor^^)
and the shoulders too

but both very expensive.

unfortunately i cannot see any of these items due to the firewall.

however i have noticed some nice crafted items appearing on the AH in the past 2 days.

Nerubhide Cloak - very nice looking druid item. was going for 2000g.
Trollwoven Shoulders - again very nice and 2000g.

plus something else i cannot rememeber.

maybe i'll start saving for when i am 80....

I just got those shoulders Khel, and farming the mats is pretty easy. I farmed what I could and bought the rest, I think I ended up at 200g + some farming time.

i'll be looking to do the same Oiy tbh, dont fancy paying 1500g+ for them if i can farm some mats.

depends on the mats ofc as i dont raid so if its stuff you get in raids i'm outta luck!

i'll be looking to do the same Oiy tbh, dont fancy paying 1500g+ for them if i can farm some mats.

depends on the mats ofc as i dont raid so if its stuff you get in raids i'm outta luck!

mats are no prob.
6 eternal fire
6 eternal shadow
1 frozen orb (u get them from heroics, like primal nether in BC)
6 Heavy Borean Leather (should not be expensive)

Yeah, farm fires in Storm Peaks, shadows in Wintergrasp, buy the orb for 60g and Heavy Borean for 12g on my server.

yeah more farming time for the 'new' motes of !!

not seen how much the orbs are going for but i suspect a lot more than 60g knowing prices on my server. people were charging 150-200g for their nethers to make you an item when they were first out.

the leather to was going for stupid money a week or so ago as i've had to forget levelling my LW for a while til i can afford to buy some. iirc it was 150g a stack ? !

Heavy Borean goes for about 20g a piece on our server atm. While Borean leather goes for about 20g a stack! Yes, leather workers (like myself) are rolling in the gold just buying the regular and selling the heavy!

hehe just replied to your post in my Profs thread.

how many regular make a heavy then ?

maybe i can but some and turn some around for a profit !! even nto being a skinner....

Well, only cause your not on my server can I share this classified info!

6x Borean Leather = 1 Heavy Borean

So if you have a LW friend, you get a 3+:1 ratio buying the raw product. So I basically go in each day and buy up all the borean that is <25g and make it Heavy.

You could make a decent profit up to 45g+ per stack on regular borean. The big risk is one day the market will correct itself, so I try to play it safe. I should have enough gold for my epic flight in a week or two. :)

cheers sol.

will have to try it tonite and see what the cheapest borean is going for.

@ other tank-droods:
i have a really big problem getting +hit gear for tanking.
there is just none which would be worth the loss of high amounts of armor.
will get better when the armor change comes.
but still.... we cant get any hit without loosing armor...

no T7-gear with +hit on it. i would really prefer +hit over the +haste on the gear.

what do you think?

indeed S3R - my current tank gear - still TBC stuff tbh as i'm levelling still has about zero hit on it.

i was assuming that it was to be found on gear that you raiding types got or the higher level tier items ! sounds like its not !

i agree with hit over haste.

k. found one cloak with 486 and 28 hit.
other than that, there is only a ring from Naxx-Hero which drops
of Saphirron.

Thats it.

PS: As i said, this is the current situation. With the change on the bear-multiplicator on items it wont be such a big loss to trade a neck with 350 Armor, to one with 150. Only 200 Armor lost. But right now it would be something like 800.

I will still be nervous about dropping trinks, rings and neck with armor for items w/o it. Those items can still be worth 1500 armor which is what, around 1% mitigation? If I was armor-capped for sure...but with me not even near the cap? I dunno...

We WILL need the armor-rings and stuff.
It just gives more flexibility on items without loosing a really high amount of armor.

Example:
Amulet of Autopsy (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39246) gives a nice boost on armor, but lacks +HIT.
Chained Military Gorget (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40679) gives hit and more dodge-mitigation but has no armor.
The 2nd one is really an option then, cause u will only loose 350 armor instead of 1810 now.

But swaping out all the +armor-pieces which dont get the multiplier would be a big mistake i think.
In my current gear it would be almost 2k armor. wouldnt want to loose that.

are there going to be some nice armour rings and trinkets then to make us want to keep them ?

ie some items with say 500-700 armour which then wont be muliplied but with enough armour to make it worthwhile using ?

as i dont see the real benefit in keeping using something with only 100-300 armour which wont be multiplied against another item that has nice other beneficial stats on it ?

Surely you could 'gain' a lot of other stats S3R for the armour loss....dodge / stam / agi etc?

@Kheldar:
if u have neck, rings and maybe the 550 armor trinket
then u get about 2k armor from those 4 items.
and on all those items i find dodge, def
so they boost my mitigation more then damage-things with agi and stuff and NO ARMOR.

And aggro-generation is fine right now. So i wont choose any items with crit, AP on it over items with dodge, def, armor

the good thing is, we will be able to off-tank in our kitty-gear without problems, cause the gap between tank-gear & kitty-gear wont be as big as it is now.

i see S3R. am not up on the newer nice armour items like the 550 armour trinket you mention.

if they have other good stats then great.

for me with my gear, when they introduce these changes then i'll be ditching a blue ring i still use (from Old Hillsbrad) as its 'only' got 170 armour iirc. and i will probably also replace my Badge of Tenacity /cry (bought for muchos money on the AH!) as i know i can find better through Wrath levelling let alone heroics....

Khel, you won't replace the Badge until you get the drop out of Heroic Gun'Drak, no worries. New badge trinket (forget the name atm) and Offering of Sacrifice from HGD is the best trinket combo you can run pre Naxx for tanking.

I bought the badge-trinket and am very dissapointed.
I hoped the use-effect is more an "o-****" button.
but it increases dodge only by 6% for the 20 secs. (cause of diminishing returns)
Thats why i'll stay with my alchi-stone. (75 stam/50 dodge).

Another Feral (DPS and tanking) pre-Naxx gear list...

http://teethandclaws.blogspot.com/2008/12/pre-naxx-feral-worksheet.html

Khel, you won't replace the Badge until you get the drop out of Heroic Gun'Drak, no worries. New badge trinket (forget the name atm) and Offering of Sacrifice from HGD is the best trinket combo you can run pre Naxx for tanking.
i would have expected to have gotten a 'better' trinket than the badge of tenacity before a heroic given some of the loot i'm seeing drop as i level ?

the badge is only good as long its getting the armour multiplier imho ?

and after talking about the blue ring with 170 armour i actually got a Green quest reward last night that was better.

trying to remember the stats and the quest.....i think it was from the quest in Drak where u have to kill a load of drakkari until 3 named mobs appear and u kill them and then loot their 'treausre' from a small box that appears - Chulo the Mad and 2 others ? it does not matter who kills the named NPC everyone/anyone can loot the treasure - ally and horde.

the ring has 308 armour and quite a lot of Str (circa 30?) and Stam (48?)

so this nicely replaced the blue one that came from old Hillsbrad. even without the armour multiplier in the near future its a nice ring for now.....til more instances/heroics.

oh and a question - what is the band of kirin tor on that list you linked to tlb that costs 8500g ?

i see S3R. am not up on the newer nice armour items like the 550 armour trinket you mention.

if they have other good stats then great.

for me with my gear, when they introduce these changes then i'll be ditching a blue ring i still use (from Old Hillsbrad) as its 'only' got 170 armour iirc. and i will probably also replace my Badge of Tenacity /cry (bought for muchos money on the AH!) as i know i can find better through Wrath levelling let alone heroics....

You're going to want the Keystone Great-Ring from Heroic Zul'drak and the Hemorrhaging Circle from Heroic Gundrak. Obviously the Circle doesn't have any armor, but I doubt you'll be disappointed.

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37784
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37642

i cant see any stats on wowhead etc via firewall but i was wondering how the ring listed on thinktank site compare to those from the heroics/badges ?

ie Titanium Earthguard Ring
Signet of Impenetrable Fortress
Titanium Impact Band
Ring of Earthen Might
Band of the Kirin Tor - the cash purchase one ?


From looking at the lists recently it appears there are some nice BEO craftables in Wrath compared to TBC for most slots ?

i cant see any stats on wowhead etc via firewall but i was wondering how the ring listed on thinktank site compare to those from the heroics/badges ?

ie Titanium Earthguard Ring
Signet of Impenetrable Fortress
Titanium Impact Band
Ring of Earthen Might
Band of the Kirin Tor - the cash purchase one ?


From looking at the lists recently it appears there are some nice BEO craftables in Wrath compared to TBC for most slots ?

The two rings I've listed rank higher than any other BoE save the Titanium Earthguard Ring (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42643). This is, of course, if you're still talking Pre-Naxx. I haven't even been able to get that one crafted; you need four Dragon's Eyes and they're only obtainable via a JC using their daily award to purchase. Thus, I'm seeing them go for over 600 gold each on my realm.

Additionally, the nice thing about getting your paws on the Hemorrhaging Circle means that you can likely use it to double in a DPS slot. I am, of course, talking about tanking rings.

well as i mentioned i cannot see anything on the likes of wowhead etc.

certainly the high level new epics that i see on the AH, ie stuff around iLevel 200+ are going for generally rather high money.

seen some weapons mainly to fate - guns and stuff and most are 4000g !

well as i mentioned i cannot see anything on the likes of wowhead etc.

certainly the high level new epics that i see on the AH, ie stuff around iLevel 200+ are going for generally rather high money.

seen some weapons mainly to fate - guns and stuff and most are 4000g !

Just wanted to say Khel, you're going to love the new heroics. They all have a raid feel to them, without requiring a raiding time commitment. And you'll end up very nicely geared to pug Naxx, should the opportunity ever arise for you.

waht sort of time do they take to complete the 5 man heroics Oiy ?

1 hr ? 2 ?

i'm going to look for a few items at 80 that are crafted i reckon to get me started...

Nerubhide Cloak
Trollwoven - 2 items ?

waht sort of time do they take to complete the 5 man heroics Oiy ?

1 hr ? 2 ?

Assuming a good group, once you know the fights and get some gear they can be done in a hour or less. While learning it may take two hours. Also depends on if you full clear for rep or not.

Nerubhide and Trollwoven mats actually aren't too bad. The difficult part is find a LW who has commited enough resources to be able to craft them. The point to get from 425-440 in LW are BRUTAL. It seems this is the case with most professions though. The Mats are very very expensive atm.

As for the feel of new heroics...well, I guess I need to appoligize to blizzard. I thought they dumbed down everything in order to make the heroics "casual friendly", but I was very wrong. Heroics can be very easy with a well educated / intellegent group, but they can be brutal if just one person isn't paying attention. They have a very "ZA" feel to them for me. When everyone is doing their job, you can clear one in full blues without a death, but you cannot have one person doing something wrong and simply over power the instance with epics. Skill>Gear is very very true now.

Assuming a good group, once you know the fights and get some gear they can be done in a hour or less. While learning it may take two hours. Also depends on if you full clear for rep or not.
cheers Oiy.

hopefully we'll concentrate on a couple to start to learn then and get good rep gains from them using thetabard idea which is good :)

i expect we will simply aim to clear the bosses rather than full mob clear for rep as that will be easier for me on limited time and get us the badges still.


Nerubhide and Trollwoven mats actually aren't too bad. The difficult part is find a LW who has commited enough resources to be able to craft them. The point to get from 425-440 in LW are BRUTAL. It seems this is the case with most professions though. The Mats are very very expensive atm.

As for the feel of new heroics...well, I guess I need to appoligize to blizzard.
yeah i've already seen the trollwoven items on our AH so i know 2 people who can make them.

they require a lot of Eternals which are pretty damned expensive on my server so i guess i will need to specifically farm the ones needed.

and an orb is about 250g. but very nice items.

hoping to get both soon after 80, +the cape.

then look for legs / chest /boots i have to say that on looking last night i'm quite impressed with couple of blue LW crafted boots - Black Chitinous Boots and Jormscale Footpads. Mats are not to bad and for blues they are pretty good. although i'm sure the badge ones and maybe even some in heroics will be much better.

The Heroic Boss drops are slightly better than the top end crafted rares. The crafted epics however are for the most part as good as it gets until you are in Naxx. I finally got LW +440 last night so I can now make Trollwoven and the capes. I spent about 1500g last night to get 5 F'ing point in LW to get up to 440 and then make my trollwoven pieces.

The frozen orbs are pricing but pretty easy to get. You more or less have a 20% shot to get one each time you run a heroic. I had 3 ready when I hit 440LW, so that helped to keep cost down a bit. Eternals are rediculous right now.

well i wont be going to Naax so as for me in BC its going to be a combination of crafted / heroic drops and badge rewards.

1500g to get 5 points ! what on earth were you buying!


i made myself a set of the jormscale footpads yesterday. very nice for a blue and replaced a BC purple ! (that cost me a fortune!)

Mats will come along the way.
I have 13 Frozen Orbs on my bank right now, cause im farming heroics pretty much now. (have all tank/dps items from emblems and only one missing for my heal-gear ^^)

And the eternal are really easy to grind. I made 6 eternal fire in 1 hour 30 mins the last day. And all the eternals have such high drop-rate. At least Earth and Water too. Shadow it takes a little longer. I think 4 eternals in the same time as for fire.
Where to find them:
Fire: On the east-end of the map in Storm Peak!
Earth: On the east-side of Storm Peak. Same height as fire just not so far right.
Water: In and around the lakes in West-Wintergrasp.
Shadow: In the south-west-corner of Wintergrasp.
Air: Don't know. Didn't bother unti now^^

jeez S3R ! it will take me a month of sundays to rack up badges for new legs/chest/head/idol/ring etc as I did from BC BoJ.

I will have to scout of the areas you mention for some eternal farming for my Trollwoven items and Nerubhide Cloak.

1500g to get 5 points ! what on earth were you buying!


Arctic furs....going for around 100g on our server.

Also note, I wasn't just making the minimum item to get a point, I was trying for items that I would use or could sell. (Made lots of armor kits)

a guildly is doing ok on levelling his LW - was near 430 iirc last night.....

what level does he need to be for the trollwoven patterns ? (i assume these are vendor purchasable?)

is the nerubhide cloak one a drop? or rep ?

All the good epics are LW skill 440.

Yes, all are vendor bought or trained.

a guildly is doing ok on levelling his LW - was near 430 iirc last night.....

what level does he need to be for the trollwoven patterns ? (i assume these are vendor purchasable?)

is the nerubhide cloak one a drop? or rep ?

Nerubhide Cloak is crafted through leather working. I believe the mats are 1 frozen orb, 2 arctic furs, 40 nerubian chitin.

indeed Sy, as mentioned elsewhere i got my Nerubhide cloak last night :)

150g for an orb
150g for 2 furs
free chitin so far from a guildy til we work out a price or a swap deal !

Better than the 1200-1400g they are on AH for.