Hello.

I only raid as kitty when going through farm content or pugs so my knowledge about kitty dps could be somewhat better.
Im searching the web for some info about ArP vs agi but cant find what im looking for. Some pages says this and others says that.

My real question are:
At what numbers should i begin to stack Arp? The numbers i've read differs from 200 to 400 on when to start gem for more.
Currently sitting at 290ish ArP, but need to experiment more with this i feel.

Anyone here who knows?

//Nhex

You're sitting right at the point where it's a wash. If you aren't a serious progression raider I wouldn't bother tbh. The difference isn't huge even at very high gear levels.

Plus you lose a great deal of utility with any gear you gem that way as ArPen is useless for bear.

I still go for agi as the primary concren on my dps set. IfI'm not losing any agi, and adding ArP, then i'll go for it. My fairly simple reasoning is that i love critting to build Cp's quickly, and i want my Rip ticks to crit as much as possible.
I'm floating somewhere around 60% chance to crit raid buffed, and my ArP is right at 199 atm /shrug

Ty for replies. Seems i will go for agi in gems if i need to pick up a loose add or something like that.

My stats w MotW is around 7100ap-50,50%crit-280ish hit-and 290ish ArP. oh and only 23 expertise so miss 3 to softcap :S
As for gear I only use t8 gloves in both bear/cat gear. Rest is completley different.
Find myself running as cat more and more often and find it so fun. Hard rotation but once you get the hang of it, cats do some serious dps.
Also read somwhere about ppl often forget Kings in this.

Again ty for clearing this out 8)

//Nhex

Speaking of Cat rotation, what is the best rotation for max dps?

Please type full names for the rotation if possible, sorry I've always tanked in bear and know nothing on how to get max dps.
I have good gear for cat but when I try to dps I get around 2500 best. I know I could alot more because I have good gear (T8 and 7.5....)

Thanks for this noobie dps cat, Lol

I get teased sometimes about my dps, I'm spec all bear though.

Windsaber

It's not really a "rotation" per se... more like "spinning plates"... i'll explain:

I start with Mangle, and rake, then shred to 5 Combo Points and hit Savage Roar. Once i have that up, i hit Berzerk, refresh Mangle and Rake, and Shred to 5 CP's again and Rip. With Berzerk still up, I can shred as my primary yellow attack, but not let Mangle or Rake drop off, and then Bite. Berzerk should still be up to allow more CP's. I get them to 5 again and refresh Savage Roar, then pop Tiger's Fury. At that point, it becomes "don't let (fill in the blank) drop off" (Savage Roar, rake, Mangle or Rip), again using Shred as my primary yellow attack.

Some people like to get Savage Roar up as soon as possible, since it buffs all your attacks and bleeds. I personally like to keep it simple. If it comes to a point where someone is complaining about my dps, i'll tweak my priorities a little. I just like using the CD on Tiger's Fury as my "meter" for refreshing Savage Roar.

Hope that helps.

If you're all bear spec, that's going to make a BIG difference. I ran a 5 man with a druid who was similiarly geared, but was suffering from the BC mindset (you know, hanging on to old ways having a little bear, a little cat, a little resto) and our dps was at opposite ends of the spectrum. I was at the top, and he was below the tank. Are you healing as your second spec Windsaber?

No I'm not duel spec, I tank almost 100% of the time so I'm pure tank spec.
Rarely do I DPS or should say try to and I get teased,lol
Just wanted to get the rotation down so at least it would be a little better.

I believe in cat gear and raid buffed I'm over 7200 ap and high crit, shamefull my dps is so noobie, Lol
Thanks

dude, my suggestion is get dual spec and go pure kitty for that second spec. you WILL have a blast. i promise! heck, i've stopped tanking completely pretty much since WotLK released. with a few pure damage talents, it'll make a substantial impact on your dps... the laughs will stop!

If you're not against using addons as temporary training crutches, BadKitty (http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/badkitty.aspx) was a big help for me when I first picked up a kitty offspec.

Plus you lose a great deal of utility with any gear you gem that way as ArPen is useless for bear.

Why do you say its useless? I realize there are other stats that would be more important, but I beg to differ in the "Useless" ideology.

I actually have an armor pen set for my tanking. I know...your thinking...noob.

Heres the logic: Badges drop by the pile in content that is way below my gear level. By building an armor pen set, I can effectivley tank and DPS at the same time. I am way way past the point of diminishing returns on agi, and staming past 40k for <i219 content is just silly.

With my armor pen set on I sit at about 35k HP, +25% pen. Base dodge is ~40% and armor around 28k(65% reduction).

With my armor pen set on, I do ~3k DPS consistently in bear form. I am lucky to break 2k overall DPS in my full bear set. (Which is mostly the same gear, gemmed and enchanted with agi/stam) The moral of the story, is in heroics, which my guild and friends now farm relentlessly, I can keep threat over folks who are pully +5k DPS consisently. They never need to hold back DPS, and I get to contribute. I have run many alt groups through ToC based almost solely on my ability to toss some extra DPS into the mix and get things dead. So I think its not useless, just situational.

On a side note: Its also a blast in PvP. Very few things as satisfying as stun locking a rogue and 3 shotting him....pay back's a b@#ch!

If you go by min-maxing, ArP is useless for a bear. You would never wear that kind of set for progression raiding. If you're doing heroics then yes, whatever floats your boat.

But tanks shouldn't be worried about their DPS. I mean I out DPS half our guild in heroics with overall damage because I just spam swipe the entire time endless and don't have to worry about mana/energy/rage so my effective DPS time is a lot higher. But on an actual boss fight they'll blow me out of the water.

If you are looking for threat pieces, gemming for ArP is not going to make or break that and there is no reason for a bear to make a set gemmed with ArP solely for threat when you can just use cat pieces. I believe that's what they meant for useless for the essence of a bear.

To the OP: At about 350ArP rating, it becomes more useful to gem for ArP for cat at the moment until they nerf ArP. Unlike every other stat in the game which scales linearly, ArP scales proportionally.

So at around 100-200 ArP, 16/20 agility will be worth more DPS than 16 ArP.

But by 350 arP rating, that extra 16/20 has more value. Basically the more ArP you get the better, but you shouldn't nerf your crit rating. You should always be at least above 50% crit.